Separated in the same house

[DZoolander]

So now I essentially have 3 months... well, to be precise, GOD has 3 months to turn this guy's heart around. This is where it's going to get REAL hard.

I don't understand what you mean by that.

Three months to turn his heart around?

*THIS* is the moment to be making decisions. Contrary to what most people seem to believe - I believe that when you are the most emotionally hurt is *EXACTLY* when to come to a firm decision about what you're going to do.

How you feel now is what things *ARE*. How you feel now is what is *REAL*. This didn't just happen. It wasn't an accident. It was done to you. Sure - you played a part in it - but that's also reality. That's what your relationship is. Do you want this - or not?

I don't understand the waiting around to make a decision thing or giving time. (Well, maybe in fairness, I do, because I remember going through the exact same thoughts when I went through my divorce ten years ago). But ya know - the conclusion that I came to was exactly what I said above. How I felt at the time was what was *REAL*. How I'd be feeling in 2-3 months once the hurt had worn off - and then the worries and uncertainty of being alone started to become more "real" - that would just distort my perspective.

Ya know?

I've got an uncle...well...I had an uncle (he died a few years ago)...who married and divorced the same woman like 8 times. Every few years - she'd get a bug up her skirt and bail. She'd wait for him to be at work - and would clear out the home while he was away. He'd come home to find an empty house...some note about how she'd found the man of her dreams...blah blah...and he'd get all worked up and say "never again!" and divorce her.

Like clockwork - 2-3 years later she'd re-establish contact - and be all reconciliatory. He'd "forgive" her - and sure enough - they'd be married again. That cycle happened again and again - and just consumed his life. Like I said - it happened like 8 times.

Maybe if he'd just said "this really truly sucks - and I'm going to promise myself to never go through it again" based upon the reality of what his marriage was - he'd have avoided having to go through all that trauma again and again.

I dunno. People might disagree with me on that... but I think when you're most hurt by someone else is the time to make your decisions...ESPECIALLY in something like marriage.

 

[Million Pieces]

What I mean by that is that God is going to have to turn hubby's heart around if there's going to be reconciliation. Right now he doesnt' want it, but I definitely do.

This is essentially what I've come down to: I don't want what's broken. I want to be able to talk to him with out picking at the wounds, I want to be able to hear his heart without expecting accusations. and that's going to take time. Yes, this was a logn time coming, we've been skirting around it for years. In fact, I think I was the one who first brought up the idea of possibly separating. I've been having the same emotional affairs he has, only I do it in my fantasies.

I'm okay with this. Really I am. Sure, I was stung at first, and I reacted instead of responding. But he just beat me to it. I'm relieved to not have to pretend to people that we're all happy and nothing's wrong. Now I can finally reach out for help from church ministers and friends who can pray. We've known for a while that it's what was needed, what we were headed for, he was just the one who got fed up first.

I am telling myself almost daily that this does NOT have to be permanent yet. But it's going to take time apart, probably a long time, before we can relate without hurting and mistrusting each other.

 

[captiveheart]

I had the impression that he had decided to hook up with his soul mate. It sounds like maybe you have talked through that stuff?

 

[Million Pieces]

Yeah, I had understood that too. But apparently he got caught up in the "high" of finding a sympathetic counselor. It's not uncommon for people to develop emotional attachments to their counselors, or people who are particularly kind to them. He has said that his feelings have tempered a bitin the past couple of weeks. They still talk, and I've found her profile on Facebook, and apparently they're just sympathetic friends.

 

[captiveheart]

The fact that you have talked about it I think is good and it seems that you are ok with him staying in contact with her. From you post about that it sounded like he had forsaken you for another. I'm not sure that I would feel comfortable with her still in the picture. I don't think I understand how she can help with what you and your husband need to deal with. If she is emotionally available to him and he believes you are emotionally hostile toward him, seems to me it would only be natural for him to gravitate toward her.

I pray for you a lot.

 

[Million Pieces]

Thanks so much. No I'm not always happy he still talks to her. I try very hard NOT to be hostile toward him, but at the same time, he gravitates to talking to almost anyone else about emotional issues he has, and not me. Not unless or until he's already discussed it with others, and what he offers to me is the final decision, or the final conclusion to his thoughts. I'm never the one he asks for advice or guidance in his troubles.

I just realized that typing that out. Hmm, interesting.

 

[captiveheart]

Thanks so much. No I'm not always happy he still talks to her. I try very hard NOT to be hostile toward him, but at the same time, he gravitates to talking to almost anyone else about emotional issues he has, and not me. Not unless or until he's already discussed it with others, and what he offers to me is the final decision, or the final conclusion to his thoughts. I'm never the one he asks for advice or guidance in his troubles.

