Something that bothers me

[Dream]

Something that's been bothering me when I read the Bible is Jesus's anger.

We've always been taught that Jesus is all love, all caring, and all compassionate, but seems to get very angry sometimes. Just read Matthew 23 for instance. I'm not saying that Jesus isn't justified in His statements made to the Pharisees, it's just that it doesn't seem like the best way to handle the situation. Instead of calling them hypocrites and calling them terrible, it would make more sense to sit down with them and say "now I know you're decent people and you are trying to please God, but you should really think about this..." or "even though you are trying to do good, much harm comes out of your actions such as..."

Maybe it's just that it was more effective the way He presented His argument, it's impossible to tell.

I know that people are going to say that Jesus was human, therefore he experienced all emotions that humans feel, such as pain and anger. This is very true and I'm not doubting this at all. It's just that I would think Jesus would be able to keep his anger in check.

I know that the way I word this probablly sounds pretty random (like most my posts), but I think you probablly get the gist of what I'm saying. I would appreciate some thought concerning this idea.

 

[krstlros]

D.T.

All your points are valid.

However, if you look into the Old Testament, God wasn't exactly the calmest person. He got angry at the children of Israel. Disappointed at David. Bent His wrath on Sodum and Gamora. You will read many many more stories about how God's anger towards His people.

Why should Jesus be or do any less.

Anger with a purpose, as long as we don't lose sight of the bigger and important picture.

 

[epiclesis]

quick short answer, but i tend to think it had a lot to do with when this happened, many many MANY years ago.... i don't tend to think they thought that was anger back then. it seems up only until "recently" you could nearly say anything to anyone and they wouldn't be offended or hurt or take it to heart. you were insulted and life went on....

times change!

 

[StarSapphire]

quick short answer, but i tend to think it had a lot to do with when this happened, many many MANY years ago.... i don't tend to think they thought that was anger back then. it seems up only until "recently" you could nearly say anything to anyone and they wouldn't be offended or hurt or take it to heart. you were insulted and life went on....

times change!

I agree with this assessment absolutely. The people in those days were used to Roman soldiers lopping anyone's head off at the slightest thing. They probably viewed this as a calm approach! My, how our culture has changed since then! If a person is not all "touchy feely" when they tell you something, it is taken as an insult these days. Lord have mercy!

 

[Angelus00]

Some people tend to think the "all love" image is the typical flowerchild picture of complete pacifism. "Love" implies honesty and plain speaking in the "real" world. How do you give a child a "wake up" call as a parent? Do you take them gently by the hand and say, "Now Johnny, I FEEL your self-centeredness and pride. I UNDERSTAND your need to always be right to the detriment of your brothers and sisters, but you really should look around you and EMPATHIZE with your brothers ans sisters." YEAH, right! No! As a parent, you firmly raise em up (sometimes by their shorthairs ) to YOUR eye level and, in a firm no-nonsense voice, you say "HEY! Listen up you self-centered, prideful nit! LOOK at what you're pride and self-centeredness has done!" Jesus is our brother, our Lord. He just firmly told the so-n-so's what they were doing. THAT'S what you do with those that remain blind to their own actions.

PAX

 

[ProCommunioneFacior]

Yep, in today's age of false compassion it is sometimes hard to understand the anger that is within the Scriptures. However, true compassion sometimes requires a little anger to shake us out of our complacency and realize that we are not on the right path.

 

[Sacha Saint Francis]

Some people tend to think the "all love" image is the typical flowerchild picture of complete pacifism. "Love" implies honesty and plain speaking in the "real" world. How do you give a child a "wake up" call as a parent? Do you take them gently by the hand and say, "Now Johnny, I FEEL your self-centeredness and pride. I UNDERSTAND your need to always be right to the detriment of your brothers and sisters, but you really should look around you and EMPATHIZE with your brothers ans sisters." YEAH, right! No! As a parent, you firmly raise em up (sometimes by their shorthairs ) to YOUR eye level and, in a firm no-nonsense voice, you say "HEY! Listen up you self-centered, prideful nit! LOOK at what you're pride and self-centeredness has done!" Jesus is our brother, our Lord. He just firmly told the so-n-so's what they were doing. THAT'S what you do with those that remain blind to their own actions.

PAX

AMEN! I say! AMEN! That's precisely it Angelus00, well said.

Anger in itself is not a sin. The bible says, "In your anger, do not sin". Not do not anger for it is a sin. Anger is an emotion that God created, to warn us of danger, to emphasize danger, to excite protective and corrective measures.

Hope this helps you!
Sacha

 

[Dream]

You have all brought up good points, but I have a hard time believing that this is a calm approach. Even if it was calmer than the way that other disputes were settled, it doesn't mean that it was necessarily calm.

Angelus00, you have given me something to think about.

