So You Want To Build The 3rd Temple...

[Hoshiyya]

1. Location

Where would you build it?
On top of the mosque?

2. Retaliation

Let's say you want to destroy the mosque and build over it.

How many lives lost to muslim retaliation would be "too much" in your opinion ?
Is there any amount of lives that would be too much?

and note it would be muslim retaliation, not merely palestinian retaliation. it would be a modern islamic crusade, directly rivaling any of the christian crusades.

3. Providing Housing for the Antichrist
(AKA "He Followed Me To Temple, Mommy Can We Keep Him?")

Let's say you subscribe to the modern Protestant idea that the antichrist will be enthroned and worshiped in the 3rd temple.

Why would you ever want to build a temple for the antichrist?

If the antichrist wants a temple why can't he build it himself?

4. Further implications of the "let's build a temple for the Antichrist" theology
(AKA "He peed all over the rug!")

The temple would be defiled by the antichrist being worshiped therein.
God decreed the destruction of the first and second temples for defilement much less severe than this.
The antichrist's defilement of the 3rd temple would thus create a need for a 4th temple.

If God were to just say "this defilement doesn't count" then he might as well have said this in the past, thus this theology ultimately implies that the first temple was destroyed for no reason (the second temple wouldn't even need to exist since the first one wouldn't have been destroyed.)

 

[Sabertooth]

Do the non-Messianic Jews believe in an anti-Christ to precede the advent of the real One?

If they believe that the Messiah's first advent is the next big thing, couldn't they easily be duped into pursuing construction for the pretender?

Doesn't a Temple (even if disposable) have to be erected for the Messiah to enter through the East Gate [Ezekiel 44:1-3] which is presently sealed?

 

[Hoshiyya]

Do the non-Messianic Jews believe in an anti-Christ to precede the advent of the real One?

If they believe that the Messiah's first advent is the next big thing, couldn't they easily be duped into pursuing construction for the pretender?

Doesn't a Temple (even if disposable) have to be erected for the Messiah to enter through the East Gate [Ezekiel 44:1-3] which is presently sealed?

I'm asking the questions here, my man

 

[Sabertooth]

I think that your rhetorical questions are rational, but (me being mildly autistic) I don't see where mine might conflict with yours. I am sorry if they have done so.

 

[visionary]

It sure does put the perplexity on the prophecy.. aka "god" in the temple...

If the Pope were in Jerusalem in His new Vatican digs, thus the "god on earth" in "his' temple... would that count?

 

[Brian Mcnamee]

I'm asking the questions here, my man

answering a question with a question is still a valid answer.

 

[Brian Mcnamee]

The events coming to pass that you are questioning are things that are destined to happen. I look at the Temple institute and see the preparations they have made for the return of the daily sacrifices which you correctly note that this is where the antichrist commits the abomination of desolation and can see the event horizon closing in. Christians should be using their understanding of prophecy to sound the alarm that the day of Jacobs trouble is on the horizon. The dilemma with the Temple mount might not be a problem as John in REv was told to measure the Temple but to leave out the outer court as this has been given to the Gentiles. There is a strong case that can be made that the Dome of the Rock sits on top of the Antonio Fortress and that this complex is outside that court. Josephus claimed when coming into Jerusalem you could not see the temple and the dome is now on the hill and would be easily visible. There also is the need for a running stream of water at the temple and the brook of kidron is also just below. As far as bringing these days upon us by supporting or not the issue is really a side issue in my book. The world has to also be corrupt, the church mostly compromises or apostate, Israel hated and abandoned by all nations, a global government with a one world spiritual formation also need arise.
I dialogue with many Jews on a Torah vs Bible page and understand what they are expecting. They will accept the antichrist who will turn on them. We are told all of this in advance and we have no power to accelerate this end or delay it. Satan is the one who meets his end after the 7 years and he certainly knows this as the demons said to Jesus are you going to destroy us before the time. They know there is a time that is coming when they will be judged. Satan like Judas is compelled to follow the script and he is wanting to commit the abomination of desolation and destroy as many as he can. The truth of scripture can be established by how all the prophecy is playing out.
Hos 3 shows the return of the sacrifice is tied to the return of the kingdom which is Jesus at the 2nd coming. 4 For the children of Israel shall abide many days without king or prince, without sacrifice or sacred pillar, without ephod or teraphim. 5 Afterward the children of Israel shall return and seek the LORD their God and David their king. They shall fear the LORD and His goodness in the latter days. You see in the end it works out.

 

[Hoshiyya]

I think that your rhetorical questions are rational, but (me being mildly autistic) I don't see where mine might conflict with yours. I am sorry if they have done so.

my questions are not rhetorical. I am asking the people who want to build the 3rd temple now how they plan to do it.

If you do not wish to build the 3rd temple, cool, have a nice day.

But if you do then I ask, are you as willing to fight and die at the hands of muslims, as you are to tell people to build the temple?

For as soon as you even begin to destroy the mosque the retaliation will be extreme.

The Israeli government knows better than to allow the building of the 3rd temple.

 

[Hoshiyya]

answering a question with a question is still a valid answer.

no, because it literally doesn't answer my questions.

based on Sabertooth's reply, can you tell me the answer to my questions? Can you tell whether Sabertooth wants to build on top of the mosque? Can you tell whether he'd stand armed guard? Can you tell whether he thinks the antichrist being worshiped in the temple would defile it or not? Of course you can't, because he didn't answer.

And he is certainly not obligated to answer, but let's not pretend that he did answer.

