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Sermon on the Mount

edie19

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I think we do well as being the salt and the light (tho sometimes maybe a bit too much salt and not enough light ;) ) and we suck at loving our enemies, blessing our enemies, praying for our enemies...we have a hard enough time doing that with our neighbors. :sigh: I think our passions drown out our compassion at times.

a great big amen:amen:
 
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tkoman

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Would any agree that these teachings of Christ constitute the core of Christian orthopraxis?

Hmm, I know that when I read it I fall to His feet since I cannot live up to its standard. I understand the sermon as a statement of who Christ is . . .
 
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Albion

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Hmm, I know that when I read it I fall to His feet since I cannot live up to its standard. I understand the sermon as a statement of who Christ is . . .

I am not sure, either, but I do like that word orthopraxis!

BTW, Indrid,have you visited Point Pleasant lately?
 
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Simon_Templar

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Jim, when you say the Church, in what way, please? Cos the church only existed after Christ's death and resurrection, didn't it? So it *was* for a future time...

To discuss, please, cos Sermon on the Mount is just *awesome*, so this thread warrants waaaay more talky :D :hug:
well, in one manny of looking at it, the church has always existed.

To explain, the word Church comes from the greek Kirke which means "Of the Lord".
The word Church is mostly used in scripture to translate the greek word "ecclesia" which means something like "the called out assembly".

The idea is that the Church is a congregation, or an assembly of people who are called out of the world, and belong to God.

There was a congregation of God in the OT and it was the nation of Israel. The Christians have always recognized themselves to be the continuation of the nation of Israel as God's called out congregation.

This idea eventually lead to a doctrine in the church called "replacement" theolgy in which it was taught that since the Church was the continuation of Israel as God's congregation, that the Church had completely "replaced" Israel, and thus Israel no longer was of any importance and had no special place anymore. All of God's promises to Israel, now applied to the Church etc.

Dispensationalism started as a reaction against replacement theology. Dispensationalism teaches instead that the Jews are still God's chosen people and that the Church and Israel are seperate congregations. Right now is the "church age" when God deals with the gentile Church. When the church age ends (at the rapture of the churc, prior to the tribulation) then God will start working with the Jews again, etc.

There are some points on which I agree with dispensationalism, however, it has gone significantly over board, in my opinion, on several points.

First off, I don't see any real evidence scripturally for the idea of different dispensations. Dispensation could also be translated as "economy". It refers to how God deals with mankind, or how he relates to mankind.
There are multiple different COVENANTS in scripture in which God makes different promises and conditions with different groups of people. However, the way in which he has related to and dealt with mankind has not changed from the fall of man.
Secondly, dispensationalism creates a seperation between Jew and Gentile, and goes so far as to actually envision two different gospels, one for each group.
This is patantly anti-scriptural.
The bible tells us that Jesus Christ died to break down the seperation between Jew and Gentile and to make of the two, one new man. There is only one Gospel, and one Kingdom.

Replacement theology is wrong in the view that Israel no longer matters and they are no longer special to God. I personally think that Paul was clear that Israel will be restored at the end. For the present time, Israel is veiled, their eyes are covered so that they will not see. Paul tells us that God is using Israel's lack of faith to save the gentiles, BUT he is also using the faith of the gentiles to make Israel jealous.
The point with Israel, though is that God is faithful, despite their unfaithfulness. God will fulfill his promises to their fathers, even though they did not live up to their end of the bargain.
 
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Simon_Templar

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Power corrupts.

Part of what the beatitudes spell out is a rejection of power.
this is a common misquote.. right up there with "money is the root of all evil"... a slight misquote that drastically changes the idea.

The actual statment is not "power corrupts" but rather "power TENDS to corrupt". Personally, I'm not convinced that this common Axiom is actually true.

I would say more that Power reveals the true quality of a person, and most people simply aren't that good to begin with.

I don't think the beattitudes are a rejection of power. I would say rather that they are more about being unconcerned with power based on the realization that God has all power. That is, in as much as they address power at all.
More, the beattitudes are simply about what kind of person we should be... and I think there are two ways of looking at it.. it describes the kind of person who will know God... but it also describes what knowing God will make a person like.


In response to how successful we have or haven't been. To be honest, I don't think this has anything whatsoever to do with wether the Church is an institution etc etc. I grew up in a church that was fairly anti-establishment in its view of "the Church". The experience I had was that people in the groups who oppose organized churches, or who are egalitarian, and opposed established authority structures etc.. are just as bad, in fact, probably worse in most regards than those in the institutional Church.

In my personal experience, most of these kind of people were arrogant and full of pride, had little concern for the faith of anyone they deemed "less mature" than themselves and the real issue in their rejection of organized, institutional Church structure was that they didn't want to submit, or to be accountable to anyone other than themselves.

I'm not saying that in regard to you MrJim, because from what I know of you, none of those things seem to apply to you.
However, I frequently have this discussion with my Father who is anti-institutional, and anti-established church etc. Yet the problems that he finds in the institutional church are all the same, for the most part, in the church model he likes.. OR, they may have different problems, which are equally bad, or maybe worse.
 
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