Sometimes It Seems Impossible - Ministers

[aReformedPatriot]

1 Timothy 3:2 Therefore an overseer must be above reproach

Brothers, what does this mean? Must I be perfect? Common sense tells me No, thats not what its saying. "I do the things I hate." Yet there is part of me, that when I sin I look upon this as an impossible call. I become ashamed (a good thing, a holy conviction) yet it is frustrating sometimes. Our good Lord is calling me into the ministry, and to be honest, sometimes I laugh, and say: "Lord, surley there is someone better than I." Yet, as someone stated in another thread, the Lord's hand is tipped in favor of the underdogs.

But what is this saying?

 

[daveleau]

Well, we all know that no one can be sinless, as the only sinless was Christ. But, we are to appear above sin to the congregation. We are not to have a sordid past that affects our reputation today. We are to abstain from the appearance of sin and be conscious of sin at all times.

God bless,
Dave

 

[Sword-In-Hand]

We are not to have a sordid past that affects our reputation today.

I would kind of have to disagree with that statement as our pastor used to be a drug dealer/addict. Use your past as something that God lifted you out of (Psalm 40), use it for His glory. Just live a life, where if people point fingers and they will, that they have no ground or proof for their words. You wouldn't believe what our pastor has to put up with, but nothing ever holds ground because he lives life above reproach. I'll pray for you my friend. Just don't run from God's calling. Disobdience is a bad thing as you probably know. And of course there are others better, every calling faces that, but keep trudging because God still wanted you to be in His ministry with the very best.

Please the Lord first, worry about us later.

 

[Gwenyfur]

I'm not a pastor, but I do work in ministry. I'm a pianist and a stage director for our youth drama troupe.

I spent 14 years as a pagan, purposefully shaking my fist in the face of God. And yet He lifted me out of it, loved me, saved me, and healed my wounded heart. Now He uses that testimony of what He's done in my life in ways I would have never imagined or dreamed of.

I've done many things in my past that I can freely admit now, through God's grace I'm free of. But today He uses those things for me to help the kids I work with, who in school are on the front lines of spiritual battle with paganism and well anything anti-God.

I *know* in my heart of hearts that the passage you quote is a passage that applies to your life *after* your moment of salvation. What happened before God doesn't remember, only you do...and He will lead you to use those memories to help another.

Just my, well, more than 2 cents LOL

 

[newlite]

I *know* in my heart of hearts that the passage you quote is a passage that applies to your life *after* your moment of salvation. What happened before God doesn't remember, only you do...and He will lead you to use those memories to help another.

Blue - So after the moment of salvation you have to be more then perfect? im a christain now, im far from perfect. does that mean im not really and havent passed the moment of salvation? [just becuase i dont quite get all those terms salvation is went you believe in jesus right and follow?]

Red - it says god know everything. he knows when you'll die before your born and the choices you make before then. god doesnt remember? he forgets? if he forgets stuff does he really remember/know everything? doesnt he just forgive and move on, knowing your past but kinda leaving it out or whatever...?

Orange - well i thikn i have a pretty good memery [well bad but could be used for good...um...yah]. does he really lead you? cuz right now im lost and want to help but im...lost...whatever...it cant be translated from my head to english. i want to help but that same stupid brink wall is always there...

But, we are to appear above sin to the congregation.

i dont get this. above sin like non sinner/perfect/goodish? congregation like other people? arent we supose to confess are sins to other. like not keep them hiding...?

 

[aReformedPatriot]

Red - it says god know everything. he knows when you'll die before your born and the choices you make before then. god doesnt remember? he forgets? if he forgets stuff does he really remember/know everything? doesnt he just forgive and move on, knowing your past but kinda leaving it out or whatever...?

[bible]Hebrews 8:12[/bible]

And:

[bible]Hebrews 10:17[/bible]

It appears God chooses to forget on his own. Forgiveness is divine

 

[Gwenyfur]

Blue - So after the moment of salvation you have to be more then perfect? im a christain now, im far from perfect. does that mean im not really and havent passed the moment of salvation? [just becuase i dont quite get all those terms salvation is went you believe in jesus right and follow?]

