Self and Selfishness

[patrick jane]

Selfishness is the root of all evil. We can trace everything back to self, whether individually or in groups of 2 or more. Sure we think of others but only to a point. Obviously we do anything for family, friends and immediate circle, but even then we treat others selfishly.

I know this is an uncomfortable subject, I don't expect folks to focus too long on themselves while taking inventory of their souls. I am a culprit of SELF too yet I can see when I start doing it now and try to stop asap. What I want to focus on is the history of mankind and selfishness, it goes all the back to Adam and Eve.

I also conclude that ALL sin stems from self/selfishness and here's why. Every sin I think of and every bad thing somehow goes all the way back to self unless dealing with mentally ill or incapable people. Whether it's governments, companies, and all the way down to me and you, selfishness is the problem.

Greed, the 7 deadly sins the 10 Commandments, every crime; theft, adultery, addiction, rape, lies, idolatry, murder, MONEY (greed), etc. The list goes on. Often in history a seemingly good leadership becomes victim to self.

 

[patrick jane]

Uncomfortable subject, usually folks love to talk about themSELF. This may be the shortest thread in CF history.


l

 

[quatona]

Uncomfortable subject, usually folks love to talk about themSELF.

I don´t find it uncomfortable.
I find it a little trivial: Of course, the source of all our actions is our self.

This may be the shortest thread in CF history.


l

Particularly when nobody knows what exactly it is you would like to be discussed, and when you have given no hint about the implications of your hypothesis.

 

[Eudaimonist]

Selfishness is the root of all evil.

I'm more tempted to say that selflessness is the root of all evil. When the value of selves are denied, murder becomes easy. You aren't killing a "self", after all.

But we really need to define our terms much more carefully here. You may find that a certain kind of self-orientation is good, and a certain other kind is bad.

I also conclude that ALL sin stems from self/selfishness and here's why. Every sin I think of and every bad thing somehow goes all the way back to self unless dealing with mentally ill or incapable people. Whether it's governments, companies, and all the way down to me and you, selfishness is the problem.

The problem I have with that is that it's like throwing the baby out with the bathwater. You may be right that "self" may be involved with evil acts, but "self" may also be involved with good acts. You are likely oversimplifying the issue.

Greed, the 7 deadly sins the 10 Commandments, every crime; theft, adultery, addiction, rape, lies, idolatry, murder, MONEY (greed), etc. The list goes on. Often in history a seemingly good leadership becomes victim to self.

Rationality, integrity, independence, and other virtues also have to do with "self".


eudaimonia,

Mark

 

[patrick jane]

I'm more tempted to say that selflessness is the root of all evil. When the value of selves are denied, murder becomes easy. You aren't killing a "self", after all.

But we really need to define our terms much more carefully here. You may find that a certain kind of self-orientation is good, and a certain other kind is bad.



The problem I have with that is that it's like throwing the baby out with the bathwater. You may be right that "self" may be involved with evil acts, but "self" may also be involved with good acts. You are likely oversimplifying the issue.



Rationality, integrity, independence, and other virtues also have to do with "self".


eudaimonia,

Mark

Well even though I didn't mention good and only sin and evil is because the focus of the thread is sin, evil and it's relation to selfishness. All sin goes back to wanting something for yourself; selfishness.

 

[Eudaimonist]

Well even though I didn't mention good and only sin and evil is because the focus of the thread is sin, evil and it's relation to selfishness. All sin goes back to wanting something for yourself; selfishness.

All sin? Perhaps. But not all harmful consequences. Dictators often make appeals to selflessness and serving a "greater good" (greater than your own pathetic good for which you must be selfless and sacrificing) in order to justify their rule and create obedient citizens willing to die for them and to accept any atrocities.

Beware people who don't want anything for themselves or who don't want you to want anything for yourself. They either want something from you, or they just don't want you to value your own life. It's very dangerous without an ethical theory of what it is okay to value for yourself. Remember, your life, happiness, and well-being mean nothing if you aren't permitted to value these things for yourself.


eudaimonia,

Mark

 

[patrick jane]

I don´t find it uncomfortable.
I find it a little trivial: Of course, the source of all our actions is our self.

