Some Questions my dad has.

[Brandon C]

Hello Everyone,

It's good to be here at CF. My name is Brandon Collins. I am 15 years old and live in Dallas, Texas. I am a strong believing Christian, a non-denominational one at that, and have been for the past year. I believe that ultimately, it's the relationship with Jesus / God that matters, and not the religion itself, because in the end, it's the relationship that you have with Jesus / God that will get you into Heaven, not the religion you were ( in most cases, anyway ).

Now, my dad has a few questions that he would like to have answered. My father is a very stubborn person and I have gotten irritated sometimes because he is not willing to conform with my answers at all. He believes that everyone has their own perception of the Bible, but that no one can come up with a 'definitive' answer for him that will please him ( hence, his stubbornness ). He is ( IMHO ) not a Christian, not an atheist. He claims to have faith and read the Bible from cover to cover after his sister died some 30 years ago. However, this is not totally true from what I believe.

Anywho, onto the questions he has that I would like to give him sufficient and "definitive" answers to. I would like an extremely detailed answer on each, as well as descriptive biblical scripture to back it up please.

1) Take two people. One, a muderer, rapist, and serial killer. The other, an ordinary person who has done no extreme wrong in their lives ( e.g. murder or rape ). Why can a murderer, rapist, whatever other bad things you want to call them ask for forgiveness minutes before dying and be cleansed of all his sins and go to Heaven when just the same ordinary person can go to Heaven after being forgiven and washed away clean of their sins? ( Now, my belief on this is that all sins - whether killing a person or cheating off of a test - are the same. No sin is greater than another. )

2) "If God is so great and powerful, why can't we see Him? I mean, someone with such great power should have enough courage and love to show Himself to us." -Quote from my dad

3) Why is God such a mystery? ( kind of correllates with question #2 above )

4) "I've had such a horrible life. Why do people with such horrible lives continue to follow God?"

5) "Brandon, take it from a non-Christian perspective for a minute ( which, btw, was extremely hard for me to do ). If I showed you this book [ the Bible ] and told you that you have never and would never see any of those people in there, yet you were supposed to believe in them and devote your whole life to them, what would you say / think / do?

6) Why dedicate your whole life to God when you haven't even seen him?

That's all I can think of for now, unfortunately, due to my anger at him. I need to be loving and forgiving towards him, though, and not angered at him.

I look forward to your responses and value your prayers.

 

[BarbB]

Hello Everyone,

It's good to be here at CF. My name is Brandon Collins. I am 15 years old and live in Dallas, Texas. I am a strong believing Christian, a non-denominational one at that, and have been for the past year. I believe that ultimately, it's the relationship with Jesus / God that matters, and not the religion itself, because in the end, it's the relationship that you have with Jesus / God that will get you into Heaven, not the religion you were ( in most cases, anyway ).

Now, my dad has a few questions that he would like to have answered. My father is a very stubborn person and I have gotten irritated sometimes because he is not willing to conform with my answers at all. He believes that everyone has their own perception of the Bible, but that no one can come up with a 'definitive' answer for him that will please him ( hence, his stubbornness ). He is ( IMHO ) not a Christian, not an atheist. He claims to have faith and read the Bible from cover to cover after his sister died some 30 years ago. However, this is not totally true from what I believe.

It is soooooo hard, isn't it, when someone we love refuses to accept the simple truth that Jesus saves? I'm in the same situation with my sis-in-law and close friends from before I was saved.

Anywho, onto the questions he has that I would like to give him sufficient and "definitive" answers to. I would like an extremely detailed answer on each, as well as descriptive biblical scripture to back it up please.

1) Take two people. One, a muderer, rapist, and serial killer. The other, an ordinary person who has done no extreme wrong in their lives ( e.g. murder or rape ). Why can a murderer, rapist, whatever other bad things you want to call them ask for forgiveness minutes before dying and be cleansed of all his sins and go to Heaven when just the same ordinary person can go to Heaven after being forgiven and washed away clean of their sins? ( Now, my belief on this is that all sins - whether killing a person or cheating off of a test - are the same. No sin is greater than another. )

You are correct. Try the thief on the cross.

LK 23:39 One of the criminals who hung there hurled insults at him: "Aren't you the Christ? Save yourself and us!"
LK 23:40 But the other criminal rebuked him. "Don't you fear God," he said, "since you are under the same sentence? [41] We are punished justly, for we are getting what our deeds deserve. But this man has done nothing wrong."
LK 23:42 Then he said, "Jesus, remember me when you come into your kingdom. "
LK 23:43 Jesus answered him, "I tell you the truth, today you will be with me in paradise."

2) "If God is so great and powerful, why can't we see Him? I mean, someone with such great power should have enough courage and love to show Himself to us." -Quote from my dad

Because we would die!

Moses saw the back of God but God would not permit him to see his face or Moses would die. But I can't find the right quote - somewhere in Exodus, I think. Here's another that's almost as good!

