Should we Baptize "with scrutiny"

[circuitrider]

The official motto of the one we attend is "Christians only, but not the only Christians". In practice it varies from "Not the only Christians just the best ones" to "Not the only Christians ----wait, yeah we are". All depends on who you talk to on which day and how well they know you. The one thing in my favor is the current pastor has family who are very strong Methodists, so he doesn't hassle me at all.

Glad you've had an ok experience with this church. There are some really good non-denominational churches. The problem is figuring out which ones because you pretty much have to attend there a while to figure out what they believe.

 

[Dave-W]

Yep - CircuitRider; I have seen the same thing.

Most of the ones I have seen doing that are in the Assembly of God. One I know of actually started satelite churches who have no official tie to the overall denomination while the parent church is fully A/G. Not quite sure what to make of that.

The church my mom attended up until she became too ill and frail to go did that with their Church of God affiliation; and my middle daughter's congregation's affiliation is still unknown to almost all members. (Evangelical Free?)

Not sure what to make of that either.

 

[Celticflower]

Glad you've had an ok experience with this church. There are some really good non-denominational churches. The problem is figuring out which ones because you pretty much have to attend there a while to figure out what they believe.

The first one we went to here was not a good one - lots of in fighting, lots of elitist mentality and way too stuck on Good Friday and forgetting Easter and beyond. The one we are at now (and have been for about 17 years) is better, but I'm still a Methodist at heart.

 

[KimT]

A wise pastor once said to me, "If you find a perfect church, you won't be in it." LOL

As I get older, I rely more on what the Word of God says and how the Holy Spirit is guiding me. That's how I ended up in my present church and I am so blessed to be a part of it. We really pray for each other in that church and our Pastor preaches from the Bible. It definitely isn't a lukewarm body of believers.

Peace.

 

[Wgw]

I object to non denoms for two reasons: Ive yet to find one that had something even close to an Orthodox sacramental theology or a reverent liturgical service (which Methodism historically had, at least under the 1965 and 1992 Book of Wornip amd Hymnal editions and the old Sunday Service Book), and also ecclesiologically; I object to the idea that the Church is not visible (however I subacribe to the voew of the recently deceased Fr. Thomas Hopko of blessed memory that Orthodoxy is based on canonicity and not who one is in communion with; so I personally regard Wesley as having been functionally Orthodox or semi-Orthodox deapite not officially being in communion with the Ecumenical Patriarchate or the Church of Russia or the Pope of Alexandria, although there is the interesting matter of his alleged elevation to the episcopate by the Greek bishop Erasmus of Arcadia in 1763).

 

[Wgw]

A wise pastor once said to me, "If you find a perfect church, you won't be in it." LOL

As I get older, I rely more on what the Word of God says and how the Holy Spirit is guiding me. That's how I ended up in my present church and I am so blessed to be a part of it. We really pray for each other in that church and our Pastor preaches from the Bible. It definitely isn't a lukewarm body of believers.

Peace.

I think the Church as a whole has to be perfect, being the Body of Christ to which we are mystically joined through Baptism and Communion. However, individual communions of the church militant, being led by imperfect men, are bound to be imperfect. However Wesley stressed entire sanctification, drawing nearer to perfection by invoking the grace of the Holy Spirit to resist son, a revival of the ancient concept of Theosis which had been de-emphasized in the West due to the dominance of an imbalanced Augustinian theology.

 

[circuitrider]

I see the church as "the body of Christ" in a symbolic sense rather than a literal sense. Christian perfection is never a given, IMHO, for human beings. Wesley believe total sanctification was a gift from God and not one we could achieve but only accept if we received it. He also taught that such complete sanctification may not be permanent because human beings are always subject to temptation and falling.

 

[Wgw]

The main difference between Wesley and the Orthodox position at first glance would appear to involve the ascetic aspects of the Orthodox pursuit of theosis, until one takes note of the highly ascetic nature of the Methodist Societies; Wesley rejected the Christianity of anyone who failed to fast on Friday, and himself followed the ancient, Orthodox practice of fasting on Wednesdays, and those who failed to adhere to the strict rules pf conduct of the Methodist socieotoes could not renew their membership. Which must be viewed in the context of the Societies being an adjunct to the Church of England; the Methodist Episcopal Church was to my knowledge never as strict.

Orthodoxy perhaps differs from Wesley in that it regards theosis as the means of salvation, as opposed to a desirable testament to a salvation already received. However I am not sure this is how Wesley viewed it; his Orthodoxy ebbed and flowed over the years.

 

[circuitrider]

Wesley softened became a little less hard nose about a number of things as he aged/matured. One of the difficulties in reading Wesley is that his opinions were not set in stone. His theology was practical and not systematic.