I just realized that typing that out. Hmm, interesting.

Collaboration with you would be a way better idea than holding a committee apart from you, and then coming to you with the results. My wife sometimes seems reluctant to collaborate and my suspicion is that she feels she won't be heard. Sometimes I have to state what I think her objections might be and she will agree with one of them. My guess is that I somehow discourage her from speaking exactly what she thinks or it is possible, as she is like this, that she holds an objection but she has avoided thinking about it in detail.

I know you have said he is controlling but is there anything else that might keep him from involving you in the "negotiations"? Maybe something you do that discourages him?

 

[Million Pieces]

Most likely when I'm listening for insults, instead of what he's really saying. When I respond with suspicion, and selfishness instead of openness. I know I do the same things to him that he does to me.

The one thing I know we need is mediation, a common negotiator, but we're just not there yet. He's finished. Every once in a while I get in the mind that I want to work on things, and want to win him back, and he comes back with "don't get your hopes up, I thought you wanted this too. Don't keep changing your mind."

The best I can pray for is for God to turn his heart. I know I can't, not without him being willing to be changed by ME. Because for him right now, the worst thing he could probably admit would be he'd ever do anything directly FOR me.

 

[EbonNelumbo]

Just so you know, I love you, for the sake of not bashing your now-husband, I've shied from this thread, but please know I love you.

 

[Million Pieces]

I have my proof, he's been cheating. I'm leaving hopefully in a few days when I can get my stuff together. It's a whole new ballgame, and now I really don't know what's going to happen.

I feel like the floor has fallen out on me. I don't want to manipulate, but I need to put myself in a stable place before I can even confront him with what I know and what I've seen.

 

[MyKidsDaddy]

MP,
What a thread! I feel for you. What can I say.... Try to focus on getting thru each day. INHO, God's ways and timing are extremely difficult to interpret. Save yourself by getting it right with God. Divorce may not be what God intended...but its not the end of life (i'm not sure in my case...neither of us have filed). I'm praying for both you and your husband's souls....the marriage looks to be over, but the souls will go on for eternity. I may be crazy, but I've waffled with the prayer that I'll give up my marriage if thats what it takes to save my wife's soul. I don't feel like I'm volunteering for martydom...But I do want to focus on whats most important. Relationship to Jesus, then my spouse, then my kids. If my spouse wants out...I don't have any plans on replacing her.

Many prayers heading your way.

MKD

 

[5kidsdad]

I'm so sorry MP. I can only imagine what it is like living with the person, when you find out they have cheated. I left, due to her insistance, then found out about 6 weeks later. I know how hard that has been in my case. I can only say God bless you. It is tough, but wuth prayer and fasting and a good support group...all of us here...you can survive. The Bible says that the Lord will never place so much of a burden on you that you aren't able to handle. It seems that way, too large, but you can make it. Time away might be good, I was thinking clearer when I confronted her and the family. Take the time to pray, seek God, and get some councilling to help deal with it all. God will direct you how to go, what to do. Trust in Him, somehow He will see you through.

Prayin...

5kd

 

[Million Pieces]

Thanks SO much 5kd, for another encouragement. And MKD, that's precisely what I was drawn to last night, after I had the evidence, was that Christ can be my only comfort these days, and THAT'S OKAY.

I just want this sick feeling to go away, whenever I think about what he's done, and for how long, and with how many women. Yeah, that's how it is. I feel even more sick that he's in this house RIGHT NOW and I can't even let on that anything is different yet. I'm seriously waiting for a couple of plans to be attended to before I confront it. I feel like I want to puke.

I have a choir practice tonight, and i've told my choir director that I want to talk with her after the practice. she knows a little of the dynamics already, but no specifics. She's a marvelous Godly woman, and a mentor unlike anything I could have ever asked for. I have also been on the phone with another understanding friend, who is giving me good solid advice and really keeping my head oon straight right now. Her first advice: don't do a THING without talking to someone you trust. Don't make sudden actions that will only come back to you, or end very badly.

 

[5kidsdad]

MP, it has been 4 months, and I still have that sick feeling almost every day. I am away from my 5 kids, and I feel that she has gotten away with all kinds of things I would never dream of doing. She is going on wih her life, while I am stuck here...and then throw on WHAT she did, and who...it is sickening. That is when I pray...a lot. I have also commanded the devil to get away from me, because of the thoughts and feelings that creep into my mind and soul. Somedays are hard, some easier. I pray that God gives you the strength to get through this...you can do it...I have faith in you.