EX 20:18 When the people saw the thunder and lightning and heard the trumpet and saw the mountain in smoke, they trembled with fear. They stayed at a distance [19] and said to Moses, "Speak to us yourself and we will listen. But do not have God speak to us or we will die."
EX 20:20 Moses said to the people, "Do not be afraid. God has come to test you, so that the fear of God will be with you to keep you from sinning."
EX 20:21 The people remained at a distance, while Moses approached the thick darkness where God was.

3) Why is God such a mystery? ( kind of correllates with question #2 above )

I dunno, but I like it that way. Gives me something to think about!

4) "I've had such a horrible life. Why do people with such horrible lives continue to follow God?"

Because they find the strength to keep on keeping on instead of complaining and fault finding! I myself was not saved until my husband died. I thought I had forever to make a committment! Thank God that He had other plans!

5) "Brandon, take it from a non-Christian perspective for a minute ( which, btw, was extremely hard for me to do ). If I showed you this book [ the Bible ] and told you that you have never and would never see any of those people in there, yet you were supposed to believe in them and devote your whole life to them, what would you say / think / do?

I believe that we will see most of them in heaven. What do you think!

6) Why dedicate your whole life to God when you haven't even seen him?

Cause I don't want to die before I have to!

That's all I can think of for now, unfortunately, due to my anger at him. I need to be loving and forgiving towards him, though, and not angered at him.

I look forward to your responses and value your prayers.

Well, you've got my prayers and my responses, such as they are. Please remember that your dad does not know the truth and has no way to curb what he says to you. My friends hurt my feelings all the time with their ignorant (as in unknowing) comments, but I just keep praying for them all the same. Try praying that someone come into your father's life who he will listen to and you try to witness to someone who is another Christian's father. Sometimes we're just too close to the person we love.

God bless you - you are being a good son!

 

[OnTheWay]

1) Take two people. One, a muderer, rapist, and serial killer. The other, an ordinary person who has done no extreme wrong in their lives ( e.g. murder or rape ). Why can a murderer, rapist, whatever other bad things you want to call them ask for forgiveness minutes before dying and be cleansed of all his sins and go to Heaven when just the same ordinary person can go to Heaven after being forgiven and washed away clean of their sins? ( Now, my belief on this is that all sins - whether killing a person or cheating off of a test - are the same. No sin is greater than another. )

All have sinned and fallen short of the glory of God and all men need the redemptive work of Jesus Christ. Our lives are for the purpose of repenting our own sins and not comparing them to those of others to make ourselves feel better. As Christ taught, if you hate someone you have killed that person and are a murderer. If you have lust in your heart then you are already committed adultery whether you act on it or not. It simply isn't about human standards of whose "better" or "worse" than another person. The truth of Christianity is in the ability of Christ to change even the worst person into a holy man or woman. St. Paul hunted and killed Christians, yet God used him as one of the chief witnesses of Christ who later died for his faith. St. Moses the black was robber and a bandit until he found Christ. St. Mary of Egypt was a prostitute until Christ touched her heart at the doors of His Church.
Trying to justify yourself because you think others have committed "worse" sins is silly. You might tell your dad that he should review his own life and have him read the parable of the laborers in the vineyard.

2) "If God is so great and powerful, why can't we see Him? I mean, someone with such great power should have enough courage and love to show Himself to us." -Quote from my dad

In the beginning man walked with God and spoke with God, but then we rejected God. And now we must live by faith. Why should God make it easy to believe, or in fact remove the neccessity of faith, because of human actions?

3) Why is God such a mystery? ( kind of correllates with question #2 above )

Why is a flame such a mystery to a moth? God is unknowable in essence because He is an uncreated being and the creator of all. We are limited beings because we are less than our Creator.

4) "I've had such a horrible life. Why do people with such horrible lives continue to follow God?"

Even among non-Christians this sort of self pity is unbecoming. Bad things happen because we live in a fallen world. We live in a fallen world because humans chose to reject God. For whatever suffering you endure there are many others that have experienced far worse. Thank God for what you do have, and the strenght to over come trials.

5) "Brandon, take it from a non-Christian perspective for a minute ( which, btw, was extremely hard for me to do ). If I showed you this book [ the Bible ] and told you that you have never and would never see any of those people in there, yet you were supposed to believe in them and devote your whole life to them, what would you say / think / do?

Everyone struggles with faith, if your father thinks these arguements are new or creative he's deluded himself a great deal. When Jesus called His 12 why did they follow? Because they had faith, it really is that simple. There are only two possiblities, the first is that there is a Living God and our existence has purpose and meaning. The second is that there exists no God and therefore there is no point to existence and nothing that human beings do can be or has ever been right or wrong.

6) Why dedicate your whole life to God when you haven't even seen him?

I have seen Christ, I see Him in the face of every other human being that I have ever encountered.

