Should Christians oppose gay civil marriage?

[Nadiine]

Heterosexual and homosexual are opposite and same sexual attractions. Therefore according to God’s word one is functional and the other is dysfunctional. One is potentially right, within a faithful marriage and the other is error.
Nadine is right, there is no Biblical argument for same sex unions its belief or denial in the exclusions and condemnations.

well they can't undermine Jesus' direct definition OF marriage - when He's literally basing their union on GENDER at the creation of the 2 "species".

How can one deny the definition of 2 becoming one when it's based on HOW they were purposely created to suit one another? Procreation is the proof of God's design intention - with the command to Adam & Eve "be fruitful and multiply". 2 males at creation wouldn't produce any offspring! (nevermind that the female has different psychological functions that are an aid to the male who doesn't think or operate /hardwiring the same, she compliments & helps him)

This is undeniable - yet it's being denied.

Then tack on the utter lack of ANY NT support showing us that gays are now lawful in the church... we SHOULD be seeing gay couples operating in the churches with Paul and so forth -- but nothing.
In fact, nothing but Paul continuing to condemn it in other passages like Romans and Corinthians.

I just cannot see where this can be condoned unless you throw away the Bible itself. I come to the same conclusion you do.

 

[Dogbean]

Being homosexual isn't an action, in the same way that being heterosexual or bisexual aren't actions.

David.

Jumped in a little late there buddy....you missed crucial points of the argument.

We were differentiating being homosexual from acting on it. Read all the thread please.

 

[icarus62]

What you see today is rebellion against the moral laws of God - never the blessings & benevolence clauses & promises.
interesting isn't it

What you see today, on this issue at least, is moral progress - i.e. homosexuality treated as different but equal, and morally neutral, just like heterosexuality. This is something we can be proud of. Compare this to barbaric societies of the past (and some still existing today) in which homosexuals are persecuted and even killed. Modern society certainly doesn't get everything right but we must celebrate the things it does get right, and this is one of them.

 

[Nadiine]

Jumped in a little late there buddy....you missed crucial points of the argument.

We were differentiating being homosexual from acting on it. Read all the thread please.

thanks.

In general:
I think a great example is the sex drive itself.

It's natural that you HAVE a sex drive - yet sex outside marriage is sinful and esp. when you can't understand it yet as a young kid.

So why can't you argue that becuz you're created WITH a sex drive that starts at the age of 12ish, that you shouldn't be able to start having sex w/ people to fulfill that natural urge at very young ages?

We can go on and on with what's natural to us, yet it's still wrong.

This is about being Christian - if people can't & won't obey God, THEN DON'T BE ONE. But don't claim it's not sin when you have zero support.
You might as well go claim that Allah loves infidels while you're at it becuz that's about the equivalent in statements.

It's real simple

 

[Nadiine]

What you see today, on this issue at least, is moral progress - i.e. homosexuality treated as different but equal, and morally neutral, just like heterosexuality. This is something we can be proud of. Compare this to barbaric societies of the past (and some still existing today) in which homosexuals are persecuted and even killed. Modern society certainly doesn't get everything right but we must celebrate the things it does get right, and this is one of them.

I like how you ignore the persecution & insults that get hurled at Christians from this "civil" society of ours.

Christians get treated with MUCH less compassion and kindness by the world at large.
Homosexuals are highly promoted by this world and it's desire to promote all immorality. It's a sign of the times

 

[Dogbean]

I like how you ignore the persecution & insults that get hurled at Christians from this "civil" society of ours.

Christians get treated with MUCH less compassion and kindness by the world at large.
Homosexuals are highly promoted by this world and it's desire to promote all immorality. It's a sign of the times

Amen to that. The more we are persecuted, Nadiine, the more they just prove the Bible is right. Jesus said "Blessed are you when people mock you because of Me," in the Sermon on the Mount.

 

[Brennin]

Because its true

It's true that you deal in fallacious arguments and falsehoods, yes.

 

[Brennin]

Aand racists say they stand on the word of God. and racists say they cannot be moved from the truth. and racists say scripture and God is on their side

Then you should not have any problems reproducing their arguments using the New Testament.

 

[Archivist]

I like how you ignore the persecution & insults that get hurled at Christians from this "civil" society of ours.

