It's interesting how these things fade into our memory. I grew up never having known my country at war, but my father grew up with his father never recovering from being in a POW camp during WWII.
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September 11
- Thread starter Zoot
- Start date
Okay okay okay okay okay. No more about WTC. Other threads for that. Enough responses to Wolseley's post. Chile Chile Chile. : )
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MichaelFJF
Well-Known Member
Thank you for reminding me why I don't give a **** about what other people think about us and our foreign policies. M
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to be honest, two years ago, people around the world actually wept with Americans. today, I think most people wouldn't give a hoot if such a tragedy were to recur. Many people would have the "they brought it on themselves" mentality. there's what America's foreign policy has brought you over the last two years. as you have stated, you do not give a hoot that many people see America as the rogue nation, the greatest threat to peace and stability. but what goes around comes around I guess.
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Oh, fine. We won't talk about Chile.
The people who are murdered in acts of terrorism are exactly not the people directly responsible for foreign policy. They are civilians. Anyone silly enough, now or then, to think that Joe Office Worker in the WTC is paying for his own crimes when US foreign policy results in such thing, is too silly to listen to.
Even non-civilian targets aren't paying for their own decisions most of the time. The US troops dying in Iraq are as much victims of the foolish decisions of their government as anyone else.
Nothing justifies these things. Nothing justifies 9/11/01. Nothing justifies 9/11/73. It's not a game of points. Eye for an eye and everyone ends up blind, as Gandhi said.
The US backed the coup in '73 because the Chilean government had gone Marxist, and this was perceived as a threat to US visions of the world's economy. Al-Qaeda flew those planes into the World Trade Center because it perceived the US's actions as a threat to their religion. Israeli fanatics bulldoze Palestinian homes and build settlements in the Palestinian territories because they perceive the Palestinians as a threat to their ideas about Israel. In each case, a person's ideology or a person's desire for wealth becomes a greater priority than a respect for the sanctity of life.
Nothing justifies killing people. Anyone who wouldn't cry today if another WTC happened in the States is missing the point just as much as any Americans who wouldn't cry if 5000 Arabs were murdered. Forget the language the people speak, forget the countries the people are from, forget the religions the people follow - they're people. People being killed by people is not acceptable.
The people who are murdered in acts of terrorism are exactly not the people directly responsible for foreign policy. They are civilians. Anyone silly enough, now or then, to think that Joe Office Worker in the WTC is paying for his own crimes when US foreign policy results in such thing, is too silly to listen to.
Even non-civilian targets aren't paying for their own decisions most of the time. The US troops dying in Iraq are as much victims of the foolish decisions of their government as anyone else.
Nothing justifies these things. Nothing justifies 9/11/01. Nothing justifies 9/11/73. It's not a game of points. Eye for an eye and everyone ends up blind, as Gandhi said.
The US backed the coup in '73 because the Chilean government had gone Marxist, and this was perceived as a threat to US visions of the world's economy. Al-Qaeda flew those planes into the World Trade Center because it perceived the US's actions as a threat to their religion. Israeli fanatics bulldoze Palestinian homes and build settlements in the Palestinian territories because they perceive the Palestinians as a threat to their ideas about Israel. In each case, a person's ideology or a person's desire for wealth becomes a greater priority than a respect for the sanctity of life.
Nothing justifies killing people. Anyone who wouldn't cry today if another WTC happened in the States is missing the point just as much as any Americans who wouldn't cry if 5000 Arabs were murdered. Forget the language the people speak, forget the countries the people are from, forget the religions the people follow - they're people. People being killed by people is not acceptable.
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Here you go zoot, some articles related to Chile. This is basically only the tip of the iceberg, just various pages I have come across. Going to do some more in depth searching tomorrow, but a huge storm is about to hit and I will need to go in not to long. 
I am interested in discussing this though, so I look forward to it when the weather dies down here (crazy Texas weather).
http://www.bbc.co.uk/dna/h2g2/A716591
http://english.pravda.ru/world/20/91/368/9766_chile.html
http://www.gwu.edu/~nsarchiv/NSAEBB/NSAEBB8/nsaebb8i.htm
http://news.bbc.co.uk/onthisday/hi/dates/stories/september/11/newsid_3199000/3199155.stm
http://www.americas.org/News/Features/200110_After_the_Attacks/200110Chile.htm
I am interested in discussing this though, so I look forward to it when the weather dies down here (crazy Texas weather).http://www.bbc.co.uk/dna/h2g2/A716591
http://english.pravda.ru/world/20/91/368/9766_chile.html
http://www.gwu.edu/~nsarchiv/NSAEBB/NSAEBB8/nsaebb8i.htm
http://news.bbc.co.uk/onthisday/hi/dates/stories/september/11/newsid_3199000/3199155.stm
http://www.americas.org/News/Features/200110_After_the_Attacks/200110Chile.htm
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Thanks, yen. I'll check those links out. Have fun with your crazy weather. Remember, it could be God punishing America for backing the creation of a Palestinian state.
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you mean like during the recent Iraq invasion? I wonder how many Americans gave a hoot to the number of Iraqi civilians killed.Zoot said:
My point is that --right or wrong-- America has squandered most of her goodwill after the 9/11 attacks, and by spurning the international community, has lost any sympathy in the eyes of many countries. That's just human nature. It's like the school bully who always picks on the little kids. Then one day he gets mugged. Right or wrong, would you feel as sorry for him, as compared to say some sweet young innocent thing?
Humans being what we are, if something bad happens to someone you hate/dislike, would you not feel a little gleeful/pleased--whether it's right or wrong?
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Thing is though, as Christians, shouldn't people care more?
Anyhoo, off to research more about Chile now, luckily the bad weather died down to a small storm by the time it reached us.
I can truely say no, I wouldn't here. I don't even wish any harm to those who have wronged me in the past in my personal life. In my opinion it's just not right, and I would feel extremely guilty for doing so.
Anyhoo, off to research more about Chile now, luckily the bad weather died down to a small storm by the time it reached us.
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feral
Dostoyevsky was right
I love that movie. There were a lot of very interesting points made.
I don't think that was the view expressed. 2826 Americans died in the two towers....25,000 lived. What is being pointed out, from my understanding, is that others have also suffered greatly, and in fact the U.S. has really seen nothing as far as terrorism compared to many other countries. And yes, the whole incident was scary and shook somewhat the notion of the U.S. as infallible and uber-powerful, but it is not the only thing that has ever happen which is bad. I think the thread is pointing out that others have suffered worse, and that compared to the many we have terrorized (from their view at least) we've gotten off light.
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