 

[Merlin]

Hi Brandon,

Hello Everyone,

1) Take two people. One, a muderer, rapist, and serial killer. The other, an ordinary person who has done no extreme wrong in their lives ( e.g. murder or rape ). Why can a murderer, rapist, whatever other bad things you want to call them ask for forgiveness minutes before dying and be cleansed of all his sins and go to Heaven when just the same ordinary person can go to Heaven after being forgiven and washed away clean of their sins? ( Now, my belief on this is that all sins - whether killing a person or cheating off of a test - are the same. No sin is greater than another. )

From your dad's perspective, some sins are worse than others.
From God's perspective it's all yucky.
Nothing we do can change that. We have *yucky* all over us.
We need something to get the yucky off.
Jesus is what God gave us (like soap) to get the yucky off.

2) "If God is so great and powerful, why can't we see Him? I mean, someone with such great power should have enough courage and love to show Himself to us." -Quote from my dad

Imagine staring up at the sun.
The sun is about 93 million miles away, yet it's blinding to look at.
God 'shines' much brighter.
As humans, we simply cannot look at such a thing and physically survive.

3) Why is God such a mystery? ( kind of correllates with question #2 above )

God makes His presence known.
He's just protecting our frail existance.

4) "I've had such a horrible life. Why do people with such horrible lives continue to follow God?"

Our life here is very brief compared to eternity.

[5) "Brandon, take it from a non-Christian perspective for a minute ( which, btw, was extremely hard for me to do ). If I showed you this book [ the Bible ] and told you that you have never and would never see any of those people in there, yet you were supposed to believe in them and devote your whole life to them, what would you say / think / do?

If a book were all there was, we might agree.
Christianity is not limited to a book though.

6) Why dedicate your whole life to God when you haven't even seen him?

Christianity is not about what we see.

 

[Gwenyfur]

okay...nobody faint...but I agree with them!!!!

No better answers than the ones found in scripture.

Find a strongs, and it will help you find the answers you need to give your father.

Also, pray...I believe in the power of prayer. Remember only G-d can call a person to Him, only He has the power to soften hearts so that the seeds we plant fall on good soil. Pray for strength and wisdom for yourself as you minister to your father. For in sharing the word of G-d you are ministering to him.

Pray for peace and a forgiving spirit so that you can face him, speak with him, witness to him and not take the anger he apparently holds for G-d personally. Remember, he's not unbelieving of you, he's unbelieving of the Savior...very different there

G-d bless you and keep you as you work to further His kingdom.

 

[Theophorus]

1) Take two people. One, a muderer, rapist, and serial killer. The other, an ordinary person who has done no extreme wrong in their lives ( e.g. murder or rape ). Why can a murderer, rapist, whatever other bad things you want to call them ask for forgiveness minutes before dying and be cleansed of all his sins and go to Heaven when just the same ordinary person can go to Heaven after being forgiven and washed away clean of their sins? ( Now, my belief on this is that all sins - whether killing a person or cheating off of a test - are the same. No sin is greater than another. )

The mercy of God is His choice. However the focus of the new testament is not hell, but salvation and how an individual seeks it. Your theology and others might not be consistent with the truth revealed in scripture, or have only a partial understanding. It is not the inability of God to save that is in question, it is our response. If you think that a person with a hardened heart can so easily "repent", then that is one place to start to explore. What is true repentance?

2) "If God is so great and powerful, why can't we see Him? I mean, someone with such great power should have enough courage and love to show Himself to us." -Quote from my dad

Well. why were we expelled from the garden. Out of mercy. Remember that God said that no man could see him and live. And when moses came down from the mountian he had to put a veil on because of the "effect" his countenance had on the people. The question to ask yourself is why?

Thus God did appear to man as man. In a way that we could behold. And most of the world rejected Him. The truth incarnate. Do you think that the world could endure the glorious appearance of the unfathomable? God himself says we cannot, at least with our sins. Remember Isaiah's vision of God, and he was undone.

3) Why is God such a mystery? ( kind of correllates with question #2 above )

Because He is God, and we are seperated from Him. He reveals what is good, not what will harm. We are not only separated from God, but the three aspects of our person are divided within ourselves. Our heart is often in conflict with our reason, and our passions, lust anger, etc boil with in us.
We do not even understand ourselves, how presumptious to think that we can understand the whole of God. But here is the beauty. God gave us the ability for both through Jesus Christ. Yet it is on a level deeper than mere intellectual assent or dissent.
Christ, the author and finisher of faith, prayed and fasted.

4) "I've had such a horrible life. Why do people with such horrible lives continue to follow God?"

Because God is their hope and promise. Plus what is a horrible life to you, may be good for another. The ultimate principle here is that Christ trampled down death, by death. That Christ was perfected through sufferings. The world has itself and its treasures. The kingdom of God has Christ and His treasures.

