Sin Backwards

[KCDAD]

How many?

All I ask is you look at the exceptions to the rule... Jonah is a clear case of a prophet sent by God who verbatum gives God's message of destruction to Ninevah and "God changes his mind" and decides not to go through with the prophesy.... HOW CAN THAT BE?

Prophesy does not have to be true.

Prophesy does not have to be predictive.

God can change his mind. He is not unchanging through the ages. (I guess that means God is capable of learning)

 

[non-religious]

[KCDAD]
Prophesy does not have to be true.

Not sure about this one What would be the purpose of false prophecy?

 

[KCDAD]

Not sure about this one What would be the purpose of false prophecy?

Instruction, open the eyes of the blind, scare the doo doo out of people...

I don't know, ask Jonah.

 

[Cleany]

Not sure about this one What would be the purpose of false prophecy?

that isnt the point.

its not about being false or true, its not actually about predicting the future.

only a small portion of prophecy, in spiritual terms, is about predicting the future. prophecy is generally a term to mean god speaking through a man.

 

[KCDAD]

that isnt the point.

its not about being false or true, its not actually about predicting the future.

only a small portion of prophecy, in spiritual terms, is about predicting the future. prophecy is generally a term to mean god speaking through a man.

DING DING DING... give the man in the glasses a ceegar.

 

[non-religious]

[Cleany]

its not about being false or true, its not actually about predicting the future.

Listen I'm not trying to be difficult here, but I still don't see how this can be. I would argue that prophecy has very much to do with predicting future events and if someone claims to be a prophet and speaks lies where is the benefit or what purpose does that serve?

The answer I was previously given didn't make sense...
God doesn't lie...

 

[stumpjumper]

Listen I'm not trying to be difficult here, but I still don't see how this can be. I would argue that prophecy has very much to do with predicting future events and if someone claims to be a prophet and speaks lies where is the benefit or what purpose does that serve?

The answer I was previously given didn't make sense...
God doesn't lie...

Even from the perspective of Orthodox Christianity prophecy is not really about predicting the future... Take Isaiah for instance. Isaiah called for change in his day and Jesus based a lot of his ministry upon the teachings of Isaiah.

Here is Isaiah 61:

The Spirit of the Lord GOD is upon me; because the LORD hath anointed me to preach good tidings unto the meek; he hath sent me to bind up the brokenhearted, to proclaim liberty to the captives, and the opening of the prison to them that are bound; To proclaim the acceptable year of the LORD, and the day of vengeance of our God; to comfort all that mourn; To appoint unto them that mourn in Zion, to give unto them beauty for ashes, the oil of joy for mourning, the garment of praise for the spirit of heaviness; that they might be called trees of righteousness, the planting of the LORD, that he might be glorified.
And they shall build the old wastes, they shall raise up the former desolations, and they shall repair the waste cities, the desolations of many generations. And strangers shall stand and feed your flocks, and the sons of the alien shall be your plowmen and your vinedressers. But ye shall be named the Priests of the LORD: men shall call you the Ministers of our God: ye shall eat the riches of the Gentiles, and in their glory shall ye boast yourselves.
For your shame ye shall have double; and for confusion they shall rejoice in their portion: therefore in their land they shall possess the double: everlasting joy shall be unto them. For I the LORD love judgment, I hate robbery for burnt offering; and I will direct their work in truth, and I will make an everlasting covenant with them. And their seed shall be known among the Gentiles, and their offspring among the people: all that see them shall acknowledge them, that they are the seed which the LORD hath blessed. I will greatly rejoice in the LORD, my soul shall be joyful in my God; for he hath clothed me with the garments of salvation, he hath covered me with the robe of righteousness, as a bridegroom decketh himself with ornaments, and as a bride adorneth herself with her jewels. For as the earth bringeth forth her bud, and as the garden causeth the things that are sown in it to spring forth; so the Lord GOD will cause righteousness and praise to spring forth before all the nations.
​

Now some of the specifics about Jesus being born of a virgin and the suffering servant passages come from Isaiah as well but that does not mean that Isaiah predicted that those passages would neccesarily apply to the ministry of Jesus in the future. It is from the present looking back that they do apply but that does not mean that the author intended it to be so...

Because the authors of scripture were moved by the Holy Spirit there might be meanings in scripture that we do not recognize until the time comes when it is applicable. But, that means that prophecies are not about predicting future events but that they have things to say about all times and places...

This probably doesn't make a lick of sense..

 

[KCDAD]

How many?[FONT=verdana,Arial][FONT=verdana,Arial][/FONT][/FONT]

Well, I guess they would ALL have to be listed here. Even one would disprove your theory if it proved to be false. Like Jonah (again).
God condemned... man communicated, the bad guys repent and God "changed his mind" ... now the prophet is miffed because he ends up in a 4 chapter book rather than one of 66 like the great prophet Isaiah. He looked like a false prophet although he was ACTUALLY ONE OF THE MOST SUCCESSFUL!

 

[Cleany]

Listen I'm not trying to be difficult here, but I still don't see how this can be. I would argue that prophecy has very much to do with predicting future events and if someone claims to be a prophet and speaks lies where is the benefit or what purpose does that serve?

The answer I was previously given didn't make sense...
God doesn't lie...

it has to do with the gifts of the holy spirit and the meaning of the word "prohecy" and "prophet".

look at the old testament books of prophecy - what are they about? you will find that they are mostly god communicating with the nation of israel, saying things like" you have been bad", "i love you", "i will punish you", "i will not punish you", "stop opressing people", "attack this nation". the notion of prophecy being mainly about predicting the future is one that belongs to our culture, not biblical culture.

it is the same with the spiritual gifts in the context of the church. the "prophetic gifts" refer to declaring what is on the heart of god, with the same type of messages found in the old testament, with warnings, message of love, and declarations of gods glory. statements about the future are of course included in this, but even in the bible you will find many instances of "precictions" that do not come true. why? because god seeks to interact with the human race, not make them fearful or superstitious.

i will add an extra note about the supposed prophecies that predict jesus. it is believed by many biblical scholars that these were written into the new testament by the writers. why? to give a jewish framework and foundation for the new testament. as the christian religion grew out of the jewish religion they wanted to show the jews how jesus was relevant to them. only a modern obsession with "facts" will see this as being deceitful. it was simply the practice to show new things in the light of the old.

christianity, and judaism are religions of faith. it is not valid to say that the purpose of prophecy is to "prove" in some way the validity of the gospel or gods messsage. the old and new testamens presuppose some faith in the reader. this doesnt mean that you need to be a christian or jew to read the bible, but it is intended that the faithful are able and willing to integrate stories and messages of gods dealings with people of a different culture or time into their own faith, as ones who are in communication with god, as they were.