 

[Hoshiyya]

The events coming to pass that you are questioning are things that are destined to happen. I look at the Temple institute and see the preparations they have made for the return of the daily sacrifices which you correctly note that this is where the antichrist commits the abomination of desolation and can see the event horizon closing in. Christians should be using their understanding of prophecy to sound the alarm that the day of Jacobs trouble is on the horizon. The dilemma with the Temple mount might not be a problem as John in REv was told to measure the Temple but to leave out the outer court as this has been given to the Gentiles. There is a strong case that can be made that the Dome of the Rock sits on top of the Antonio Fortress and that this complex is outside that court. Josephus claimed when coming into Jerusalem you could not see the temple and the dome is now on the hill and would be easily visible. There also is the need for a running stream of water at the temple and the brook of kidron is also just below. As far as bringing these days upon us by supporting or not the issue is really a side issue in my book. The world has to also be corrupt, the church mostly compromises or apostate, Israel hated and abandoned by all nations, a global government with a one world spiritual formation also need arise.
I dialogue with many Jews on a Torah vs Bible page and understand what they are expecting. They will accept the antichrist who will turn on them. We are told all of this in advance and we have no power to accelerate this end or delay it. Satan is the one who meets his end after the 7 years and he certainly knows this as the demons said to Jesus are you going to destroy us before the time. They know there is a time that is coming when they will be judged. Satan like Judas is compelled to follow the script and he is wanting to commit the abomination of desolation and destroy as many as he can. The truth of scripture can be established by how all the prophecy is playing out.
Hos 3 shows the return of the sacrifice is tied to the return of the kingdom which is Jesus at the 2nd coming. 4 For the children of Israel shall abide many days without king or prince, without sacrifice or sacred pillar, without ephod or teraphim. 5 Afterward the children of Israel shall return and seek the LORD their God and David their king. They shall fear the LORD and His goodness in the latter days. You see in the end it works out.

So, in summary, your answer to my first two questions is "the dome of the rock gets to stay, we build beside it" essentially. Great, interesting answer, and it could be phrased as a single short sentence.

I cannot tell whether you answered my last two questions or what the real summary of the answer would be.

I enumerated my questions for a reason.

 

[visionary]

So, in summary, your answer to my first two questions is "the dome of the rock gets to stay, we build beside it" essentially. Great, interesting answer, and it could be phrased as a single short sentence.

I cannot tell whether you answered my last two questions or what the real summary of the answer would be.

I enumerated my questions for a reason.

Isn't there a prophecy about it being built on the side?

 

[Hoshiyya]

Isn't there a prophecy about it being built on the side?

You tell me, provide the quote.

 

[visionary]

You tell me, provide the quote.

I didn't provide the statement.. "the dome of the rock gets to stay, we build beside it"... but would like to see the prophecy that indicates it.

 

[Sabertooth]

no, because it literally doesn't answer my questions.

based on Sabertooth's reply, can you tell me the answer to my questions?

Only my third question [about the Eastern Gate] had such potential. I really do not know if non-Messianic Theology includes the preliminary appearance of an anti-Christ or not. If it does not, your cautions will fall on deaf ears.

 

[Hoshiyya]

Only my third question [about the Eastern Gate] had such potential. I really do not know if non-Messianic Theology includes the preliminary appearance of an anti-Christ or not. If it does not, your cautions will fall on deaf ears.

This is completely non-sequitur to me. If you don't want to answer my questions about the third temple, or if you don't want to build the 3rd temple, fine. If you want to answer, then go ahead, with clarity.

 

[AbbaLove]

This is completely non-sequitur to me. If you don't want to answer my questions about the third temple, or if you don't want to build the 3rd temple, fine. If you want to answer, then go ahead, with clarity.

Are non-member quests allowed to express/teach, but they can ask questions when it comes to
Messianic Judaism's beliefs as to the building of a 3rd Temple? Besides, you've already given your assessment in that other 25 page thread implying that this thread may cause even more chaos
than that previous thread ... Should Messianic Jews support Jerusalem Third Temple? ...

> "River Euphrates" is a religion of Judaism. I don't mean to start something with you, I just have to take the opportunity to mention that THIS is why MJ is chaos, because people just invent stuff.
ProtectionET is not even close to being the worst example of this I've seen I just happened to catch what he wrote about the river Euphrates and found it to be a quintessential example of this type of thing.

No, it sounds like you're trying to build a temple for the antichrist. Hardly something a follower of God should want.

If the antichrist wants a temple, he can build it himself, or if God wants there to be a temple ready for him, he can prepare that.

WHAT on earth are you hoping to accomplish with this new thread ?????????????????

 

[visionary]

And to it the dragon (Satan) gave his power and his throne and great authority. One of its heads seemed to have a mortal wound, but its mortal wound was healed, and the whole earth followed the beast with wonder. Men worshiped the dragon, for he had given his authority to the beast, and they worshiped the beast saving, `Who is like the beast, and who can fight against it?'

Now war arose in heaven, Michael and his angels fighting against the dragon; and the dragon and his angels fought, but they were defeated and there was no longer any place for them in heaven. And the great dragon was thrown down, that ancient serpent, who is called the Devil and Satan, the deceiver of the whole world---he was thrown down to the earth, and his angels were thrown down with him.

 

[Sabertooth]

[Continuing the non-Messianic Judaism angle] if sacrifices are to be resumed in this Temple, it shows that this activity is primarily driven by non-Messianics.

Am I correct in presuming that Messianic Jews do not seek the continuation of sacrifices after Jesus?

The relevance of this to the OP is that I think that you are "preaching to the choir." The people that you are trying to convince [non-Messianics] aren't here [at CF].

 

[Sabertooth]

my questions are not rhetorical...

Socratic, then?

 

[Hoshiyya]

Socratic, then?

No they are literal. I guess we need to go through them one at the time to get an answer from you, assuming you even intend to answer them.

So let's begin....WHERE would you place the temple ?

Again, if you're not interested in this topic then please move on. Please ignore AbbaLove as he is a well-known troll on this forum.