As Paul said, he counted it for joy, when he suffered for Christ. This again cannot be understood at just the intellectual level Even if one has a wonderful life, the poetical books all say we end up the same. Dead.

Take a good look around you, most of the world does suffer in terrible ways. Those who do suffer tend to understand these spiritual matters more so than those who do not, as the bible says.

5) "Brandon, take it from a non-Christian perspective for a minute ( which, btw, was extremely hard for me to do ). If I showed you this book [ the Bible ] and told you that you have never and would never see any of those people in there, yet you were supposed to believe in them and devote your whole life to them, what would you say / think / do?

Who can blame him. Without an understanding of how the book came to be, and those who produced it, and that Christianity is more than a book, why should anyone even bother with it.

6) Why dedicate your whole life to God when you haven't even seen him?

This is silly. Why dedicate yourself to a president who you have never met. To a priniciple that cannot be seen, such as love, capitalism, ahh, you see, or better yet know or experience. Manifestations can take many Forms, including flesh and blood.
The one who created light and the universe cannot be seen with fleshly eyes safely (see above). We are cut off from the "sensual" experience of spiritual things out of mercy and love, for our own good. Look at the deeper things of scripture and ask yourself
1. Adam saw God, but after his sin, he hid from him. He did not obey because of his sight.

2. The demons beheld God, yet fell.

The issue of faith is very deep, as you can see (pun intended).

 

[winslow]

Hello Everyone,

It's good to be here at CF. My name is Brandon Collins. I am 15 years old and live in Dallas, Texas. I am a strong believing Christian, a non-denominational one at that, and have been for the past year. I believe that ultimately, it's the relationship with Jesus / God that matters, and not the religion itself, because in the end, it's the relationship that you have with Jesus / God that will get you into Heaven, not the religion you were ( in most cases, anyway ).

Now, my dad has a few questions that he would like to have answered. My father is a very stubborn person and I have gotten irritated sometimes because he is not willing to conform with my answers at all. He believes that everyone has their own perception of the Bible, but that no one can come up with a 'definitive' answer for him that will please him ( hence, his stubbornness ). He is ( IMHO ) not a Christian, not an atheist. He claims to have faith and read the Bible from cover to cover after his sister died some 30 years ago. However, this is not totally true from what I believe.

Anywho, onto the questions he has that I would like to give him sufficient and "definitive" answers to. I would like an extremely detailed answer on each, as well as descriptive biblical scripture to back it up please.

1) Take two people. One, a muderer, rapist, and serial killer. The other, an ordinary person who has done no extreme wrong in their lives ( e.g. murder or rape ). Why can a murderer, rapist, whatever other bad things you want to call them ask for forgiveness minutes before dying and be cleansed of all his sins and go to Heaven when just the same ordinary person can go to Heaven after being forgiven and washed away clean of their sins? ( Now, my belief on this is that all sins - whether killing a person or cheating off of a test - are the same. No sin is greater than another. )

2) "If God is so great and powerful, why can't we see Him? I mean, someone with such great power should have enough courage and love to show Himself to us." -Quote from my dad

3) Why is God such a mystery? ( kind of correllates with question #2 above )

4) "I've had such a horrible life. Why do people with such horrible lives continue to follow God?"

5) "Brandon, take it from a non-Christian perspective for a minute ( which, btw, was extremely hard for me to do ). If I showed you this book [ the Bible ] and told you that you have never and would never see any of those people in there, yet you were supposed to believe in them and devote your whole life to them, what would you say / think / do?

6) Why dedicate your whole life to God when you haven't even seen him?

That's all I can think of for now, unfortunately, due to my anger at him. I need to be loving and forgiving towards him, though, and not angered at him.

I look forward to your responses and value your prayers.

1) The issiue here is not over relative goodness, but sincere repentance. A deathbed confession of repentance is only acceptable to the Lord if offered in sincerity (He alone can read the heart) We cannot measure our "goodness" in comparison to a grevious sinner. We must measure ourselves to Christ, where there is no comparison. Jesus explains this in a parable:
Mat 20:1 "For the kingdom of heaven is like a master of a house who went out early in the morning to hire laborers for his vineyard.
Mat 20:2 After agreeing with the laborers for a denarius a day, he sent them into his vineyard.
Mat 20:3 And going out about the third hour he saw others standing idle in the marketplace,
Mat 20:4 and to them he said, 'You go into the vineyard too, and whatever is right I will give you.'
Mat 20:5 So they went. Going out again about the sixth hour and the ninth hour, he did the same.
Mat 20:6 And about the eleventh hour he went out and found others standing. And he said to them, 'Why do you stand here idle all day?'
Mat 20:7 They said to him, 'Because no one has hired us.' He said to them, 'You go into the vineyard too.'
Mat 20:8 And when evening came, the owner of the vineyard said to his foreman, 'Call the laborers and pay them their wages, beginning with the last, up to the first.'
Mat 20:9 And when those hired about the eleventh hour came, each of them received a denarius.
Mat 20:10 Now when those hired first came, they thought they would receive more, but each of them also received a denarius.
Mat 20:11 And on receiving it they grumbled at the master of the house,
Mat 20:12 saying, 'These last worked only one hour, and you have made them equal to us who have borne the burden of the day and the scorching heat.'
Mat 20:13 But he replied to one of them, 'Friend, I am doing you no wrong. Did you not agree with me for a denarius?
Mat 20:14 Take what belongs to you and go. I choose to give to this last worker as I give to you.
Mat 20:15 Am I not allowed to do what I choose with what belongs to me? Or do you begrudge my generosity?'

