So why are worship leaders afraid to branch out of certain styles??

[YeshuaTourniquet]

And the scripture you use to back this up would be...?

Either you have the Holy Spirit or you don't. There's nothing in the Bible about "opening up to the Holy Spirit's presence". And there's certainly nothing in the Bible to suggest that that's the role of worship.

WarEagle: that's not what i meant exactly, i'm not saying thats the only reason for it's existence, because it's not, it's reason is to simply praise G-d

what i meant was plenty of people go to church and aren't comftable at first, the worship music is sort of an ice-breaker to lead to the deeper worship that comes later. being "open to the holy spirit" isn't the same as inviting it into your heart or into the service, it's everything about freeing your mind, casting off everything from the week that may still be on your mind that will distract you from the worship, in that sense it's an aid to the actual worship and that's what i was getting at......

 

[WarEagle]

WarEagle: that's not what i meant exactly, i'm not saying thats the only reason for it's existence, because it's not, it's reason is to simply praise G-d

what i meant was plenty of people go to church and aren't comftable at first, the worship music is sort of an ice-breaker to lead to the deeper worship that comes later. being "open to the holy spirit" isn't the same as inviting it into your heart or into the service, it's everything about freeing your mind, casting off everything from the week that may still be on your mind that will distract you from the worship, in that sense it's an aid to the actual worship and that's what i was getting at......

Let me know when you find that scripture.

 

[YeshuaTourniquet]

i already told you that was based on observation, music can help get you in the right place mentally to worship
i never said that was the sole reason for it's existence
what exactly am i contradicting scriptually?

 

[WarEagle]

i already told you that was based on observation

So, do we base worship on scripture? Or on your observations?

i never said that was the sole reason for it's existence

You did say that the purpose of worship music is to "get you to relax and open up to the Holy Spirit's presence.

what exactly am i contradicting scriptually?

For one, that the purpose of worship is to "get you to relax".

 

[YeshuaTourniquet]

again you are picking and choosing what you want to hear

1)i never said we shoulden't base worship on scripture

2)i didn't say that was it's purpose, i said it HELPS open ones heart and get their mind in the right place to worship

and 3) i never said the purpose of worship is to get you to relax

if your going to quote me, then atleast do it in the context that i said it in

ps: what exactly is posative and supportive about us arguing? i don't hold any hostility towards you but i question why you feel the need to attack someone else over a simple statement

 

[WarEagle]

again you are picking and choosing what you want to hear

1)i never said we shoulden't base worship on scripture

I didn't say you did. I asked you what scripture you based your claims on, to which you responded that it is not scripture, but your own observation.

I followed up by asking which standard we're to follow: God's word or your observations.

2)i didn't say that was it's purpose, i said it HELPS open ones heart and get their mind in the right place to worship

Here we go. Post #19, I believe:

worship music has 2 reasons for being, 1) to worship the lord and 2) to get you to relax and open up to the Holy Spirit's presence

Please note the underlined.

and 3) i never said the purpose of worship is to get you to relax

OK. Here you go. Post #19, I believe:

worship music has 2 reasons for being, 1) to worship the lord and 2) to get you to relax and open up to the Holy Spirit's presence

Please note the underlined.

if your going to quote me, then atleast do it in the context that i said it in

I quoted you directly, using your own words. Please feel free to explain what part you feel I've taken out of context.

i question why you feel the need to attack someone else over a simple statement

I question why you feel the need to falsely accuse me of attacking anyone.

 

[YeshuaTourniquet]

ok this is getting childish now, if i worded post 19 in a way that didn't fully express how i felt then i apologize, however i explained what i meant in my later posts so that should have been the end of it

you have again misquoted me despite your claim of the contrary, "releax and open to the Holy Spirit" isnt the same as "relax" , relax means exactly that, to just relax, relax and open to the holy spirit means to get whatever worldy matters that may be on your heart off and focus purely on the worship, and therefore focus on G-d, how is that wrong?

i didn't falsely acuse you of anything, your the one that pounced on me the second i posted

i'm not going to change your mind about what i said. i said what i said and that's all, and this isn't worth arguing over anymore

even if you disagree with everything i say, your still my brother in Messiah so why argue on something that isn't even a salvation issue?

as soon as i post this i know your going to say something back, probabaly attacking me again over this message and take everything out of context again, this is a no win, so i'm not going to reply to this thread again nor am i even going to read it, because honistly, who needs such negativity?

this is the problem with the church as a whole right now, too much bickering and hostility, this is why i choose not to be part of any mainstream church

 

[WarEagle]

you have again misquoted

How can I have misquoted you when I copied and pasted your own words from post #19? I quoted you ver batem.

i didn't falsely acuse you of anything

You did, actually. You claimed that I attacked you, when the truth is that I've been very polite to you.

even if you disagree with everything i say, your still my brother in Messiah so why argue on something that isn't even a salvation issue?