Thank you to everybody who took the time to respond.

 

[Aaron-Aggie]

2302 By recalling the commandment, "You shall not kill," 94 our Lord asked for peace of heart and denounced murderous anger and hatred as immoral. Anger is a desire for revenge. "To desire vengeance in order to do evil to someone who should be punished is illicit," but it is praiseworthy to impose restitution "to correct vices and maintain justice." 95 If anger reaches the point of a deliberate desire to kill or seriously wound a neighbor, it is gravely against charity; it is a mortal sin. The Lord says, "Everyone who is angry with his brother shall be liable to judgment." 96



St. Thomas Aquinas, STh II-II, 158, 1 ad 3 It is unlawful to desire vengeance considered as evil to the man who is to be punished, but it is praiseworthy to desire vengeance as a corrective of vice and for the good of justice; and to this the sensitive appetite can tend, in so far as it is moved thereto by the reason: and when revenge is taken in accordance with the order of judgment, it is God's work, since he who has power to punish "is God's minister," as stated in Rm. 13:4.

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208 Faced with God's fascinating and mysterious presence, man discovers his own insignificance. Before the burning bush, Moses takes off his sandals and veils his face in the presence of God's holiness. 13 Before the glory of the thrice-holy God, Isaiah cries out: "Woe is me! I am lost; for I am a man of unclean lips." 14 Before the divine signs wrought by Jesus, Peter exclaims: "Depart from me, for I am a sinful man, O Lord." 15 But because God is holy, he can forgive the man who realizes that he is a sinner before him: "I will not execute my fierce anger. . . for I am God and not man, the Holy One in your midst." 16 The apostle John says likewise: "We shall. . . reassure our hearts before him whenever our hearts condemn us; for God is greater than our hearts, and he knows everything." 17

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210 After Israel's sin, when the people had turned away from God to worship the golden calf, God hears Moses' prayer of intercession and agrees to walk in the midst of an unfaithful people, thus demonstrating his love. 18 When Moses asks to see his glory, God responds "I will make all my goodness pass before you, and will proclaim before you my name "the LORD" [YHWH]." 19 Then the LORD passes before Moses and proclaims, "YHWH, YHWH, a God merciful and gracious, slow to anger, and abounding in steadfast love and faithfulness"; Moses then confesses that the LORD is a forgiving God. 20

 

[Irenaeus]

DreamTheater,

Also remember not all anger is unrighteous. It is just like any other passion - it depends toward what end it is intended.

 

[StarSapphire]

AMEN! I say! AMEN! That's precisely it Angelus00, well said.

Anger in itself is not a sin. The bible says, "In your anger, do not sin". Not do not anger for it is a sin. Anger is an emotion that God created, to warn us of danger, to emphasize danger, to excite protective and corrective measures.

Hope this helps you!
Sacha

Well said too! (I have a "long fuse" when it comes to temper, but when it's released "watch out!" ) ...well, the most important thing is to not sin.

 

[Cathologetics]

Jesus is the Lord and King. Though He is merciful, He is also just.

 

[ZooMom]

I would just like to emphasize that Christ's anger was perfectly righteous, perfectly just, and perfectly appropriate. As ours cannot be, can never be, no matter the provocation. The parable of the beam and the speck applies to us always. We must remember charity when pointing out the errors of others, because we are ever in need of it ourselves. Unlike us, Christ bore the weight of sin without ever bearing the stain of it. There was no hipocrisy in His anger, and therefore nothing to reproach.


Peace be with you.

Sandy

 

[stray bullet]

Actually, the way Jesus acted is exactly as I'd expect from a very loving and compassionate person. We think of Jesus a bit like a shepherd, comforting the lost sheep.
How is Jesus to act when sheep within the flock bully others out? Imagine Christ's gentle nature trying to redeem all of mankind, while His own people, who respect the law and the Word God, attempt to divide us?
What if they knew better?

The Pharisees weren't an innocent bunch. They weren't the lost and hurt little lambs Christ was here to bring back. Here they knew His Father, they knew the Law, but some of their attitudes were just awful.
So Jesus told them exactly what they needed to hear. He wasn't here just for them, He was here for the people they were hurting. He didn't need to water it down for them. And if you notice, Jesus isn't the one that throws the first punch either.

 

[krstlros]

As I was reading the posts, it reminded me of something my Mother often told me:

"If I didn't care what happens to you, I wouldn't get so mad when you did something wrong. If I didn't care, I would let you go on your merrily way and not care what happens to you."

Jesus got angry only when his disciples or anyone for that matter, was on the road to sin. He chastised the Sadjacise (sorry for the spelling) for their arogancy. He got angry at the people at the temple because they were making it into a den of capitalism rather than a house of worship.

Jesus never got angry for no reason at all. He loved us so much He wanted us to do right in front of the eys of God our Father.