Red - it says god know everything. he knows when you'll die before your born and the choices you make before then. god doesnt remember? he forgets? if he forgets stuff does he really remember/know everything? doesnt he just forgive and move on, knowing your past but kinda leaving it out or whatever...?

Orange - well i thikn i have a pretty good memery [well bad but could be used for good...um...yah]. does he really lead you? cuz right now im lost and want to help but im...lost...whatever...it cant be translated from my head to english. i want to help but that same stupid brink wall is always there...


i dont get this. above sin like non sinner/perfect/goodish? congregation like other people? arent we supose to confess are sins to other. like not keep them hiding...?

Somehow, I knew I'd bungled that post heh.

No never doubt your salvation! Even I stumble and fall flat on my face every now and again. We will never be perfect. Only Jesus Christ has that. As Christians, we are to strive to be "Christ-like". To live by His instructions and will.

Romans 14:7-9
"For none of us liveth unto himself, and no man dieth to himself. For whether we live, we live unto the Lord; and whether we die, we die unto the Lord: whether we live therefore, or die, we are the Lord's. For tho this end Christ both died, and rose, and revived, that he might be Lord both of the dead and living."

After we are saved we are to walk in His light and His spirit.

Ephesians 4:1-3
"I Therefore, the prisoner of the Lord, beseech you that ye walk worthy of the vocation wherewith ye are called. With all lowliness and meekness, with longsuffering, forbearing one another in love; Endeavouring to keep the unity of the Spirit in the bond of peace."

Yes God does know everything. What I meant and should have made more clear is the completeness of our forgiveness.
Psalm 103:12-14
"As far as the east is from the west, so far hath he removed our transgressions from us. Like as a father pitieth his children, so the Lord pitieth them that fear him. For he knoweth our frame; he remembereth that we are dust."

Yes He does. In ways I cannot imagine would happen. The leading comes at odd times and places and usually when I least expect it. Ironically it's how I became our church's pianist. Mind you after not playing for almost 10 years! I find that guidance becomes more clear the more time I spend studying His Word, and in prayer. No I don't hear voices...I just *feel* led. Every time I've followed I've been blessed in being able to help bless another in some small way. That's the wonder of it all. How much you gain in knowledge and closeness with Him, just by following where He leads.

God can tear down that brick wall you're at, I've been there. Just keep praying. No matter how trite it sounds keep praying. If you don't know what to pray in your frustration, open up the Psalms and make one of those your prayer.

Thanks for making me pray and think on this...I really didn't mean to confuse...
Sorry

 

[newlite]

you didnt. i just...i cant explain it. so i just wouldnt try...

god says if you what something or something you need to try, met him halfway. you cant just pray god to do something and expect him to without doing nothing. but what happens if you cant? what happens if for some reason you just ... cant? that fricken brink wall that you cant distroy. its stronger then me. i can over come it...or sometimes i jus dont want to...i dont know why...

and i try to read my bible. but its not written in english. i cant understand it. all the thys and whatever **** that i cant comprehend and words i never heard of. i dont get it. and normally reading it make life seem more depressing. im trying to keep a list of versus that are...em...happy? but it doesnt i dont know feel right.

im just saying the same things ive said for the past three months. im off topic and whatever...;.vfgb.l.,sdagf;.oipoiu d asraeh her h

 

[Gwenyfur]

you cant just pray god to do something and expect him to without doing nothing. but what happens if you cant?

Yes, you can. That's what submitting to His will is all about. You find His will and strength at the end of yourself. At that point where you say "Lord, I don't know what to do or how to do it. Guide me, please, fix this (or me) so that I can do your will." The same as you did when you called out to Him for your salvation. Even the act of calling out and *believing* that He will take care of it. That's all He asks...that you have *faith* in what He is capable of.

Why in the world would we doubt He could take care of us, when He *spoke* and brought the universe into being.

If you're in a trial and don't know how to handle it, remember that it was in the fire that Shadrach, Meshach, and Abedniggo met the Lord Jesus.