Christians get treated with MUCH less compassion and kindness by the world at large.
Homosexuals are highly promoted by this world and it's desire to promote all immorality. It's a sign of the times

You are, of course, correct. Homosexuals are highly promoted by the world. No one is ever attacked for their sexual orientation.

Of course, thsi article from today's New York Times is apparently just a work of fiction:

"Six men attacked two others with knives and a baseball bat last night on Manhattan's Upper West Side after harassing the two men with anti-homosexual comments, the police said.

One victim, a 19-year-old man, was stabbed twice in the back and was in stable condition at St. Luke's-Roosevelt Hospital Center, the police said. His 20-year-old companion was treated at the same hospital for a fractured elbow. They police withheld the identity of the two men because they were victims.

The incident occurred at 8:30 P.M. on 103d Street between Broadway and Amsterdam Avenue. The police said they were seeking the six assailants, who fled the scene. No weapons were recovered."

 

[Nadiine]

Because its true [/color][/size][/font][/color][/font]

Then since homosexuality is called abomination in the OT,
God is racist...

Still, just another deflection tho...

 

[Nadiine]

and to all else who know homosexuality is sin (in this thread)

What you see here is DEFLECTION from what is a losing position.

 

[OllieFranz]

Post deleted by poster

 

[Polycarp1]

I agree, if you cannot be Christian in behavior, then you should not call yourself one.

However, that is not directed at people trying to behave morally in respect to an attraction to persons of the same sex. The arrant violation of God's own commands on how to treat others is equally sinful and equally to be condemned in people who claim the name of Christian. And we see these debates bringing out the worst of it in some people.

 

[ChaliceThunder]

I like how you ignore the persecution & insults that get hurled at Christians from this "civil" society of ours.

Christians get treated with MUCH less compassion and kindness by the world at large.
Homosexuals are highly promoted by this world and it's desire to promote all immorality. It's a sign of the times

I'm calling Meadow Muffins on this statement.

It shows how out of touch you are with your brothers and sisters who are gay.

I pray that God will turn your heart to compassion.

 

[Nadiine]

I'm calling Meadow Muffins on this statement.

It shows how out of touch you are with your brothers and sisters who are gay.

I pray that God will turn your heart to compassion.

I'd rather be out of touch with people than with God

It's sin.

 

[ChaliceThunder]

I'd rather be out of touch with people than with God

It's sin.

Compassion for those who are not like us, "the least of these", does not constitute being out of touch with God.

God's not black and white. And he will continue to bring you (and all of us) to opportunities in which we can learn humility and compassion. It's never easy - but it is God's way.

 

[Nadiine]

You are, of course, correct. Homosexuals are highly promoted by the world. No one is ever attacked for their sexual orientation.

Of course, thsi article from today's New York Times is apparently just a work of fiction:

"Six men attacked two others with knives and a baseball bat last night on Manhattan's Upper West Side after harassing the two men with anti-homosexual comments, the police said.

One victim, a 19-year-old man, was stabbed twice in the back and was in stable condition at St. Luke's-Roosevelt Hospital Center, the police said. His 20-year-old companion was treated at the same hospital for a fractured elbow. They police withheld the identity of the two men because they were victims.

The incident occurred at 8:30 P.M. on 103d Street between Broadway and Amsterdam Avenue. The police said they were seeking the six assailants, who fled the scene. No weapons were recovered."

And THIS is somehow proof that shows us how Christians aren't attacked & mocked or persecuted?

Please now.

THIS IS ALL DEFLECTION PEOPLE.

The Bible is still clear, and you STILL have no biblical support for homosexuality.

These side issues you're trying to make the main points in this topic don't work to change the truth any.
We've quoted the truth from God's word repeatedly and it can't be any clearer.

Complain all you want, find new issues to try to use, they fail.

Here's a story you might of missed - I have hundreds more where this came from

1. <LI class=g>Priest Brutally Killed in India; Bishops Call for Protection ...
   
