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So did Trump only help to boost Kim's image on the world stage?
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<blockquote data-quote="dgiharris" data-source="post: 73722194" data-attributes="member: 322579"><p>We have got to stop playing tic-tac-toe when we need to be playing chess...</p><p></p><p>#1) NK has nuclear weapons. Every intelligence agency on the planet believes this to be true. So their development of NK isn't that big a deal, cats already out of the bag.</p><p>#2) In the entire history of totalitarian regimes, being poor has never stopped nuclear development or military buildup. Nations always find a way and totalitarian regimes have no problem starving their own people in order to fund their military. </p><p>#3) NK is never ever going to use nuclear weapons, to do so would be to sign their own death warrants. Similarly, with US, China, Russia, and India detection systems, Intel, etc we'd know if they were seriously going to use nukes. Either way, they will never use them.</p><p></p><p>So what does all of the above mean in terms of long term strategy?</p><p></p><p>Firstly, NK is never giving up nukes, they can't. To give up nukes would be to give up their own sovereignty because the West would just invade them. They know it, we know it, everyone knows it. Donald threatened them with nuclear annihilation several times. So again, in what sane world would NK ever give up nukes. They can't. </p><p></p><p>So where does that leave us? Strategically, why don't we just treat NK like we treat every other nation with nukes? If "we" as in "the West" want to "defeat" NK then we really should follow the model that defeated the USSR and China... ECONOMICS</p><p></p><p>We need to introduce Capitalism to NK, or rather, we need to facilitate an environment in which NK benefits economically from Capitalism. We need to turn NK into consumers and in order to do that we need to lift the sanctions.</p><p></p><p>but but but... that means NK will have more money for their military and nukes program right?</p><p></p><p>Yes. Absolutely, and SO WHAT!!!!</p><p></p><p>They already have nukes, their military is inferior, they will NEVER EVER USE NUKES. So who cares? I'm being serious. Logically think it through... If NK could triple their military might and advance their technology by 20 years and triple the amount of nukes they had then NOTHING WOULD CHANGE. It would not make one iota of difference. This is a giant red herring. </p><p></p><p>However, what would happen to NK's internal socio-economic-political culture if the standard of living in their country doubled or tripled (which would be easy to do because they are so dirt poor)? What would happen if their people stopped starving and actually had running water and electricity 24/7? What sort of pressure could that apply to NK's leadership? </p><p></p><p>Part of the problem is that we in the West our blinded by our Puritan roots... We want Kim Jung Un to be "punished". We do NOT want the leadership of NK to prosper. However, those emotional responses are keeping us from seeing the bigger picture. </p><p></p><p>What we have been doing has NOT BEEN WORKING. For as long as living memory, NK has remained the same. They have no commodity to trade other than Saber Rattling and Instability. They trade in terror. If we want things to change we need to change the environment. We need to look at what happened in Russia and China and learn from that. We need to get the North Koreans fat and happy and addicted to McDonalds and Starbucks and watching our Marvel Movies and listening to our Rap Music. That is where we beat, we infect them with our culture and economics just as we've infected everyone else with our fat, lazy, spoiled bratty culture. Once the infection takes root and you incubate with a Decade or two of Capitalism they will be powerless to stop the internal changes which will reek havoc on their system</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="dgiharris, post: 73722194, member: 322579"] We have got to stop playing tic-tac-toe when we need to be playing chess... #1) NK has nuclear weapons. Every intelligence agency on the planet believes this to be true. So their development of NK isn't that big a deal, cats already out of the bag. #2) In the entire history of totalitarian regimes, being poor has never stopped nuclear development or military buildup. Nations always find a way and totalitarian regimes have no problem starving their own people in order to fund their military. #3) NK is never ever going to use nuclear weapons, to do so would be to sign their own death warrants. Similarly, with US, China, Russia, and India detection systems, Intel, etc we'd know if they were seriously going to use nukes. Either way, they will never use them. So what does all of the above mean in terms of long term strategy? Firstly, NK is never giving up nukes, they can't. To give up nukes would be to give up their own sovereignty because the West would just invade them. They know it, we know it, everyone knows it. Donald threatened them with nuclear annihilation several times. So again, in what sane world would NK ever give up nukes. They can't. So where does that leave us? Strategically, why don't we just treat NK like we treat every other nation with nukes? If "we" as in "the West" want to "defeat" NK then we really should follow the model that defeated the USSR and China... ECONOMICS We need to introduce Capitalism to NK, or rather, we need to facilitate an environment in which NK benefits economically from Capitalism. We need to turn NK into consumers and in order to do that we need to lift the sanctions. but but but... that means NK will have more money for their military and nukes program right? Yes. Absolutely, and SO WHAT!!!! They already have nukes, their military is inferior, they will NEVER EVER USE NUKES. So who cares? I'm being serious. Logically think it through... If NK could triple their military might and advance their technology by 20 years and triple the amount of nukes they had then NOTHING WOULD CHANGE. It would not make one iota of difference. This is a giant red herring. However, what would happen to NK's internal socio-economic-political culture if the standard of living in their country doubled or tripled (which would be easy to do because they are so dirt poor)? What would happen if their people stopped starving and actually had running water and electricity 24/7? What sort of pressure could that apply to NK's leadership? Part of the problem is that we in the West our blinded by our Puritan roots... We want Kim Jung Un to be "punished". We do NOT want the leadership of NK to prosper. However, those emotional responses are keeping us from seeing the bigger picture. What we have been doing has NOT BEEN WORKING. For as long as living memory, NK has remained the same. They have no commodity to trade other than Saber Rattling and Instability. They trade in terror. If we want things to change we need to change the environment. We need to look at what happened in Russia and China and learn from that. We need to get the North Koreans fat and happy and addicted to McDonalds and Starbucks and watching our Marvel Movies and listening to our Rap Music. That is where we beat, we infect them with our culture and economics just as we've infected everyone else with our fat, lazy, spoiled bratty culture. Once the infection takes root and you incubate with a Decade or two of Capitalism they will be powerless to stop the internal changes which will reek havoc on their system [/QUOTE]
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So did Trump only help to boost Kim's image on the world stage?
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