Slander and murder, do you still support Israel's actions?

Aryeh Jay said:

Lawrence died in 1935. Oil was discovered in Saudi Arabia 3 years later in 1938. Why would Lawrence negotiate with the big oil companies? Revisionist history perhaps?

Click to expand...

• In March of 1908, after years of difficult conditions and failure, geologist George Bernard Reynolds discovered oil in Persia (modern-day Iran).
• A year later, an oil company in the UK, Burmah Oil, created a subsidiary company to develop oil production in Persia, the Anglo-Persian Oil Company (APOC), which started volume production of oil by 1913.
• Britain’s Royal Navy was under the leadership of Winston Churchill, who wanted to shift its fuel source from coal to oil. The Navy thus became the company’s major customer and a de facto hidden power behind its success.
• Iranian popular opposition to the APOC’s royalty terms whereby Iran only received 16% of net profits was widespread and created political discontent throughout the country.

Click to expand...

The San Remo conference (1920) had stipulated that Iraqis should be allowed 20% of the company if they wanted to invest in it, but the existing shareholders successfully resisted Iraqi efforts to participate, despite pressure by the British government to accept Iraqi shareholders.

Click to expand...

CRAZY_CAT_WOMAN said:

I thought Hamas started the Israeli war.

Click to expand...

Bob Crowley said:

Southern Iran had oil and it was under the control of the British. The British navy had switched from coal to oil and much of it came from Iran, which is in the Middle East if not Arabic.

The Discovery of Oil in the Middle East | History of Western Civilization II

courses.lumenlearning.com

The first productive oil wells in Iraq were drilled in 1927. Although the earlier San Remo Conference of 1920 stated Iraqis should be allowed 20% of the relevant oil company if they wanted to invest, existing shareholders kept them out (most likely American and other shareholders).

Conference of San Remo | League of Nations, Treaty of Sevres, Mandates System | Britannica

Conference of San Remo, (April 19–26, 1920), international meeting convened at San Remo, on the Italian Riviera, to decide the future of the former territories of the Ottoman Turkish Empire, one of the defeated Central Powers in World War I; it was attended by the prime ministers of Great Britain,

www.britannica.com

TE Lawrence's main concern was Arab independence. Granted the huge oil reserves of Saudi Arabia weren't discoverd till 1938, but the British controlled Iranian oil and the amount the Iranians received for their national resource.

Click to expand...

Hazelelponi said:

Well don't worry we showed them what happens to people who don't give us everything we think we deserve... We install extremists over their people to keep them in line, and keep them away from our oil profits.

Fixed those people right up. How dare anyone decide to nationalize their own oil when we found it for them.

Click to expand...

Mohammad Mossadegh became Prime Minister of Iran in 1951 and was hugely popular for taking a stand against the Anglo-Iranian Oil Company, a British-owned oil company that had made huge profits while paying Iran only 16% of its profits and often far less. His nationalization efforts led the British government to begin planning to remove him from power. In October 1952, Mosaddegh declared Britain an enemy and cut all diplomatic relations. Britain was unable to resolve the issue unilaterally and looked towards the United States for help. However, the U.S. had opposed British policies; Secretary of State Dean Acheson said the British had “a rule-or-ruin policy in Iran.”

That changed after Dwight D. Eisenhower was elected President in 1952. Now, pleas from British intelligence officials and Winston Churchill to oust Mossadegh had a more receptive audience. Beginning in January 1953, the U.S. and the Britain agreed to work together toward Mosaddegh’s removal.

Click to expand...

Bob Crowley said:

The Australian Government supported a UN sponsored ceasefire.

For doing that the Israeli Ambassador criticised the Australian Government.

‘Shockingly amateurish’: Australian government delivers veiled rebuke to Israel over UN agency comments

Exclusive: Canberra insider hits back at Amir Maimon who accused Australia of forgetting ‘Hamas culpability’ for 7 October attacks

www.theguardian.com

If you so much as differ from the official Israeli line, you're likely to be slandered.

Israel was established in 1948 because the West had a guilty conscience about the way Europeans had treated the Jews.

Click to expand...

Bob Crowley said:

Way back after World War I TE Lawrence (Lawrence of Arabia) pleaded with western colonial powers and the big oil companies to give the Arabs independence and a share in the oil proceeds. But no, the Arabs were going to get nothing!

To rub salt into the wound, the West enforced Zionist sovereignty on Palestine, which was Arab by that time and had been for centuries.

The problems in the Middle East didn't start in 1948.

Click to expand...

Landon Caeli said:

Well, I'll never apologize for 1930's people. I never knew them, and I don't mean that literally, I mean it spiritually and literally.

As far as blaming the West, forget it! Not happening.

Click to expand...

BCP1928 said:

It is happening. Plenty of people are blaming the West as being complicit--and with good reason.

Click to expand...

Hazelelponi said:

Well don't worry we showed them what happens to people who don't give us everything we think we deserve... We install extremists over their people to keep them in line, and keep them away from our oil profits.

Fixed those people right up. How dare anyone decide to nationalize their own oil when we found it for them. they should be grateful for anything we determine to give them, how dare anyone demand more fairness.

Now they have something to think about the next time their sister is raped for not wearing hijab probably, for generations to come. Shoulda, woulda, coulda.. maybe next time they will do as they are told by their betters.

Click to expand...

Landon Caeli said:

Then we'll double-down. And do it again.

Click to expand...

BCP1928 said:

I take it you believe that the carving up of Ottoman territories by the Western Powers after WWI was entirely just and equitable?

Click to expand...

Landon Caeli said:

No, I just think if you're going to include me, a Westerner, in that, then I have no choice but to embrace who I am.

Click to expand...

Landon Caeli said:

...It's the lesson that never gets learned - blaming an entire group, for the flaws of a select few.

Click to expand...

BCP1928 said:

If, when I talk about Western Powers having a hand in creating the present mess by their actions before you were born I mean you, personally, then you identify sufficiently as a Westerner to bear some of the blame.

We can name names, if you want (Sykes, Picot, Allenby, the board of directors of the Anglo-Iranian oil company, etc.) but it is more convenient just to call them the Western Powers. No one but a fool whoud think we were blaming all of the citizens of those powers at the time and their descendants as well.

Click to expand...

Landon Caeli said:

Well, we've seen this before, when people talk about today's people making reparations to the descendants of black slaves. So I'm leary on whether you're serious about blaming the descendants or not.

Click to expand...

Landon Caeli said:

That's why our choice of words is important.

Click to expand...

Landon Caeli said:

Essentially, I'm a colonizing, slave holding, Indian slaying, indulgence selling, etc, etc....

Where do I go from here? I am BAD.

Click to expand...

BCP1928 said:

Why do you feel you need to take responsibility for all that?

Click to expand...