5kd

 

[FaithfulWife]

I have my proof, he's been cheating. I'm leaving hopefully in a few days when I can get my stuff together. It's a whole new ballgame, and now I really don't know what's going to happen.

I feel like the floor has fallen out on me. I don't want to manipulate, but I need to put myself in a stable place before I can even confront him with what I know and what I've seen.

MP~

I know we haven't spoken a lot and we aren't good, close friends, but I wanted to offer a and say that I've been in your shoes. My first hubby was unfaithful more than once and I kept hoping he would come around and value me and stuff, but it didn't happen.

Sis, I've been involved in the infidelity field for about 10 years now, and oddly enough most unfaithful spouses are pretty predicable. So here's some practical advice for you to do fairly quickly:

1) For you--buy some lotion kleenex and some soup. If you and use regular kleenex it will make friction blisters on your eyelids and nose, so lotion! And you can't really eat but you have to "keep going" (go to work, care for kids, etc.)--you can choke down soup and it's kinda warm, comfort food, and it has some nutrition.

2) You were not unfaithful to the marriage or the family and you do not want to break it up (well, you do but you know what I mean)...so if HE wants to muck things up, HE is out not you. Pack the things, set them out, change the locks, and if the mistress is "so wonderful" time for her to step up to the plate and deal with him full time.

3) Expose the affair. I advise this every time, and every time people say to me "But that would be telling other people our dirty laundry" or "That would just be for revenge" or things like that. I strongly disagree and here's why. Right now in his head, every time he's with you its uncomfortable, you yell or remind he what he should be doing etc. and with her "it's special" and "she understands me" and "she knows me like no one ever could." NUH UH! She does not yet know that his poor qualities, and he doesn't know that she doesn't pay her bills, doesn't "do" trash, and can't stand sex after they're together. He has a very fake, fantasy view right now, and part of the reason the fake has gone on is that it's all secret and fun and he gets parts of his needs with you and parts with her--he's eating cake and hiding it!

If this is the love of the century, then bring it to the beautiful light of day! Show the world! Proclaim it from the treetops! Let people know who are going to be pro-marriage and who are going to help your marriage--like your pastor, his parents and siblings, your parents and siblings, and your Christian pro-marriage friends. Also tell his and her work. They need to know that right now they are on the brink of a sexual harassment lawsuit (unwanted sexual contact at work possibly using work resources for personal sexual gratification). If she's a counselor her supervisors need to know she's the type who will have an affair with a client and her ethics board may need to know.

So no--it's not for revenge. It's for REALITY! 7 times of 10 when you tell the parents, siblings, work, and other person's spouse the affair implodes on itself because it was only a fantasy to begin with and because something based on lies and secrecy and leverage cannot withstand the light of openness and honesty. He's likely to be mad, but it's really the best and fastest way to end the affair and that's the only time any reconciling is going to take place--when there is NO affair.

If you want, please PM me. I'm not a good PM'er so I'll warn ya! But I'm here for you and MP you will survive this I guarantee. I'm just sorry this has happened cuz I know that it hurts like the dickens.



~Faithful

 

[MyKidsDaddy]

MP, 5kd,
They say in life...sometimes you're the pigeon and sometimes you're the statue. Well it looks as though we have been statues for too long. Can you see me waving my arms....(like an idiot maybe).. I will not let the pigeons deposit anything on me anymore.
I've kept a written journal of my life for the past 3 years. It has helped during times of stress, depression, tension, and the worst of it ....DESPAIR. I rarely re-read it anymore. I do not want to give Satan the enjoyment of me despairing any more than I have in the past. I had copies of emails btw her and lover boy, phone call messages, ...you name it, I probably had a copy of it. Those actions ALMOST did me in. It wasn't until I started praying and reading the bible that things started getting managable. She didn't change and has done very little better herself during the past 3 years... Right now I take it a day / week at a time.

Crazy thing....our anniversary is this weekend. 22 yrs. We might go out for dinner. Just 3 months ago I would have had my hopes way up there....but not now. I want to treat her the way Jesus would. Never forget, despite the rage you may have against your spouse, that Jesus still loves them. I don't believe Jesus will accept them without their repentance, but that is only for us to pray about. We are called to love others.
I figure I have another 40 + years left on this earth. I don't want to be so attached to anything or person that will prevent me from total attachment to Christ. I've read JOB and wonder how he did it. He had everything restored to him 100 fold......except his family. His family was not deprived of their freewill and they chose to walk away from God. Our spouses may not return to God, but I'm praying they do. Prayer helps take the sting of pain away. I've been healing for 3 yrs, right now only 4 months into a separation. I'm determined to not let Satan have my kids through my ordeal. I've been blessed with the responsibility of keeping our youngest 2 (9 & 12 yr) since she moved out. They are so wise. I've not said anything to them about the real 'why' their mother moved out. Yet they have come up with reasons that are spot on. Me and the boys pray for our family and specifically my marriage every night. We expect miracles....but are willing to let it happen on God's time table.

