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  • CF has always been a site that welcomes people from different backgrounds and beliefs to participate in discussion and even debate. That is the nature of its ministry. In view of recent events emotions are running very high. We need to remind people of some basic principles in debating on this site. We need to be civil when we express differences in opinion. No personal attacks. Avoid you, your statements. Don't characterize an entire political party with comparisons to Fascism or Communism or other extreme movements that committed atrocities. CF is not the place for broad brush or blanket statements about groups and political parties. Put the broad brushes and blankets away when you come to CF, better yet, put them in the incinerator. Debate had no place for them. We need to remember that people that commit acts of violence represent themselves or a small extreme faction.

Some things I just don't think most of you understand...

Phred

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No parents ever gave birth to a child they did not recognize. That's important. It means that there are no sudden examples of gorillas giving birth to human beings. That's not how this works. That's not how any of this works. As has been stated ad infinitum, change happens gradually over vast periods of time.

The birds of today are related to the dinosaurs of yesterday. It has taken millions of years and hundreds of millions of generations but today's chicken has, as his great, great... great grandfather, a T-rex. This does not mean that one day a T-rex gave birth to a chicken. It means that over time, there were many, many interstitial species. Many of you ask, "then why don't we see all the fossils?" T-rex was around as a species for over 50 million years. We have seven complete fossils. 7. In 50 million years there must have been billions of individuals. Yet only seven fossilized. Why don't we have the fossils? Because they didn't fossilize. Fossils are rare. But we can be assured that since T-rex is no longer around and birds are that what once was T-rex is now a chicken. (Or something like it. I'm taking license here.)

When you are born you are born with a specific set of DNA that outlines who you will be. It's the instruction set that controls what your cells create. How many arms, legs, eyes, teeth... What color hair, eyes... This does NOT change while you are alive. You will die with the genes you were born with. Evolution happens between generations. Your children will be born with different genes than you have. Similar, but different. And their children will be born with different genes. Similar, but different. (If they have children that is.) And there you have it. The key.

If your parents didn't have children the odds are that you won't have any either. When a person fails to have offspring his or her genes are not passed on. That particular branch of evolution ends. All the changes, all the mutations, all the successful mating that led to that person being born comes to a crashing halt. If you breed, you're successful. If you don't, you're not.

I see questions being discussed such as, "well, what about morality?" Morality is irrelevant. Evolution is a process not a religion. It would be like saying Football isn't a good game because they don't use hockey sticks. So? The process of being born and breeding doesn't have anything to do with morality. Stop trying to fit a biological process into a religious bottle.

Lastly, I see much to-do about evolution not addressing how life came to be. Again, so? When we observe the world around us we seek to explain it. When we observe that things fall we seek to explain this and we do so by postulating a thing called, "gravity." When we see that there are many, many different types of life on the earth we first postulated that a deity created them all, and us, at the same time. Then we began to study the world around us and found that this idea didn't fit the evidence. From the evidence we found that a process we called, "evolution" fit the evidence much better than the idea of a single creation by a deity. However, the religious idea combined both the creation and the many species of life into one happening. The evidence shows us that there was one event that was the change from non-life to life (which we call abiogenesis) and then the evolution of many different types of life from a single type of life which we simply refer to as, "evolution." Simply because the religious explanation combines the two does not mean the real explanation has to. Stop trying to force it. Also, evolution is a word that means "change." Biological evolution is not the same thing as cosmic evolution or whatever other kinds of evolution you may have conflated simply because the word "evolution" was used. In the way biologists use it, which is the way it is relevant to this discussion, evolution just means species.
 

SkyWriting

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No parents ever gave birth to a child they did not recognize.

Except in the case of birth defects which happen every second of every day.
But they aren't really defects. They are just evolution putting it's best (clubbed) foot forward.

Congenital disorder
Also called: congenital anomaly
A medical condition, often inherited, that occurs at or before birth.
Most common types

Craniopagus-parasiticus-Picture-300x205.jpg
 
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SkyWriting

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When you are born you are born with a specific set of DNA that outlines who you will be. It's the instruction set that controls what your cells create.

I thought people died from natural causes. Something seems to have changed since birth.
 
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whois

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If your parents didn't have children the odds are that you won't have any either. When a person fails to have offspring his or her genes are not passed on. That particular branch of evolution ends. All the changes, all the mutations, all the successful mating that led to that person being born comes to a crashing halt. If you breed, you're successful. If you don't, you're not.
this has got to be one of the most ridiculous statements i've ever seen.
if your parents have no offspring, odds are you wont have any either?
huh?

evolution isn't what you think it is, genomics is going to smash everything you thought you knew about it.
darwinism has simply got to go.
 
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Cute Tink

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If your parents didn't have children the odds are that you won't have any either.

lol

If your parents didn't have children, odds are you are not participating in this conversation.

I get the point of your post, though. Carry on!
 
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AV1611VET

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No parents ever gave birth to a child they did not recognize.
You've never watched Judge Mathis, have you?

If so, maybe you missed the episodes where the plaintiff has requested a paternity test?
 
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juvenissun

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Evolution is a process not a religion.

The problem is that it includes some imaginary processes, (assumed processes, in order to sound more scientific) that could not be scientifically proven.
 
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SkyWriting

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When a person fails to have offspring his or her genes are not passed on. That particular branch of evolution ends.

That's crazy, because "evolution just means species."

But that's loonie, because the word "Species" is not found in the definition of "evolution."

So it's just as fair to say evolution just means Pisces.
 
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DogmaHunter

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That's crazy, because "evolution just means species."

But that's loonie, because the word "Species" is not found in the definition of "evolution."

So it's just as fair to say evolution just means Pisces.

Funny how you fail to respond to the big picture of his post.
I think he meant to say "speciation" btw.
 
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The Cadet

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this has got to be one of the most ridiculous statements i've ever seen.
if your parents have no offspring, odds are you wont have any either?
huh?

To be fair, if your parents have no offspring, odds are you probably won't be reading this post. Or writing it. Or breathing.
 
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Loudmouth

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Except in the case of birth defects which happen every second of every day.

Evolution includes detrimental mutations, which are selected against.

Are you denying the possibility that beneficial mutations can occur?


I keep seeing creationists use conjoined twins as examples of detrimental mutations. You do realize that this is NOT caused by mutations, right?
 
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OldWiseGuy

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I have yet to find a single creationist who can back this claim with one scintilla of evidence. I bet you can't either.

No need. My mind is closed to evolution.
 
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OldWiseGuy

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I am asking you to provide evidence for YOUR CLAIM that the majority of mutations are detrimental. Did you make that claim knowing that you were making it up?

When I hear 'mutation' I think of 'mutant'.
 
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Phred

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Creatures don't evolve, they mutate, and it usually isn't good. The study of evolution is 'organized confusion'. I don't buy it. :wave:

Well, you're wrong. A creature doesn't mutate. Once a creature is born it's done. It doesn't mutate. Evolution takes place between generations.
 
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