Sicko Literature In Our Schools

[coastie]

What. . . . you guys can not be serious. Lord of the Flies is an excellent book, I read it when I was 10.

Schools should only stock age appropriate books and schools and libraries should have have systems to prevent a 6 year old reading things more suited to a 13 year old. But other then that banning books is wrong. Plus it has the side affect of making the banned book very desirable. I know a little girl whose parents banned Harry Potter so she went to her friends house and read it. As far as I'm aware she's not become disruptive, disobdeiant, has not tried to perform magic, has no interest in the occult, and is very aware that the book is a work of fiction i.e is not real.

I agree, a lot people do get worked up about some of these books while the real problems sneak by unnoticed.

I recently read a list of America's most controversial books, which included such shocking books like Where's Waldo, To Kill a Mocking bird, James and the Giant Peach.

Where's waldo? I can't explain that one. To Kill a Mocking Bird in my humble opinion is one of the greatest and most influencial works of contemporary American Litterature. It has become contreversial because the audience that it has been introduced to has been so "sensitized" to racial remarks and words that when the n-word is in litterature (even anti-racism/pro-civil rights greats like the aforestated novel) everybody freaks out like they have been personally persecuted.

With James and the Giant Peach, educators have targetted too young an audience. Kind of like Disney has with movies like Bambi, Lion King, Finding Nemo, and one or two others where the parents are killed off in the story. It's like saying to yourself "What is the most disturbing and frighteneing thing to a young child?"

The key for this sort of thing is all in choosing your audience.

And two books on puberty for boys and girls respectively. I have more then half the books on the list in my personal collection and I hope very much my children will read them in due time.

Puberty books should be handled by parents in my opinion. If you think it ok for your kid to read it, then allow him/her to do so. These books do need some sort of regulation at the junior high age groups levels since these kids are so impressionable about sex at this age... and REALLY curious.

You guys worry too much, you need to relax, and reading these things will probably be good for you, maybe open your minds a little. And for the person who learned about and disaproved of paganism, well bully, I learned about paganism, hindu, judaism, islam, buddhism, sikhims, as well as christianity and I'm glad I learned about all these different religions, the british school system teaches children about different religions too, my childrens schools celebrate muslim and hindu festivals as well as christian. I'm more then happy about this, at least it's ensuring my children DONT turn out narrow minded xenophobes.

I can understand why you think that it takes well rounded understanding of other religions to keep kids from becoming xenophobic. For the sake of a good example, I will use the method of teaching kids about world religions in some California High Schools as a good example of screwing it up . The biggest problem I have is the kids celebrating pagan holidays such as winter solstice as a class.

My children will take no part in this sort of thing. As a Christian I do not recognize other religion's holidays. I also don't recognize Italian national holidays. Why? Because I'm niether and Italian nor am I Pagan, Jewish, Muslim, Hindu or Sikh. The Jewish kids at my high school didn't celebrate at Christmas parties with us, so eventually, the school eliminated Christmas parties and had "winter break celebrations." I was sad to see my Christmas Parties go, but even as a litle kid, I understood why and thought that it was fair. There was no mention of any coinciding holidays from staff during these parties and all of the students felt that this party wa as much for them as for the others.



That in itself is niether narrow minded nor xenophobic.

 

[Athene]

Puberty books should be handled by parents in my opinion. If you think it okfor your kid to read it, then allow him/her to do so. These books do need some sort of regulation at the junior high age groups levels since these kids are so impressionable about sex at this age... and REALLY curious.

I do agree with you, but in my experience sometimes kids are too shy to talk to their parents, and there are even parents who will not talk to their children about this. School libraries should stock books on puberty, there are many good books out there which cover this.

I can understand why you think that it takes well rounded understanding of other religions to keep kids from becoming xenophobic. For the sake of a good example, I will use the method of teaching kids about world religions in some California High Schools as a good example of screwing it up . The biggest problem I have is the kids celebrating pagan holidays such as winter solstice as a class.

Being british I don't know anything about California High schools, or a great deal about California other then it is in America and alot of American teen movies seem to be set there. My mothers pagan so I tend to keep my opinions of paganism to myself.