1Peter1:6-9
"Wherein ye greatly rejoice, though now for a season, if need be, ye are in heaviness though manifold trials: That the trial of your faith, being much more precious than gold that perisheth, though it be tried with fire, might be found unto praise and honour and glory at the appearing of Jesus Christ; Whom having not seen, ye love in believeing , ye rejoice with joy unspeakable and full of glory; Receving the end of your faith, even the salvation of your souls."

There are trials, and there will be times when we absolutely have no clue even how to pray...when those times come, rejoice in your salvation, find the joy you had when Jesus first saved your soul. Then pray, telling Him of your joy at being His child, and of your trial. He will meet you there.

Half way is a term of our limited human thinking.

God meets us *all* the way.

Bless you dear one, you'll be in my prayers tonight.

 

[newlite]

i believe he can. i know he can. hes picked me up before. but now hes leaving me here. at this present spot. i dont know why. ive prayed. but im left. im thinking god wants me here. hes not done. i for some reason have to stay he. and he isnt letting me get any lower. but her isnt getting me higher either. the partys in the other room. everyones laughing. and im here. cut off. like always. i dont know why im here. i dont know why gods letting or making me stay here. i dont know if its i have not enother faith or if im really not a christain. all i know is ive been here for years and if thats normal, then where is everbody else?

and heres me taking another topic off topicl...lhjfd8r5dkhtgohjmn

 

[Gwenyfur]

That's when you stop asking why Lord and start asking what do you want me to learn, Lord. You're at a stopping point in your life. A pause in your walk. It happens to all of us at one point or another. This is a time of waiting on the Lord. As with the children of Israel in Egypt, now is the time of waiting. As with them, He will deliver you too out of this time...if you have faith. Believe that He is there. When you know nothing else to pray, pray the Psalms. Believe what they say as you pray them. The time will pass.

My favorite phrase in the Bible is "and it came to pass..." It's a statement of hope...that this too shall pass.

 

[newlite]

thanks

 

[ZiSunka]

To be above reproach means that a reasonable person would not find them guilty of a serious offense, not that that person can never be gossiped about or accused of something.

For instance, I would consider Laura Bush to be above reproach because of the way she lives, how she deports herself and the things she says. You just don't see her doing things that would bring reproach upon her. That doesn't mean she's perfect or that she is never accused of anything, just that she lives in such a way as to make it hard to believe she would intentionally do wrong.

 

[unimportantbuthisnameis]

1 Timothy 3:2 Therefore an overseer must be above reproach

Brothers, what does this mean? Must I be perfect? Common sense tells me No, thats not what its saying. "I do the things I hate." Yet there is part of me, that when I sin I look upon this as an impossible call. I become ashamed (a good thing, a holy conviction) yet it is frustrating sometimes. Our good Lord is calling me into the ministry, and to be honest, sometimes I laugh, and say: "Lord, surley there is someone better than I." Yet, as someone stated in another thread, the Lord's hand is tipped in favor of the underdogs.

But what is this saying?

As an individual called into full-time ministry I also wondered about the same verse and the conclusion I came to is two-fold:

1)Do not live in a habitual state of sin.

2)Be an example of avoiding temptation if possible.

neither of these would make you perfect, but you would be above reproach because you are striving for perfection.

PS. Maybe this will help:

Main Entry: 1re·proach
Pronunciation: ri-'prOch
Function: noun
Etymology: Middle English reproche, from Middle French, from Old French, from reprochier to reproach, from (assumed) Vulgar Latin repropiare, from Latin re- + prope near -- more at [size=-1]APPROACH[/size]
1 : an expression of rebuke or disapproval
2 : the act or action of reproaching or disapproving <was beyond reproach>
3 a : a cause or occasion of blame, discredit, or disgrace b : [size=-1]DISCREDIT[/size], [size=-1]DISGRACE[/size]
4 obsolete : one subjected to censure or scorn
- re·proach·ful /-f&l/ adjective
- re·proach·ful·ly /-f&-lE/ adverb
- re·proach·ful·ness noun