Human nature says that it is unfair because the murderer is granted the same reward as the saint, but in reality it is the saint who has entered into the peace of Christ at the moment of his conversion.b

 

[Dragons87]

God could be seen, and felt and heard. Jesus was here! Among us!

How do we know it's true? It corresponds with historical facts. Palestine was under Roman rule, and the Jews had autonomy there, and that crucifixtion was indeed a punishment...etc....there are probably too many historical proofs for Jesus...

But for now, if God was to perpetually be around us physically, He would have no more value than the book on my desk. But the book on my desk cannot satisfy my inner wants! My inner desires to be forgiven, to be loved - and to forgive, and to love! These invisible desires can only be fulfilled by the invisible - God.

Hope this helps! Will pray!

 

[dalej42]

4) "I've had such a horrible life. Why do people with such horrible lives continue to follow God?" I look forward to your responses and value your prayers.

Have you read the book of Job? Job is probably my favorite book in the Bible. Job does suffer and yet remains strong in faith. This book can truly encourage those who have reached the end of their hope to continue to hold on. .

 

[Jig]

From your dad's perspective, some sins are worse than others.
From God's perspective it's all yucky.
Nothing we do can change that. We have *yucky* all over us.
We need something to get the yucky off.
Jesus is what God gave us (like soap) to get the yucky off.
.

Yucky LOL I thought this was funny. True though...

 

[scattered.sheep]

1) Take two people. One, a muderer, rapist, and serial killer. The other, an ordinary person who has done no extreme wrong in their lives ( e.g. murder or rape ). Why can a murderer, rapist, whatever other bad things you want to call them ask for forgiveness minutes before dying and be cleansed of all his sins and go to Heaven when just the same ordinary person can go to Heaven after being forgiven and washed away clean of their sins? ( Now, my belief on this is that all sins - whether killing a person or cheating off of a test - are the same. No sin is greater than another. )

Hi Brandon, I'm inclined to agree with your Dad here. Some sins are worse than others. Murdering someone is definitely a worse sin than cheating on a test. However all are sin. All sins are punishable with death. Rom 6:23 "The wages of sin is death". Your Dad is right. The murderer does not deserve to be forgiven, but then neither does anyone who has sinned deserve to be forgiven. Rom 3:23 "23 For all have sinned, and come short of the glory of God;" This is the miracle of grace Rom 3:24 "Being justified freely by his grace through the redemption that is in Christ Jesus: "

If the murderer or the common sinner deserved to be forgiven then there would be no need for grace. Rom 6:23 "but the gift of God is eternal life through Jesus Christ our Lord." If we deserved forgiveness and salvation from the penalty of death then you would not be able to say that salvation was a free gift from God.
The fact that God extends grace to us sinners is an example of how much he loves those he calls. Rom 5:8 "But God commendeth his love toward us, in that, while we were yet sinners, Christ died for us. ". So who did Christ die for? Did he not die for the sins of all mankind. 1 John 2:2 "And he is the propitiation for our sins: and not for ours only, but also for the sins of the whole world." So if you can imagine the worst sin imaginable; if that sin could not be expiated (forgiven, atoned) then how could it be said that Christ died for the sins of the whole world?

Now if there were sins which Christ did not die for then you might be tempted to believe that your own personal sins, which have become so hideous in your sight, could not possibly be forgiven by God. However if you know surely that God will forgive the worst sinner, even a mass murderer ethnic cleanser, then surely he will forgive you. I cannot possibly communicate the depth and the glory of God's grace and forgiveness in this small post. This can only come to you fully through personal Bible study and prayer. As you grow in your Christian walk two things will become ever more apparent. The utter vileness of all sin on the one hand and the incomprehensible wonder of God's grace on the other.