Particularly when nobody knows what exactly it is you would like to be discussed, and when you have given no hint about the implications of your hypothesis.

not exactly, thanks for playing.

 

[quatona]

not exactly, thanks for playing.

Thanks for offering your thoughts and opinions. That was very selfless of you.

 

[patrick jane]

All sin? Perhaps. But not all harmful consequences. Dictators often make appeals to selflessness and serving a "greater good" (greater than your own pathetic good for which you must be selfless and sacrificing) in order to justify their rule and create obedient citizens willing to die for them and to accept any atrocities.

Beware people who don't want anything for themselves or who don't want you to want anything for yourself. They either want something from you, or they just don't want you to value your own life. It's very dangerous without an ethical theory of what it is okay to value for yourself. Remember, your life, happiness, and well-being mean nothing if you aren't permitted to value these things for yourself.


eudaimonia,

Mark

I'm thinking more of individuals but even your scenarios of folks wanting nothing but to serve their gov't or leaders, they still seek acceptance and approval; a form of self gratification.

 

[Larniavc]

I'm a very selfish person but I do my best not to act in a selfish way because in the long run being selfish is not good for me.

So you could say my being unselfish is quite selfish of me.

 

[patrick jane]

I'm a very selfish person but I do my best not to act in a selfish way because in the long run being selfish is not good for me.

So you could say my being unselfish is quite selfish of me.

I'm thinking of selling all that I have and walking the earth. LOL, not.

 

[rockytopva]

If I had a word for this generation it would be that...

Ego is not the unction of the Holy Spirit

 

[Jeshu]

I wrote a poem about the subject once.

In My last I

i heard and saw
for myself
what big I's
do best,
replying first
to Heaven's questions.

i heard and saw,
"Me!! Yes, I..!"
answering triumphantly,
ignoring the rest of me,
self-importance rising proudly,
“I.., I.., I..,
yes.., ME!”

i had heard and seen,
“Who is first?
Who deserves to be in Heaven?
Who earned the power, glory and honour over here?
Who is more important?
Who deserves the crown?
Who wants to live forever?”


i heard and saw
that there was
no room
for the rest
of myself,
nor anyone else,
either!


i heard and saw
merely a
swollen ego
boasting
arrogantly
I am
best!


i heard and saw
a marvellous Light
decent from Heaven,
screaming,
my big I lit-up
from hair to toe
aflame!


i heard and saw
in The End
a final tiny
flame flickering,
my big I
blazed out
for good!


i heard and saw
much better
after i had
that 'hiccup'
going up
tho'​

 

[patrick jane]

Good poem !

 

[keith99]

I will take a selfish person over someone who knows nothing about me yet still thinks he knows what is best for me and will 'do me good' whether I like it or not.

The appetites of a selfish person can be satiated, the appetites of a do gooder have no limit.

 

[patrick jane]

I will take a selfish person over someone who knows nothing about me yet still thinks he knows what is best for me and will 'do me good' whether I like it or not.

The appetites of a selfish person can be satiated, the appetites of a do gooder have no limit.

I agree, where did this thread make you think of that.

 

[keith99]

If you asked twenty good men today what they thought the highest of the virtues, nineteen of them would reply, Unselfishness. But if you had asked almost any of the great Christians of old, he would have replied, Love.

- C.S. Lewis, Weight of Glory (The opening lines in fact).

And now it has gone farther and selfishness is blamed for all sin!

My good friend Screwtape is quite pleased and may soon be able to take a well deserved holiday, his work has been quite effective.

 

[dogs4thewin]

You can, however take your concern for others too far.

 

[patrick jane]

You can, however take your concern for others too far.

You weren't talking to me but yes. I'm not saying we should fall all over ourselves giving and helping others. I was making an overall observation of what makes people do such evil things; the motive.

 

[patrick jane]

If you asked twenty good men today what they thought the highest of the virtues, nineteen of them would reply, Unselfishness. But if you had asked almost any of the great Christians of old, he would have replied, Love.

- C.S. Lewis, Weight of Glory (The opening lines in fact).

And now it has gone farther and selfishness is blamed for all sin!

My good friend Screwtape is quite pleased and may soon be able to take a well deserved holiday, his work has been quite effective.

1 Peter 4:8 - Colossians 3:12-13 - Colossians 3:14