Speaking in tongues

[woodpecker]

Hi, I am interested in the Lutheran beliefs, I received the gift of tongues that edifyes me, a prayer language that only God can understand, it is not for the church, which apostle Paul speaks of in 1 Corintians 14.

If your church teaches these gifts have ceased, I would not consider seeking further.

Thanks

 

[DaRev]

The gift of tongues is the ability to miraculously speak in another language, given to edify the Church, not the individual. Read 1 Corinthians 14. St. Paul rebukes those who bring glory to themselves by misusing this gift of the Spirit.
This gift was given to bring the Good News to the people who would otherwise be unable to hear it. It was given at Pentecost to bring the great works of God in Christ to the attention of all the foreigners in Jerusalem (read Acts 2).
Although we never say that a gift of the Spirit is not given, there is not much reason for the gift of tongues in today's world as the proclamation of the Gospel is done in practically every known language.
Anyone who claims to have this gift to bring glory to themselves is speaking in opposition to the word of God.

 

[woodpecker]

DaRev.,

You are speaking against the Holy Spirit and the teaching of Apostle Paul. Paul wished every believer spoke in tongues, but not all do, he went on to say if you seek a gift, ask for prophecy, but he wished all could pray in tongues.

Apostle Paul who was inspired by the Holy Spirit instructed the church to not use their gift of tongues unless someone could interpret the tongue in order of 3's to edify the church....but Paul also speaks of a tongue given to some believers for their edification

"14: 2 For one who speaks in a tongue does not speak to men but to God; for no one ]understands, but in his spirit he speaks mysteries.
4 One who speaks in a tongue edifies himself; but one who prophesies edifies the church. 5 Now I wish that you all spoke in tongues, but even more that you would prophesy; and greater is one who prophesies than one who speaks in tongues, unless he interprets, so that the church may receive edifying.

14 For if I pray in a tongue, my spirit prays, but my mind is unfruitful. 15 What is the outcome then? I will pray with the spirit and I will pray with the mind also; I will sing with the spirit and I will sing with the mind also.

18 I thank God, I speak in tongues more than you all

Written by the apostle Paul, to the Corinthian church, 1 Corinth 14
......
I guess I will not be joining the Lutheran church for they teach against the bible. Sad, because I really liked what I have seen and read, then I ran across a Lutheran that did not believe all the gifts are for today....God does not change, it is the same Holy Spirit that indwells me as did Paul.

 

[Moses Medina]

DaRev.,

You are speaking against the Holy Spirit and the teaching of Apostle Paul. Paul wished every believer spoke in tongues, but not all do, he went on to say if you seek a gift, ask for prophecy, but he wished all could pray in tongues.

Apostle Paul who was inspired by the Holy Spirit instructed the church to not use their gift of tongues unless someone could interpret the tongue in order of 3's to edify the church....but Paul also speaks of a tongue given to some believers for their edification

"14: 2 For one who speaks in a tongue does not speak to men but to God; for no one ]understands, but in his spirit he speaks mysteries.
4 One who speaks in a tongue edifies himself; but one who prophesies edifies the church. 5 Now I wish that you all spoke in tongues, but even more that you would prophesy; and greater is one who prophesies than one who speaks in tongues, unless he interprets, so that the church may receive edifying.

14 For if I pray in a tongue, my spirit prays, but my mind is unfruitful. 15 What is the outcome then? I will pray with the spirit and I will pray with the mind also; I will sing with the spirit and I will sing with the mind also.

18 I thank God, I speak in tongues more than you all

Written by the apostle Paul, to the Corinthian church, 1 Corinth 14
......
I guess I will not be joining the Lutheran church for they teach against the bible. Sad, because I really liked what I have seen and read, then I ran across a Lutheran that did not believe all the gifts are for today....God does not change, it is the same Holy Spirit that indwells me as did Paul.

Read over clearly what daRev has given you. Also remember that speaking in tongues as you see it started in the early 1900s and is identicle to what can be found in some pagan religions. History amd the word of God say otherwise to what you have said.

 

[DaRev]

DaRev.,

You are speaking against the Holy Spirit and the teaching of Apostle Paul. Paul wished every believer spoke in tongues, but not all do, he went on to say if you seek a gift, ask for prophecy, but he wished all could pray in tongues.