Before I go, consider a couple of parables and accounts of Christ. First the woman who anointed Christs feet with ointment and tears. Luke 7"Simon, I have somewhat to say unto thee. And he saith, Master, say on. 41 There was a certain creditor which had two debtors: the one owed five hundred pence, and the other fifty. 42 And when they had nothing to pay, he frankly forgave them both. Tell me therefore, which of them will love him most? 43 Simon answered and said, I suppose that he, to whom he forgave most. And he said unto him, Thou hast rightly judged. 44 And he turned to the woman, and said unto Simon, Seest thou this woman? I entered into thine house, thou gavest me no water for my feet: but she hath washed my feet with tears, and wiped them with the hairs of her head. 45 Thou gavest me no kiss: but this woman since the time I came in hath not ceased to kiss my feet. 46 My head with oil thou didst not anoint: but this woman hath anointed my feet with ointment. 47 Wherefore I say unto thee, Her sins, which are many, are forgiven; for she loved much: but to whom little is forgiven, the same loveth little. 48 And he said unto her, Thy sins are forgiven. 49 And they that sat at meat with him began to say within themselves, Who is this that forgiveth sins also? 50 And he said to the woman, Thy faith hath saved thee; go in peace."

Second the account of the Labourers in the vineyard. I suggest you read Matthew 20:1-16. The labourers who only worked for one hour got the same money as those who worked all day through the heat of the day. But who are we to question God or say that he is wrong for forgiving the murderer and giving him the same reward as the one who only sinned a little. God gives as he desires not as we deserve. If he gave as we deserved we would all be dead as punishment for sin.

Don't get too upset with your Dad Brandon. Also don't try to take on too many issues at once. Just concentrate on issue 1. Make sure you understand it fully in your own mind before you try to explain it to your Dad. Explain it to him patiently and respectfully as he is your Father. If you are unable to make any impression on him with Issue 1 then there is probably not much to be gained trying to convince him on issues 2-6. Don't get frustrated with him though but rather be patient and pray for the intervention of God in his life.

All the best Brandon. I am happy to answer any further questions you have on Issue 1.

 

[BigNorsk]

Hello Everyone,

It's good to be here at CF. My name is Brandon Collins. I am 15 years old and live in Dallas, Texas. I am a strong believing Christian, a non-denominational one at that, and have been for the past year. I believe that ultimately, it's the relationship with Jesus / God that matters, and not the religion itself, because in the end, it's the relationship that you have with Jesus / God that will get you into Heaven, not the religion you were ( in most cases, anyway ).

Now, my dad has a few questions that he would like to have answered. My father is a very stubborn person and I have gotten irritated sometimes because he is not willing to conform with my answers at all. He believes that everyone has their own perception of the Bible, but that no one can come up with a 'definitive' answer for him that will please him ( hence, his stubbornness ). He is ( IMHO ) not a Christian, not an atheist. He claims to have faith and read the Bible from cover to cover after his sister died some 30 years ago. However, this is not totally true from what I believe.

Anywho, onto the questions he has that I would like to give him sufficient and "definitive" answers to. I would like an extremely detailed answer on each, as well as descriptive biblical scripture to back it up please.

1) Take two people. One, a muderer, rapist, and serial killer. The other, an ordinary person who has done no extreme wrong in their lives ( e.g. murder or rape ). Why can a murderer, rapist, whatever other bad things you want to call them ask for forgiveness minutes before dying and be cleansed of all his sins and go to Heaven when just the same ordinary person can go to Heaven after being forgiven and washed away clean of their sins? ( Now, my belief on this is that all sins - whether killing a person or cheating off of a test - are the same. No sin is greater than another. )

2) "If God is so great and powerful, why can't we see Him? I mean, someone with such great power should have enough courage and love to show Himself to us." -Quote from my dad

3) Why is God such a mystery? ( kind of correllates with question #2 above )

4) "I've had such a horrible life. Why do people with such horrible lives continue to follow God?"

5) "Brandon, take it from a non-Christian perspective for a minute ( which, btw, was extremely hard for me to do ). If I showed you this book [ the Bible ] and told you that you have never and would never see any of those people in there, yet you were supposed to believe in them and devote your whole life to them, what would you say / think / do?

6) Why dedicate your whole life to God when you haven't even seen him?

That's all I can think of for now, unfortunately, due to my anger at him. I need to be loving and forgiving towards him, though, and not angered at him.

I look forward to your responses and value your prayers.

1. The standard isn't being "good enought" to make it into heaven. The standard is he who believes will be saved. Each and every person is inherently sinful and a sinner. Every person falls short. Only those for whom Jesus Christ in his perfection substitutes for reach heaven, not because they earned it, because it is given to them.

I won't disagree that some sins are "worse" than others, but I think that mostly it is because by the time one commits them, one is usually further from God. All sin produces death and separation. One isn't saved because one isn't a sinner, he is saved because Jesus isn't a sinner.

Your father seems to have done what many do and just reduce chrisitianity to a social system, a philosophy that teaches us how to live.