My children will take no part in this sort of thing. As a Christian I do not recognize other religion's holidays. I also don't recognize Italian national holidays. Why? Because I'm niether and Italian nor am I Pagan, Jewish, Muslim, Hindu or Sikh. The Jewish kids at my high school didn't celebrate at Christmas parties with us, so eventually, the school eliminated Christmas parties and had "winter break celebrations." I was sad to see my Christmas Parties go, but even as a litle kid, I understood why and thought that it was fair. There was no mention of any coinciding holidays from staff during these parties and all of the students felt that this party wa as much for them as for the others.

I don't believe that being christians disqualifies us from celebrating other religions festivals.
My Friend: Come and celebrate Eid with me and my family
Me: No I'm a christian and you and your beliefs are repungant to me!
or alternatively
Me: I would love too, what time shall I be round
(and thus by showing acceptance and love, Athene brings the kingdom of God into their lives )

 

[coastie]

I don't believe that being christians disqualifies us from celebrating other religions festivals.
My Friend: Come and celebrate Eid with me and my family
Me: No I'm a christian and you and your beliefs are repungant to me!
or alternatively
Me: I would love too, what time shall I be round
(and thus by showing acceptance and love, Athene brings the kingdom of God into their lives )

Although I wouldn't say "Your beliefs are repugnant to me," or anything remotely similar to that insult, I believe that celebrating other religious holidays is nothing less than celebrating the religion itself thus a form of worship. As Christian's it is our responsibility to follow the commandment delivered through Moses that we refrain from any such practice of idolatry. Since worshiping (or celebrating) any other god, force or demigod is in itself idolatry, I refrain from celebrating such holidays as do Muslims in regards to Jewish Holidays, or Hindu's in regards to Christian holidays.

 

[seamonster]

If you are unhappy with the way the public school is run, don't send your kids to public school.

Voila.

Problem solved.

 

[Celticflower]

To Kill a Mocking Bird in my humble opinion is one of the greatest and most influencial works of contemporary American Litterature. It has become contreversial because the audience that it has been introduced to has been so "sensitized" to racial remarks and words that when the n-word is in litterature (even anti-racism/pro-civil rights greats like the aforestated novel) everybody freaks out like they have been personally persecuted.

The answer to this problem may lie in educating the audience as to the novel's place in history. People today are offended by the language of Mark Twain, but at the time books like Tom Sawyer and Huckleberry Finn were written the language was everday speech and the characters were not considered negative stereotypes. I had a great English teacher (over 25 years ago) who always put novels into perspective for us as to the time they were written and the audience to whom they were meant to appeal. Thus we could read Twain or Shakespeare and not freak out over every little thing -- we understood why things were said as they were said and that they were not offensive at the time of their writing.

 

[Maynard Keenan]

The first thing, some of the books mentioned as inappropriate are excellent pieces of literature that are very good commentaries on society at the time, basic human qualities, or very influential to society (like Twain, TKAMB, LotF).

Second, to those who mentioned teaching th eten commandments: Only as an unbiased comparative religion class. The first commandment can be summed up as "Worship the one God." Now everyone knows this means the Judeo-Christian God or, in a broader interpretation, including Islam. This is a problem, it is a CLEAR violation of the constitution. It is an affront to freedom of religion for the government, using taxpayer's money, to promote a religion or group of religions over another.

 

[coastie]

If you are unhappy with the way the public school is run, don't send your kids to public school.

Voila.

Problem solved.

That's not such a wonderful solution. My taxes will still pay for these schools to teach heretical or (in the very least) idolatrous lessons to student. This is not something I want my tax money paying for on a philisophical/theological (not just financial) level.

Running away from a problem doesn't "solve" the problem. Wouldn't you agree?

 

[coastie]

The answer to this problem may lie in educating the audience as to the novel's place in history. People today are offended by the language of Mark Twain, but at the time books like Tom Sawyer and Huckleberry Finn were written the language was everday speech and the characters were not considered negative stereotypes. I had a great English teacher (over 25 years ago) who always put novels into perspective for us as to the time they were written and the audience to whom they were meant to appeal. Thus we could read Twain or Shakespeare and not freak out over every little thing -- we understood why things were said as they were said and that they were not offensive at the time of their writing.

I absolutely agree.

 

[PACKY]

This is about more than the shock of learning what books are in school libraries. It's about the need for Christian parents to become involved in their local school boards. In this case, the organization hopes to persuade the district's board to take certain action, including requiring parental consent before a student can have access to certain books. That's why it is important to have Christians on the board.