   Aug 21, 2008 ... The murder of a Catholic priest in India has stirred believers in the country to cry for more protection by the government amid continued ...
   www.christianpost.com/article/20080821/priest-brutally-killed-in-india-bishops-call-for-protection.htm - 69k - Cached - Similar pages
   <LI class=g style="MARGIN-LEFT: 3em">9 More Christians Killed as Orissa Violence Spreads| Christianpost.com
   
   Two more Christians were killed when police opened fire at a protesting crowd, ... P.R. Paricha of advocacy group All India Christian Council (AICC). ...
   www.christianpost.com/article/20071230/9-more-christians-killed-as-orissa-violence-spreads.htm - 53k - Cached - Similar pages
   <LI class=g>INDIA: OFFICIALS DOUBT CHRISTIANS KILLED HINDU LEADER « Particular ...
   
   Aug 31, 2008 ... INDIA: OFFICIALS DOUBT CHRISTIANS KILLED HINDU LEADER. Orissa government leaks assessment pointing toward Maoists; protests nationwide ...
   pbaptist.wordpress.com/2008/08/31/india-officials-doubt-christians-killed-hindu-leader/ - 112k - Cached - Similar pages
   <LI class=g>Christian missionary family killed in India
   
   Christian missionary family killed in India. Last Updated: Friday, November 10, 2000 | 11:53 PM ET. CBC News. A Christian missionary and his two sons were ...
   www.cbc.ca/world/story/1999/01/23/india990123.html - 28k - Cached - Similar pages
   <LI class=g>INDIA Two Christians killed in Orissa; churches destroyed in Madya ...
   
   The bodies of the two victims were cut into pieces and thrown into a pond. Some churches from the 1600's and from the Middle Ages attacked.
   new.asianews.it/index.php?l=en&art=13285 - 23k - Cached - Similar pages
   <LI class=g>More Christians killed in India violence
   
   Aug 28, 2008 ... Christian Today > |PIC1|The death toll continues to rise in India&#8217;s Orissa state as a wave of violence against Christians shows no sign of ...
   www.christiantoday.com/article/more.christians.killed.in.india.violence/21306.htm - 29k - Cached - Similar pages
   <LI class=g>BBC News | SOUTH ASIA | Christians attacked in south India
   
   India under fire over Christian rights. 24 Sep 99 | South Asia ... Al-Qaeda 'may have killed minister', Regional media views Afghan killing ...
   news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/south_asia/759221.stm - 30k - Cached - Similar pages
   
   
   Sep 15, 2008 ... Christians are killed inhumanely and no one is there to protect the christians of the country. They were killed mercilessly by the Hindu ...
   
   
   ... to the United Christian Forum for Human Rights, 5 nuns were raped, 9 killed, ... The evidence for violence against Christians in India is consequently ...
   www.sscnet.ucla.edu/southasia/History/Current_Affairs/Current_affairs.html - 27k - Cached - Similar pages
2. Stingray: Pastor killed in India: 4th to be martyred in just over ...
   
   http://www.mcculloughsite.net/stingray/2006/06/15/pastor-killed-in-india-4th-to- be ... Hindu persecution of Christians is not common in most areas of India, ...
   www.mcculloughsite.net/stingray/2006/06/15/pastor-killed-in-india-4th-to-be-martyred-in-just-over-the-past-year.php - 88k - Cached - Similar pages

 

[Dogbean]

Compassion for those who are not like us, "the least of these", does not constitute being out of touch with God.

God's not black and white. And he will continue to bring you (and all of us) to opportunities in which we can learn humility and compassion. It's never easy - but it is God's way.

Letting someone continue in their sin and denial and go to hell forever.
Pointing out their error so they can repent, clean up their life, and go to heaven.

Which one is compassion?

 

[ChaliceThunder]

Letting someone continue in their sin and denial and go to hell forever.
Pointing out their error so they can repent, clean up their life, and go to heaven.

Which one is compassion?

LETTING someone continue in their sin?
First off - you have grossly misinterpreted scripture.
Secondly, it's not up to you to LET somebody do anything.

What you have described is FAR from compassion - it's an excellent example of colossal arrogance, though!

 

[Nadiine]

I'm calling Meadow Muffins on this statement.

It shows how out of touch you are with your brothers and sisters who are gay.

I pray that God will turn your heart to compassion.

God was compassionate in the OT when He forbid homosexuality as abomination too.

I think you need to redefine compassion - and compassion for what...
SIN? or people?