2. We do see him. Just as an author is visible in his book or an artist in his painting so God is visible in his work. Also, we the witness of those who physically got to see God. The answer boils down to this:
Luke 16:29-31 NET
(29) But Abraham said, 'They have Moses and the prophets; they must respond to them.'
(30) Then the rich man said, 'No, father Abraham, but if someone from the dead goes to them, they will repent.'
(31) He replied to him, 'If they do not respond to Moses and the prophets, they will not be convinced even if someone rises from the dead.' "

Not every person who saw Jesus believed, matter of fact it looks that most didn't. If God came down and stood right in front of your dad, that wouldn't mean that he wouldn't still deny God's existence.

3. He's not, look at all he has revealed. People haven't got that, yet clamour for more.

4. Actually, a "horrible" life might be the proverbial blessing in disguise. God tells us he choses the foolish things of this world. Ever notice what happens to people of great power, wealth and comfort? They trust those things and not God. A really what we think is a great life on this planet seldom is a real blessing. Even while here, if you get to meet those people that we think are so "lucky" to have such a life, you will find the majority are really, really miserable. They aren't happy at all.

Ecclesiastes talks about being neither poor nor rich, that's a good target.

5. Your father is somewhat right in this, it is all foolishness to those who do not have faith. Don't tell your father to "just believe", he can't do it. Share the Law and the Gospel with him, hopefully the Holy Spirit will use the Law to convict your father and make him come to realize he needs help, and then the Gospel can provide that help to him.

6. Does your father only do his job when he sees those for who he is doing the work?

I am involved in growing crops for food. I will never know nor will I ever meet the vast majority who eat those crops. Should I just stop because I don't see them standing at the field's edge waiting for food?

He probably sees his purpose for working as getting paid. Ask him. If he says it is getting paid, then ask why he didn't become something that pays more? If you keep going, you will eventually get to something other than money, at least in most cases.

Answering your father's questions won't make him believe. That is the work of the Holy Spirit as we are called to God through his Word.

My recommendation is to use the questions primarily as a means of sharing the teachings of the Bible. Even as a person denies God's Word, His Word is powerful. That's the primary thing to focus on, you can't debate your father into belief, share the Law and the Gospel and hope and pray that your father quits resisting.

Marv

 

[eoe]

1) Take two people. One, a muderer, rapist, and serial killer. The other, an ordinary person who has done no extreme wrong in their lives ( e.g. murder or rape ). Why can a murderer, rapist, whatever other bad things you want to call them ask for forgiveness minutes before dying and be cleansed of all his sins and go to Heaven when just the same ordinary person can go to Heaven after being forgiven and washed away clean of their sins? ( Now, my belief on this is that all sins - whether killing a person or cheating off of a test - are the same. No sin is greater than another. )

Take 2 toys. Both toys are desinged to operate while plugged into a wall socket. Both toys have a battery backup.

Both toys start operating at the same time. The toys get unplugged from the wall and fall back to reserve power. They run for a while on battery power and after a while the batteries begin to drain. One toy is plugged back into the wall - the other is not.

Is it the electric companies fault that the toy that was never plugged in finally ran out of juice?

God is the source of life. When mankind fell they removed themselves from this source of life. That is why we die. When we live as a Christain we begin to allow ourselves to be plugged back into the source of life. Without being plugged back into the source - how can we complain that we die?

If you do not plug a lamp into the wall do you then blame the power company that it fails to give light?

So these people that you refer to - it is not a matter of what bad things they are guilty of - it is a matter of the good that they have left undone. They have refused to allow themseves to be plugged back in. Those that have allowed themselves to be plugged in will enjoy the benefits - how can those who do not complain?

"If God is so great and powerful, why can't we see Him? I mean, someone with such great power should have enough courage and love to show Himself to us." -Quote from my dad

If your Dad exists why can I not see him?
The blindman can call the sun a myth but does that make it true?
When we sit inside our house and we close up all the windows can we complain then that there is darkness? It is the same without our hearts. If we shut up our hearts and fill them with doubt and disbelief how can we expect God's presence to fit in? If we actively set up barriers - if we fill up a hole with concrete, how can anything else get in?


Here is the truth that you can tell your Dad. God is the lord and has revealed himself to us. God was here on earth and we crucified him. He not only had the courage to show himself but he also had the courage to allow us to murder him.

3) Why is God such a mystery? ( kind of correllates with question #2 above )

Because you have a puny human brain.
If God were understandable he would not be very much of a god would he?

4) "I've had such a horrible life. Why do people with such horrible lives continue to follow God?"

Wow... Read this.
A story about a man arrested and put into the Russian Gulag.
Here is truth:

[SIZE=+1]I saw in the camp how people went out of their minds or ended with suicide. And I myself clearly felt that if, after all, I came to the firm and final conclusion that there is no God, I would simply be obliged to end with suicide, since it is shameful and belittling for a rational creature to drag out a senseless and tormenting life. Thus, at the second stage of spiritual rebirth we discover that atheism, thought out to its logical end, inevitably brings a man to perdition, because it is a complete teaching of immorality, evil, and death." [/SIZE]

I wonder how bad someone's life must be here in America.