Apostle Paul who was inspired by the Holy Spirit instructed the church to not use their gift of tongues unless someone could interpret the tongue in order of 3's to edify the church....but Paul also speaks of a tongue given to some believers for their edification

"14: 2 For one who speaks in a tongue does not speak to men but to God; for no one ]understands, but in his spirit he speaks mysteries.
4 One who speaks in a tongue edifies himself; but one who prophesies edifies the church. 5 Now I wish that you all spoke in tongues, but even more that you would prophesy; and greater is one who prophesies than one who speaks in tongues, unless he interprets, so that the church may receive edifying.

14 For if I pray in a tongue, my spirit prays, but my mind is unfruitful. 15 What is the outcome then? I will pray with the spirit and I will pray with the mind also; I will sing with the spirit and I will sing with the mind also.

18 I thank God, I speak in tongues more than you all

Written by the apostle Paul, to the Corinthian church, 1 Corinth 14
......

I suggest you re-read the Scriptures teachings regarding gifts of the Spirit in the proper context. Paul wished that all could speak in tongues so that the Gospel would be proclaimed throughout the world. The gifts are given to build up the Church, not to bring glory on oneself. Those who believe so contradict the clear word of God.

I guess I will not be joining the Lutheran church for they teach against the bible. Sad, because I really liked what I have seen and read, then I ran across a Lutheran that did not believe all the gifts are for today....God does not change, it is the same Holy Spirit that indwells me as did Paul.

You are right that God does not change. This tongue speaking of which you speak is a new innovation to the Church. In other words, it is a change from what God clearly teaches us in His word. The Confessional Lutheran Church is the closest to the true Biblical faith that exists on earth today. You will not find a church that is closer to teaching the Bible than Confessional Lutheranism.

 

[Lupinus]

Speaking in tongues was Gods way of ensuring all could hear the word.

You don't need God to speak gibberish no one can understand.

 

[Moses Medina]

Speaking in tongues was Gods way of ensuring all could hear the word.

You don't need God to speak gibberish no one can understand.

Well said.

 

[Mediaeval]

While I would not put limits on God, my impression from the NT is that sign-gifts like tongues were not bestowed unless an apostle was present, as Paul wrote in Romans 1:11, "For I long to see you, that I may impart unto you some spiritual gift." Since the original apostles all fell asleep long ago, it would seem there is no one around any longer to impart those gifts. Or have I missed something?

 

[woodpecker]

Speaking in tongues was Gods way of ensuring all could hear the word.

You don't need God to speak gibberish no one can understand.

Be careful, you may be blaspheming the Holy Spirit by calling His spiritual language "gibberish".

Many Christians, myself included pray in a spiritual language that Apostle Paul teaches only God can understand, and is not for edification of the church, but the believer.

Do not make sarcastic comments about the gifts of the Holy Spirit, that is a great sin. I use do the same until I was blessed with such a gift.

 

[alexnbethmom]

do not come into our forum and tell us what to do - you are in violation of the rules of the forum.

 

[alexnbethmom]

the gift of speaking in tongues was to speak in a language (a REAL language) that was not your native tongue and not a language you had ever been taught - so that those who spoke that particular language could hear the Gospel.

not speaking in gibberish that nobody can understand.

 

[Moses Medina]

the gift of speaking in tongues was to speak in a language (a REAL language) that was not your native tongue and not a language you had ever been taught - so that those who spoke that particular language could hear the Gospel.

not speaking in gibberish that nobody can understand.

If I may add again, what is known as speaking in tongues today didn't start until the 1900s... and it looks just like what some enlightened buddhists would do. Anyone feel free to corrwct me.

You speak in tongues... I can not deny your experience... but your experience can deny scripture

 

[DaRev]

Many Christians, myself included pray in a spiritual language that Apostle Paul teaches only God can understand, and is not for edification of the church, but the believer.

Do not make sarcastic comments about the gifts of the Holy Spirit, that is a great sin. I use do the same until I was blessed with such a gift.

What St. Paul taught is that the gifts of the Spirit are given for the edification of the Church. He rebuked those who use the gift to bring glory to themselves, as you are doing. If you have a gift that you are using for your own glory, you are doing so in opposition to the clear word of God. You need to be careful about accusing people of committing "a great sin" when you are incorrect about what the word teaches us.

 

[Lupinus]

Be careful, you may be blaspheming the Holy Spirit by calling His spiritual language "gibberish".

Many Christians, myself included pray in a spiritual language that Apostle Paul teaches only God can understand, and is not for edification of the church, but the believer.

Do not make sarcastic comments about the gifts of the Holy Spirit, that is a great sin. I use do the same until I was blessed with such a gift.

You may want to try taking some of your own advice there.

