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No offense taken, the stuff i shared is offensive to me and should be to anyone... Rome holds itself above all other authority on earth answering only to God, and scarily they even consider things beyond scripture to be included in the term "word of God"Not sure what you mean by this so forgive if i offend you. Its not my intention, I'm just a little confused in all these posts. I just would like to add this:
The above words concerning the pope are not from the Holy bible, or are they?
The Mormons also have another book they read from besides the Bible, should i use their book or only the Bible that has been around since before the pope and Mormons?
Does the Bible know more than the Pope and the Mormons?
I'm not drawing conclusions, only adding some truth. And also Grace sustains us through this mess. If you Hope in Jesus and forget everything else, it would be better for many, especially non believers as it would remove unnecessary stumbling blocks whether or not those blocks are true or false.
No worries mate.
That is why I asked about the diff between a throne and a chair
Blue Letter Bible - Search Results for KJV
(throne)
occurs 176 times in 159 verses in the KJV
Page 1 / 7 inexact matches (Gen 41:40 - 1Ki 2:33)
Blue Letter Bible - Search Results for KJV
(thrones)
occurs 9 times in 8 verses in the KJV
kings thrones pictures - Google Search
As in the rock of offense?Words should be carefully considered.
Holy Father
Head of the Church
Your sins are forgiven my son.
I must think in all honesty that reform is needed.
Many stumbling blocks must constantly be removed.
Words are ammo for the enemy, we must choose them wisely, and reform is always needed.
Funny how we both metioned stumbling blocks...hmmm
From the Source:Lucius Ferraris "Papa," art. 2, in his Prompta Bibliotheca Canonica, Juridica, Moralis, Theologica, Ascetica, Polemica, Rubristica, Historica. ("Handy Library"), Vol. 5, published in Petit-Montrouge (Paris) by J. P. Migne, 1858 edition, column 1823, Latin.
#1. "The Pope is of so great dignity and so exalted that he is not mere man, but as it were God, and the vicar of God."
#13. "Hence the Pope is crowned with a triple crown, as king of heaven and of earth and of the lower regions."
#18. "As to papal authority, the Pope is as it were God on earth, Sole sovereign of all the faithful of Christ, chief king of kings, having a plentitude of unbroken power, entrusted by the omnipotent God to govern the earthly and heavenly kingdoms."
#30. "The Pope is of so great authority and power, that he is able to modify, declare, or interpret even divine laws."
Also from the bull unam sanctum
'Behold to-day I have placed you over nations, and over kingdoms' and the rest. Therefore, if the terrestrial power err, it will be judged by the spiritual power; but if a minor spiritual power err, it will be judged by a superior spiritual power; but if the highest power of all err, it can be judged only by God, and not by man, according to the testimony of the Apostle: '
From what I have heard, Calvinism [esp. ultra Cavlinists] do not see much difference between Catholicism/EOism and Mormonism....they view each as a "cult"....sad but true*snip*
I would Like to say that this mess concerning Catholic and Mormon teaching that is not found in the Bible and that are the very own words of God Himself that everyone does agree with which is the Gospel of Christ is watered down with theses stumbling blocks.
I would Like to say that this mess concerning Catholic and Mormon teaching that is not found in the Bible and that are the very own words of God Himself that everyone does agree with which is the Gospel of Christ is watered down with these stumbling blocks known as other books not being the Gospel of Christ. The Gospel is the Word we should be teaching, forget your other books. God commands it i think, its HIS Will that the Gospel is our teaching without any stumbling blocks. may HIS will be done and not ours.
And i would like to add this as well:
Now the Spirit speaketh expressly, that in the latter times some shall depart from the faith, giving heed to seducing spirits, and doctrines of devils; speaking lies in hypocrisy; having their conscience seared with a hot iron; forbidding to marry, and commanding to abstain from meats, which God hath created to be received with thanksgiving of them which believe and know the truth. For every creature of God is good, and nothing to be refused, if it be received with thanksgiving: for it is sanctified by the word of God and prayer.