Because, in the Bible, God is rather specific about the way He wants to be worshipped.

as soon as i post this i know your going to say something back, probabaly attacking me again

When have I ever attacked you? Like I said, I believe anyone reading my posts will see that, far from attacking you, I've been very polite to you.

Perhaps you just have a guilty conscience?

over this message and take everything out of context again

I invited you to back up your claim that I took you out of context. If you're unable to show that I've taken you out of context, then it's dishonest of you to continue to claim so.

this is the problem with the church as a whole right now, too much bickering and hostility, this is why i choose not to be part of any mainstream church

"I choose not to be a part of any mainstream church". Now we see the crux of the problem.

 

[BrBob]

Trollish behavior.....

 

[Alejandro]

This is so typical.

 

[BergySmalls]

So, do we base worship on scripture? Or on your observations?

Just to clarify things for the sake of people wanting to weigh in on this subject, what scriptures do you use to define worship WarEagle? No attack here, I just hate to comment on something that I don't know the ground rule for. We can't have a discussion about worship if we haven't defined worship.

 

[Jenster]

To the OP, I think worship leaders are not always familiar with other styles beyond one or two. I've tried to introduce a R&B-type song and instrumentalists don't know how to voice it. So that could lead to frustration.

But I think you're asking more about why do they refuse to or shy away from it, as if other styles are not "holy." I believe some leaders are afraid their congregations won't be able to follow along -- and worship is supposed to lead congregation members in praising God, yes? There's a learning curve.

Or some people think the non-boring styles are calling attention to the band, not to the Lord. Like, "Hey, look! We're playing reggae and we're cool!" Now I do not personally subscribe to this view because good music is good music, and praiseworthy. However, there is some basis for the fear because I *have* seen some musicians with the seemingly wrong attitudes use worship time to show off their skills. (This was the observation of several people, not just myself.)

Which is to say, if you think that worship leaders should be more open, perhaps you could offer them training in various styles. There's nothing like inspiration and seeing a role model to help people realize the possibilties.

Grace and peace.

 

[underthesouthercross]

yeh i would say this...is because some people are afraid of going outside their comfort zone...you see if you are a worship leader and your playing a song or a type of song you really know your going to struggle with...doesnt make the leader look very good...or nearly as confident as he usually should be...
but this really a thing everyone needs to master but of the change of music these day compared to 10 years ago...but you can adjust to it...its not impossible..all thing are possible through Christ...

 

[LeadWorship]

Edited to not be targeting any single person

Agreed, Br. Bob. Some folks like this also pops into the other section here I frequent (SF/PC) and causes nothing but trouble. It's my opinion that their desire is to disrupt and divide, which is not Kingdom work. We must remember to pick and choose our fights, because some have already been won. Greater is He that is in me, than he that is in the world.

 

[BergySmalls]

Agreed, Br. Bob. This guy also pops into the other section here I frequent and causes nothing but trouble. It's apparent that their desire is to disrupt and divide, which is not Kingdom work. We must remember to pick and choose our fights, because some have already been won. Greater is He that is in me, than he that is in the world.

Amen. Seemed to just want to shoot down rather than actually discuss.

 

[WarEagle]

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[BergySmalls]

WarEagle, do you post things other than single line comments and questions of other people's posts? During this thread, all I have observed you do is break down people's posts line by line with more questions, without really brining any of your thoughts or information to the table. That doesn't seem very constructive.

 

[WarEagle]

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[LeadWorship]

I drew my conclusion from threads such as your "heresy hunting is biblical" stance in this thread http://foru.ms/t6250060 which was edited out by Pam. I'll edit my post above, to take offensive things out. My apologies, I just get defensive of my brothers and sisters when I feel people are being insensitive in nature towards them.

 

[WarEagle]

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