5) "Brandon, take it from a non-Christian perspective for a minute ( which, btw, was extremely hard for me to do ). If I showed you this book [ the Bible ] and told you that you have never and would never see any of those people in there, yet you were supposed to believe in them and devote your whole life to them, what would you say / think / do?

I would say, "Why is it that I should accept this?"
Then you would need to provide an adequate response. Most people these days are utterly incapable of providing such a response because they don't really know their religion.

6) Why dedicate your whole life to God when you haven't even seen him?

So that someday I might.

 

[NarrowPathPilgrim]

1) Take two people. One, a muderer, rapist, and serial killer. The other, an ordinary person who has done no extreme wrong in their lives ( e.g. murder or rape ). Why can a murderer, rapist, whatever other bad things you want to call them ask for forgiveness minutes before dying and be cleansed of all his sins and go to Heaven when just the same ordinary person can go to Heaven after being forgiven and washed away clean of their sins? ( Now, my belief on this is that all sins - whether killing a person or cheating off of a test - are the same. No sin is greater than another. )

Works will/do condemn the unbeliever; but works have absolutely nothing to do with salvation.

Romans 11:6 "If by grace, then is it no more of works: otherwise grace is no more grace. But if it be of works, then is it no more grace: otherwise work is no more work."

Romans 3:23 "For all have sinned, and come short of the glory of God;"

Romans 6:23 "For the wages of sin is death; but the gift of God is eternal life through Jesus Christ our Lord."
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2) "If God is so great and powerful, why can't we see Him? I mean, someone with such great power should have enough courage and love to show Himself to us." -Quote from my dad

God is a holy God; we are filthy sinners. Without holiness no one will see the Lord.

Hebrews 12:14 "Follow peace with all men, and holiness, without which no man shall see the Lord:"
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3) Why is God such a mystery? ( kind of correllates with question #2 above )

The short answer to this question is "Because he chose to be a mystery".

Proverbs 25:2 "It is the glory of God to conceal a thing: but the honour of kings is to search out a matter."
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The long answer to this question is answered several ways in the following verses:

Matthew 13:10-17
10 And the disciples came, and said unto him, Why speakest thou unto them in parables?
11 He answered and said unto them, Because it is given unto you to know the mysteries of the kingdom of heaven, but to them it is not given.
12 For whosoever hath, to him shall be given, and he shall have more abundance: but whosoever hath not, from him shall be taken away even that he hath.
13 Therefore speak I to them in parables: because they seeing see not; and hearing they hear not, neither do they understand.
14 And in them is fulfilled the prophecy of Esaias, which saith, By hearing ye shall hear, and shall not understand; and seeing ye shall see, and shall not perceive:
15 For this people's heart is waxed gross, and their ears are dull of hearing, and their eyes they have closed; lest at any time they should see with their eyes, and hear with their ears, and should understand with their heart, and should be converted, and I should heal them.
16 But blessed are your eyes, for they see: and your ears, for they hear.
17 For verily I say unto you, That many prophets and righteous men have desired to see those things which ye see, and have not seen them; and to hear those things which ye hear, and have not heard them.

Mark 4:9-12
9 And he said unto them, He that hath ears to hear, let him hear.
10 And when he was alone, they that were about him with the twelve asked of him the parable.
11 And he said unto them, Unto you it is given to know the mystery of the kingdom of God: but unto them that are without, all these things are done in parables:
12 That seeing they may see, and not perceive; and hearing they may hear, and not understand; lest at any time they should be converted, and their sins should be forgiven them.

1 Corinthians 2:7 "But we speak the wisdom of God in a mystery, even the hidden wisdom, which God ordained before the world unto our glory:"


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4) "I've had such a horrible life. Why do people with such horrible lives continue to follow God?"

That question is very existentialistic in nature; but here is the scriptural answer.

Job 1:21 "Naked came I out of my mother's womb, and naked shall I return thither: the LORD gave, and the LORD hath taken away; blessed be the name of the LORD."
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5) "Brandon, take it from a non-Christian perspective for a minute ( which, btw, was extremely hard for me to do ). If I showed you this book [ the Bible ] and told you that you have never and would never see any of those people in there, yet you were supposed to believe in them and devote your whole life to them, what would you say / think / do?

That mindset leads directly to existentialism; a system of total despair and hopelessness.
But praise God that his word IS true!

6) Why dedicate your whole life to God when you haven't even seen him?

This is positivism; another system of reasoning which will quickly lead to existentialism.
Positivism is very illogical and unscriptural.

2 Corinthians 5:7 "We walk by faith, not by sight:"

Mark 10:15 "Verily I say unto you, Whosoever shall not receive the kingdom of God as a little child, he shall not enter therein."

Luke 18:17 "Verily I say unto you, Whosoever shall not receive the kingdom of God as a little child shall in no wise enter therein."

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Sincerely, Zach Doty