I'm not saying your books are false, Just that they are not the Gospel and anything but the Gospel of Christ is all we should be teaching. Will you seek anything but the Gospel?
Is that the official position of the Catholic Church or the official position of Lucius Ferraris?
-CryptoLutheran
It's almost like all bishops have a cathedra--chair--in their cathedrals. Almost as though it were to symbolize their episcopal authority.
All bishops have a chair or "throne". It's a symbol of their ecclesiastic office. That's why a cathedral is called a cathedral, it's where the bishop's cathedra is located. The Pope has one too, because he's the Bishop of Rome and Patriarch of the West, it's about as scandalous and shocking as the fact that cats have whiskers and birds lay eggs.
-CryptoLutheran
Simonthezealot cites pretty much anything that will confirm his preconceptions. Doesn't matter how out of context it happens to be. "Catholics think the Pope is God" has been dealt with so many times it's not even funny. Kind of convenient how he provides no actual link to the source and how they're all one-liners replicated over anti-Catholic sites, isn't it?
The idea of "Priesthood" under the New Testament is wrong to began with (and I mean in the sense of the way the Catholics has it laid out). The only priesthood we see in the New Testament is when Christ is considered the Great High Priest (Hebrews 4:14) and that the church is considered a "Royal priesthood" (1 Peter 2:9). There are no other priesthoods. Whether they do something that is voluntary or not, the idea of priesthood given in the new testament is not there.It's not exactly like the Catholic Church is putting a gun at people's heads, telling them they can't get married and to join the priesthood. There is a discipline of priestly celibacy in the Latin Rite of the Roman Catholic Church, those who decide to become priests are making a personal vow to remain celibate.
As noted, there are married Catholic priests. Only the Latin Rite maintains celibacy as a discipline, the Byzantine Rite and other Eastern Rite Catholics can be married. There is also a special dispensation for Anglican priests coming over to the Catholic Church, as such there are a number of Catholic priests of the Latin Rite that are married due to that dispensation.
We can argue over it all we want, but nobody is forcing anybody to or not to do anything on this issue. The passage has nothing to do with volunteer celibacy.
-CryptoLutheran
Allow me to me reiterate the truth.
and again
Those chairs are still a bit fancy wouldn't you say? I wonder if Peter had a throne?
The idea of "Priesthood" under the New Testament is wrong to began with (and I mean in the sense of the way the Catholics has it laid out). The only priesthood we see in the New Testament is when Christ is considered the Great High Priest (Hebrews 4:14) and that the church is considered a "Royal priesthood" (1 Peter 2:9). There are no other priesthoods. Whether they do something that is voluntary or not, the idea of priesthood given in the new testament is not there.
But you guys might NOW let "Priest" marry (again, Priest is not even a leadership role in new testament given to man), but that was not always the case. And you can see that by just looking throughout history on the amount of priest that you have that were not married.
As he stated it holds the churches imprimature.Is that the official position of the Catholic Church or the official position of Lucius Ferraris?
-CryptoLutheran
I don't know why you're saying "you guys". I'm not Catholic. I don't call my pastor a priest to begin with.
Though, for what it's worth, here's an etymology lesson:
Presbyteros is the Greek word that gets translated as "elder" in the New Testament. The word was brought into use in Latin from the Greek and so we get the word presbyter. In English this was shortened to prestor, and eventually became the English word "priest".
In Greek, Christian priests are still called presbyteroi.
-CryptoLutheran
No, traditions says that Peter was married.Jesus was God and I'm pretty sure your traitions teach that Peter was celibate.
It is by choice for all Catholics, whether they are clergy or not.As for Paul and the other bishops, if they were like Paul, it was by choice.
Yes. He was married before Jesus chose him. Scripture tells of his Mother-in-law.Wasn't Peter married?
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