It's also about the need for Christians to become involved in electing judges and in electing those who appoint judges. In the past, another school board in Arkansas was unsuccessful in requiring parental consent before students could read "Harry Potter" when the policy was struck down by the courts. This is a link to a story about that decision.


http://www.cnn.com/2003/EDUCATION/04/23/harry.potter.ap/

couldnt agree more!

Parents need to start doing the parenting instead of letting school systemd raise their children..

 

[ArchangelGabriel]

im sorry but i dont see anything wrong with those books being there its literature and further more art you shouldnt judge it

 

[PACKY]

im sorry but i dont see anything wrong with those books being there its literature and further more art you shouldnt judge it

someone can deficate in the middle of the room and call it art..but we all still know what it really is, it is absurd that garbage be expected to hide behind the title "art"...people can judge what they want and have the RIGHT to choose what thier child is exposed to.
this is even more so when tax dollars are involved.

 

[Athene]

someone can deficate in the middle of the room and call it art..but we all still know what it really is, it is absurd that garbage be expected to hide behind the title "art"...people can judge what they want and have the RIGHT to choose what thier child is exposed to.
this is even more so when tax dollars are involved.

I think it's dangerous to let parents have too much control over the school, especially those parents who considered Tom Sawyer and To Kill a Mocking Bird dangerous books.

Schools should expose children to different ideas, we don't want the next generation growing up clones of their parents, especially the parents who don't like Tom Sawyer.

Not that it really effects me, being in the UK where books like Tom Sawyer and To Kill a Mocking bird are required reading.

I serioulsy wonder about the people who want to bann all these books, they should form an organisation and call themselves "Dangerously narrow minded xenophobes for a better America"

 

[PACKY]

I think it's dangerous to let parents have too much control over the school, especially those parents who considered Tom Sawyer and To Kill a Mocking Bird dangerous books.

Schools should expose children to different ideas, we don't want the next generation growing up clones of their parents, especially the parents who don't like Tom Sawyer.

Not that it really effects me, being in the UK where books like Tom Sawyer and To Kill a Mocking bird are required reading.

I serioulsy wonder about the people who want to bann all these books, they should form an organisation and call themselves "Dangerously narrow minded xenophobes for a better America"

No book should ever be called "mandatory" nor should any book be consored,
all that I advocate for is that parents have the right to decide what their child reads and is subjected to.
as far as your statment... "Dangerously narrow minded xenophobes for a better America"
why pass judgement like that, why reduce your argument to name calling?

 

[Stacey]

That's horrible. I saw a section on the local news about something like this and this one girl maybe 12-14 was reading a graphic book and said she loved it because it was like fun and grown-up. This makes younger children think dating or being a teenager/adult is like it is in these books. They definately should not be allowed. They shouldn't be published in the first place.

 

[Stacey]

I think it's dangerous to let parents have too much control over the school, especially those parents who considered Tom Sawyer and To Kill a Mocking Bird dangerous books."

Someone said these were dangerous books? We had to read To Kill a Mocking Bird. I don't see the problem. It's an excellent novel about several extremely important issues.

 

[Athene]

Someone said these were dangerous books? We had to read To Kill a Mocking Bird. I don't see the problem. It's an excellent novel about several extremely important issues.

It's on a list of books which have recieved the most requests to have them banned from school and public librarys.

I know, it's a fantastic book, and it tackles really big issues such as racism and an unjust society.

Packy, because I seriously believe that if these people had their way then American children would suffer even more then they do so already. And I DO want it to be known that I do not have a high opinion of those who want to censor the books I mentioned in my previous posts.

 

[PACKY]

It's on a list of books which have recieved the most requests to have them banned from school and public librarys.

I know, it's a fantastic book, and it tackles really big issues such as racism and an unjust society.

Packy, because I seriously believe that if these people had their way then American children would suffer even more then they do so already. And I DO want it to be known that I do not have a high opinion of those who want to censor the books I mentioned in my previous posts.

I dont beleive in censorship BUT i do beleive in a parents right to select and choose what their child is exposed to.

 

[CrystalBrooke]

i had to read "Of Mice and Men" last year...good story line, but i hated the language, i dont are where they were from GD is not acceptable anywhere...luckily my teacher was Christian and made copies of the whole book and marked out the bad words.

 

[Mr.Cheese]

I think truly evil things get past us, such as what the OP described, while we spend all our time yelling about Harry Potter and such.