SDA Question

[Airdude]

There is nothing inscripture that says God was willing to reinstate Satan in his position had he returned to God!
And this:
"The heavenly councils pleaded with Lucifer."
There is nothing in scripture that this occurred.
Ellen White added to scripture.

According to you anyone who comments on scripture is adding to scripture, unless you happen to agree with them. Then it would apparently be alright with you. By that logic ministers would be limited to only reading the Bible to us in church for fear of being accused of "adding to scripture." Maybe we should burn all the religious books on our shelves and while we're at it why don't we just burn down all the Christian bookstores because according to your logic they are all guilty of adding to scripture.

 

[deu58]

Hello Airdude

According to you anyone who comments on scripture is adding to scripture, unless you happen to agree with them. Then it would apparently be alright with you. By that logic ministers would be limited to only reading the Bible to us in church for fear of being accused of "adding to scripture." Maybe we should burn all the religious books on our shelves and while we're at it why don't we just burn down all the Christian bookstores because according to your logic they are all guilty of adding to scripture.

Your argument is empty of reason and logic, I have never read any commentary, dictionary etc that claimed that if I rejected what the author wrote as being directly from God that I would lose my salvation,

That I must follow unquestionably and to the letter what they say or be damned,

And if I ever do pick one up that says that then I will happily burn that book myself,

yours in Christ
deu 58

 

[Cliff2]

There is nothing inscripture that says God was willing to reinstate Satan in his position had he returned to God!
And this:
"The heavenly councils pleaded with Lucifer."
There is nothing in scripture that this occurred.
Ellen White added to scripture.

Your understanding of adding to Scripture is not correct.

 

[Cliff2]

Hello Cliff



Yes there is, The body is the temple of the holy spirit, Anything that harms or defiles the temple should not be partaken of,

If there was no bodily harm in smoking then it would not be a sin and there would be nothing wrong with it at all,

You are using one plus one to get to two. By the way I agree with that.

But accorcing to your reasoning and previously stated logic that is wrong.

 

[deu58]

Hello cliff

But accorcing to your reasoning and previously stated logic that is wrong.

And as usual you are making no sense at all

yours in Christ
deu 58

 

[FreeinChrist]

Is there anything in Scripture to say that we should not smoke or take drugs?

By saying not to smoke or take drugs in my book is not adding to Scripture.

You are only trying to find ways of puting doubt into peoples minds.

Try something uplifting for a change.

Lousy argument there, Cliff. There is scripture about out bodies being a temple, and about soberness, etc.

White is claiming events occured in heaven - without a limb to stand to stand on scripturally! AND she claims the prophetic spirit - that she is telling truth.
Commentators do not claim to be prophets.

Both Airdude and yourself have nothing to back yourself up with in this discussion.

 

[deu58]

Hello Freeinchrist

Lousy argument there, Cliff. There is scripture about out bodies being a temple, and about soberness, etc.

White is claiming events occured in heaven - without a limb to stand to stand on scripturally! AND she claims the prophetic spirit - that she is telling truth.
Commentators do not claim to be prophets.

Both Airdude and yourself have nothing to back yourself up with in this discussion.

Well said and very true,

yours in Christ
deu 58

 

[deu58]

Hello Cliff

Your understanding of adding to Scripture is not correct.

And your entire understanding of Scripture is incorrect!!!!!

yours in Christ
deu 58

 

[RP1000]

for me as far as whorshiping the Lord of the 1st day of the week etc etc

thats all Old Testament,

in the OT one could only be with God in the temple

but the NT is God is in you (if you are a Christian) therefore, you can whorship

anywhere and time

 

[deu58]

Hi all

Is Sister White in Harmony with the teachings of the Bible?? Not Hardly, Here is a note from former SDA Scholar Robert Brimsmeads Sabbath Rexamined


Ellen White rebuilds the wall of partition torn down by Christ in Ephesians

1) It is interesting to compare Paul's comments about the dividing wall in Ephesians 2:14 with Ellen G. White's remarks: "I saw that the holy Sabbath is, and will be, the separating wall between the true Israel of God and unbelievers" (Ellen G. White, Early Writings [Washington D.C.: Review & Herald Publishing Assn., 1945], p.85).


yours in Christ
deu 58

 

[deu58]

The Bible and Ellen G. White

1) WAS THE PLAN OF SALVATION MADE BEFORE THE FALL, OR AFTER?

BIBLE: Before
Who hath saved us, and called us ... according to His own purpose and grace, which was given us in Christ Jesus *before the world began.* (2 Timothy 1:9)

EGW: After
The Kingdom of grace was instituted immediately after the fall of Man ... (GC 347)


2) WAS ADAM DECEIVED?

BIBLE: No
Adam was not deceived ... (1 Timothy 2:14)

EGW: Yes
... Adam also was deceived. (GC 352, 1885 ed.)


3) HOW MANY OF EACH KIND OF CLEAN BEAST WENT INTO THE ARK?