You are in my prayers,

MKD

 

[Million Pieces]

MP~

I know we haven't spoken a lot and we aren't good, close friends, but I wanted to offer a and say that I've been in your shoes. My first hubby was unfaithful more than once and I kept hoping he would come around and value me and stuff, but it didn't happen.

Sis, I've been involved in the infidelity field for about 10 years now, and oddly enough most unfaithful spouses are pretty predicable. So here's some practical advice for you to do fairly quickly:

1) For you--buy some lotion kleenex and some soup. If you and use regular kleenex it will make friction blisters on your eyelids and nose, so lotion! And you can't really eat but you have to "keep going" (go to work, care for kids, etc.)--you can choke down soup and it's kinda warm, comfort food, and it has some nutrition.

2) You were not unfaithful to the marriage or the family and you do not want to break it up (well, you do but you know what I mean)...so if HE wants to muck things up, HE is out not you. Pack the things, set them out, change the locks, and if the mistress is "so wonderful" time for her to step up to the plate and deal with him full time.

3) Expose the affair. I advise this every time, and every time people say to me "But that would be telling other people our dirty laundry" or "That would just be for revenge" or things like that. I strongly disagree and here's why. Right now in his head, every time he's with you its uncomfortable, you yell or remind he what he should be doing etc. and with her "it's special" and "she understands me" and "she knows me like no one ever could." NUH UH! She does not yet know that his poor qualities, and he doesn't know that she doesn't pay her bills, doesn't "do" trash, and can't stand sex after they're together. He has a very fake, fantasy view right now, and part of the reason the fake has gone on is that it's all secret and fun and he gets parts of his needs with you and parts with her--he's eating cake and hiding it!

If this is the love of the century, then bring it to the beautiful light of day! Show the world! Proclaim it from the treetops! Let people know who are going to be pro-marriage and who are going to help your marriage--like your pastor, his parents and siblings, your parents and siblings, and your Christian pro-marriage friends. Also tell his and her work. They need to know that right now they are on the brink of a sexual harassment lawsuit (unwanted sexual contact at work possibly using work resources for personal sexual gratification). If she's a counselor her supervisors need to know she's the type who will have an affair with a client and her ethics board may need to know.

So no--it's not for revenge. It's for REALITY! 7 times of 10 when you tell the parents, siblings, work, and other person's spouse the affair implodes on itself because it was only a fantasy to begin with and because something based on lies and secrecy and leverage cannot withstand the light of openness and honesty. He's likely to be mad, but it's really the best and fastest way to end the affair and that's the only time any reconciling is going to take place--when there is NO affair.

If you want, please PM me. I'm not a good PM'er so I'll warn ya! But I'm here for you and MP you will survive this I guarantee. I'm just sorry this has happened cuz I know that it hurts like the dickens.



~Faithful

Don't mean to intentionally quote skip you MKD, but I want to address a couple of things in this one.

1) That's good advice, actually. The food part at least, I already have the lotion Kleenex. I haven't eaten almost anything today, every time I even think of food, my stomach flips. I've seriously felt that cold-faced feeling of needing to puke, all day.

2) Eventually this house will have to be sold, neither of us can afford the mortgage alone. But yeah, I'm starting to lean that direction, that he's gone. Where he goes s HIS problem.

3) This is the sticky one. I found out by hacking his emails, after being suspicious for too long. I actually hijacked an email from her to him, referencing an encounter they had recently. He didn't even see it before I forwarded it to myself and deleted it. He doesnt' know she even sent it, as far as I know. All of my evidence right now is things I have gathered through this hacking his emails and chatlogs. If I expose the affair(s), I will be admitting to doing it by questionable means.

Secondly, they are not co-workers, nor is she his counselor nor is there any professional association. She is a long-time online friend, one whom I have actually met face to face some years ago. She lives in another town, some 150+ miles away, so they don't see each other on a very regular or timely basis. This is actually the most recent one, that I believe is ongoing by online communications. I have evidence of others from times past, that I would believe have ended due to different circumstances.