Many Christians also feel abortion is fine, there is salvation outside of the church, and other perversions of scripture to justify their personal beliefs.

 

[woodpecker]

As for breaking rules....I came with a question, I have been attending a Lutheran service, and have been studying the history of infant baptism, reading that it was done as far back as 180AD, the bible is not clear on this topic, but I was willing to consider....so then I wanted to know is the church open to such gifts as tongues.

*staff edit*
......

Apostle Paul:

For one who speaks in a tongue does not speak to men but to God; for no one understands, but in his spirit he speaks mysteries

Therefore let one who speaks in a tongue pray that he may interpret.

For if I pray in a tongue, my spirit prays, but my mind is unfruitful. 15 What is the outcome then? I will pray with the spirit and I will pray with the mind also; I will sing with the spirit and I will sing with the mind also.

Otherwise if you bless in the spirit only, how will the one who fills the place of the ungifted say the “Amen” at your giving of thanks, since he does not know what you are saying?

For you are giving thanks well enough, but the other person is not edified.

i thank God, I speak in tongues more than you all; however, in the church I desire to speak five words with my mind so that I may instruct others also, rather than ten thousand words in a tongue.

From 1 Corinthians 14

 

[cerette]

Of course the church is open to the gift of tongues. That is, the gift of tongues as described in the Bible. I personally have not met a person who has that gift, but I wouldn't say that it is impossible.
The sort of "tongues" they do in many churches today is NOT the kind described in the Bible, so that sort of thing would probably not be found in a Bible believing Lutheran church. But it is false to say that Lutherans aren't open to the gift of tongues just cuz we don't do the "tongues" that many others do.

 

[Lupinus]

We're not closed minded at all. To a biblical gift of tongues. When you don't speak someone's language, and they don't speak yours, but they still understand the gospel THAT is the gift of tongues. You provided your own example of a biblical example with the African woman you mentioned.

But, again, speaking random incomprehensible gibberish is not a biblical example of speaking in tongues. It's speaking in gibberish and raising yourself up.

 

[DaRev]

I find it somewhat amusing that you come into the Lutheran forum and accuse us of blasphemy while bringing glory onto yourself, in defiance to the word of God. You then quote the very passage from St. Paul that speaks against what you are claiming, trying to use it to prove your point. It clearly demonstrates that you don't clearly understand what Scripture teaches. St. Paul is CLEARLY teaching us that the gifts of the Spirit are for the edification of the Church and NOT to bring glory upon oneself.

We will certainly pray for you that you will come to understand God's teaching correctly.

 

[ThisEbenezer]

..so then I wanted to know is the church open to such gifts as tongues.

Only you can be sure if you have received a gift of tongues from God. All of us here can point you to scripture and help you understand what the Bible says about the gifts, but only you know for sure what gift you have been given.

If you feel you have the gift of tongues, I applaud you as it is rare especially in the sense that you describe it. I feel most people with the gift of tongues have the uncanny ability to learn, speak, and understand languages not their own with the greatest of ease and can use this gift to spread God's Word.

Take what the Bible says about the gift of tongues and meditate on it. Remember that the gifts were given to us to serve the Body of Christ. Your gift is indeed rare and it will be a challenge for you to find a way to use the gift in the Church. Seek earnestly that you are given the opportunity to use the gift in this manner. Pray for that illumination. I hope to read about your success in this quest.

God Bless
Ebenezer

 

[MarkRohfrietsch]

Of course the church is open to the gift of tongues. That is, the gift of tongues as described in the Bible. I personally have not met a person who has that gift, but I wouldn't say that it is impossible.
The sort of "tongues" they do in many churches today is NOT the kind described in the Bible, so that sort of thing would probably not be found in a Bible believing Lutheran church. But it is false to say that Lutherans aren't open to the gift of tongues just cuz we don't do the "tongues" that many others do.

I believe that the Holy Spirit is still at work, and that the Church still has the gift of "tongues"; the Bible is being translated into many languages, the Gospel continues to spread throughout the world; missionaries learn languages and teach; those who teach spread the Word, often in other dialects.

This is what the gift of tongues does, it is not some self-centred thing that is designed to draw attention and say "look at me, I'm so good that God gave me a special gift".

Our Lord Jesus Christ seemed to always be rebuking the Pharisees for their "look at me" approach to religion; and the Pharisees were always angry with Christ for doing so.

If one wants something secret and special, they can try the Masonic Lodge; that will do about as much good for their soul as speaking in gibberish.