I already plan to forward at least snips of this particular email to others, plus other inappropriate contents of his email inbox (pictures of women's genitals and breasts taken from his cell phone and emailed to himself for keeping). I just don't know when or how or to whom yet. He also has a terrible habit of disrespecting OUR confidence; forwarding and BCCing confidental, highly emotional and personal emails between the two of us to outside friends and at least one mistress that was the direct subject of one particular message. Even after he admitted to doing it, I asked him specifically never to do it again, but he did it anyway.


Someday I can only hope he can be completely honest with me. When I allude to the fact that I "suspect" that he has outside flings, he just shrugs his shoulders and says "you're going to believe what you want", inferring that he's being falsely accused. I know the truth already, I just wish he could admit it too. But I also realize it may never happen.

What is the worst in this is this: we are already living "separated", as this thead describes. He's been directing it to be MY choice to separate, he wants me to choose to leave because I need it for MY health and well-being, but without actually having to take responsibility for his behaviour. He's been trying to blow it over so carefully, so as to avoid being the "bad guy". Too late. I'm going to choose to divorce, alright, but I'll let the whole bloody world know exactly why.


There's quite a bit more behind it, obviously, but I know I do intend to bring it out in the open, and sooner than later. I just have to be VERY careful how, or it has the possibility to go VERY VERY badly for me.

 

[MyKidsDaddy]

MP,
You don't want to get me started on the 'methods' of data collection. I found enough. You're right about being very careful....He really doesn't want everyone else to know his faults. If I was you, I would not email anything to him.

I emailed my wife once and she forwared to her sister (she doesn't know i know). I've talked to her sister several times. Her sister and I were upfront about the fact that our conversations would basically be "open". Meaning that her and my wife would talk and it might revolve around things i have said. I could play that to my benefit occasionally. Lately, I just quit talking to her sister.

I do not consider any means "Questionable", provided it is legal and places no one in harms way. If you have access to email accounts and phone logs....get your evidence. But...as i said earlier...the process can take a heavy toll on yourself. I had to keep asking myself "what are you going to do with this information now that you have it". I did consider renting an electronic billboard and letting it scroll thru their emails.
My oldest kids have suspicions that are pretty spot on without me alluding to anything. The two youngest do not need me bashing their mother...she'll prove herself unfit with her own actions. I will not back away from teaching my kids the difference btw right and wrong.

 

[Million Pieces]

MKD, a thought I had about forwarding or publishing his emails was that it would only be coming from hurt, and wanting to strike out and punish. It wouldn't be done with any intention of honouring him, it would be simply to expose him and ridicule him. Completely the wrong reason.

One thing I am having to remind myself often, is that I need more than anything else to be honourable in all this. Don't be vindictive, don't give him ammunition, don't do or say anything that brings me down to his level. I can even do THIS and live the fruit of the Spirit.

I dunno, isn't invasion of privacy illegal?


I'm looking over some of the things I've found tonight with a much calmer head, and seeing that yes, a LOT of it is highly inappropriate, but that for the most part, he's saying to others almost exactly what he's been saying to me, at least in regards to his wish to end our marriage, and trying to be considerate and amicable about it. Doesn't change the fact that he's a cheating so-and-so, but I'm seeing that he's actually sincere about wanting to do this as mature adults. He's still going to have to face his infidelity however, he's not getting away with that. that's not even negotiable.

 

[5kidsdad]

MP, I don't know the laws where you are, but my legal team told me that getting e-mails was a gray area in the law. As far as your case, you are still there and found out. I was out of the house and found out. I don't know how that affects things. I know one thing, document, document, document, and keep records as much as possible. It will help, I assume. My case is tough, considering the involvement of 5 kids and all. I know the thing that bothers me, and maybe you. My STBX seems to be living her life to the fullest, and when I confronted her, she flatly denied the whole thing. Even with the evidence that I had, she denied it, and then proceeded to rip me a new one about how I was destrroying her and the kids, and the family. No, it is her that is doing all of that. I don't know how your spouse will react when you confront them about it, but don't be supprised if they deny it. That is a definite possibility. I hope not, and that you can try to get some of this in the open, and begin to heal. I know that I would feel better if my STBX would admit it to me, and stop trying to manipulate me to do what she wants. And I know that taking the high road in all of this is tough, but I truly believe that God will honor that action that you take. I have wanted to act out in anger, and honestly have, but have been able to stop before it consumed me. Prayer...it helps. The toughest thing I face is being away from my precious children. I am praying for you, MP.

5kd