BIBLE: 14
Then the Lord said to Noah, "...Take with you seven pairs of all clean animals, the male and his mate." (Genesis 7:1-2 RSV)

EGW: 7
[The unclean beasts came] two and two, male and female, and clean beasts by sevens. (3 SG 67)


4) WERE 14 OF EACH KIND OF BIRD TAKEN INTO THE ARK?

BIBLE: Yes
"... and seven pairs of the birds of the air also." (Genesis 7:3 RSV)

[No distinction between clean and unclean; seven pairs of each kind.]

EGW: No
[Birds of every description] came flying to the ark, two and two, male and female, and the clean birds by sevens. (3 SG 67)


5) WERE SOME KINDS OF ANIMALS NOT TAKEN INTO THE ARK?

BIBLE: No
And God said to Noah, "Of every living thing *of all flesh* you shall bring two of every sort into the ark." (Genesis 6:13, 19 RSV)

EGW: Yes
Every species of animals which God had created was preserved in the ark. The *confused species...were destroyed*. (3 SG 15)


6) DID EVERYTHING OUTSIDE THE ARK DIE?

BIBLE: Yes
And God said unto Noah, "... Every thing that is in the earth shall die." (Genesis 6:17)

EGW: No
God by His miraculous power *preserved a few of the different kinds of trees and shrubs.* (1 SG 77)


7) WAS NOAH ALLOWED TO EAT EVERY KIND OF MEAT?

BIBLE: Yes
And God said to them [Noah's family], "... Every moving thing that lives shall be food for you..." (Genesis 9:1, 3)

EGW: No
Now that every green thing had been destroyed, He allowed them [Noah's family], to eat *the flesh of the clean beasts ...* PP 107


8) WAS BABEL BUILT AFTER THE FLOOD?

BIBLE: Yes
These are the families of the sons of Noah ... *after the flood* ... And they said, Go to, let us build a city and a tower. (Genesis 10:32, 11:4)

EGW: No
This system was corrupted before the flood by those who separated themselves from the faithful followers of God, and engaged in the building of the tower of Babel. (3 SG 301)


9) DID PHARAOH'S MAGICIANS TURN RODS INTO SERPENTS?

BIBLE: Yes
Aaron cast down his rod... and it became a serpent ... The magicians of Egypt, did the same. Every man cast down his rod, and they became serpents. (Exodus 7:10-12 RSV)

EGW: No
The magicians ... did not really cause their rods to become serpents, but ... made them appear like serpents ... (3 SG 205-206)


10) DOES GOD PERMIT DRINKING?

BIBLE: Yes
And thou shalt bestow that money for whatsoever thy soul lusteth after, for oxen, or for sheep, or for wine, or for strong drink, or for whatsoever thy soul desireth ... (Deuteronomy 14:26)

EGW: No
The Lord has given special directions in His word in reference to the use of wine and strong drink. He has forbidden their use, and enforced His prohibitions with strong warnings and threatenings. (Te 42)

[No such Bible passage exists.]


11) DOES OUR OBEDIENCE AND FAITH RECONCILE US TO GOD?

BIBLE: No
For it is by grace you have been saved, through faith -- and this not from yourselves, it is the gift of God -- not by works, so that no one can boast. (Ephesians 2:8-9)

Once you were alienated from God and were enemies in your minds because of your evil behavior. But now He has reconciled you by Christ's physical body through death to present you holy in His sight, without blemish and free from accusation. (Colossians 1:21-22)

EGW: Yes
"Man, who has defaced the image of God in his soul by a corrupt life, cannot, by mere human effort, effect a radical change in himself. He must accept the provisions of the gospel; he must be reconciled to God through obedience to His law and faith in Jesus Christ" (Testimonies, vol. 4, p. 294)


12) WAS THE MAN JESUS CHRIST ALSO TRULY GOD?

EGW: No
"The man Christ Jesus was not the Lord God Almighty" (Letter 32, 1899, quoted in the Seventh-day Adventist Bible Commentary, vol. 5, p. 1129).

BIBLE: Yes
"For to us a child is born, to us a son is given, and the government will be on His shoulders. And He will be called Wonderful Counselor, Mighty God, Everlasting Father, Prince of Peace." (Isaiah 9:6)

"Look, He is coming with the clouds, and every eye will see Him, even those who pierced Him; and all the peoples of the earth will mourn because of Him. So shall it be! Amen. 'I am the Alpha and the Omega,' says the Lord God, 'who is, and who was, and who is to come, the Almighty." (Revelation 1:7-8)

"Therefore God exalted Him (Jesus) to the highest place and gave Him the name that is above every name." (Philippians 2:9)


13) WILL OBEYING THE COMMANDMENTS EARN ME GOD'S FAVOR?

BIBLE: No
All our righteous acts are like filthy rags. (Isaiah 64:6)

Clearly no one is justified before God by the law, because, 'The righteous will live by faith.' (Galatians 3:11)

EGW: Yes
To obey the commandments of God is the only way to obtain (earn) His favor. (Testimonies, vol.4, p.28)


14) DID SAMSON DISOBEY GOD WHEN HE MARRIED A PHILISTINE?

BIBLE: No
"Samson said to his father, 'Get her for me. She's the right one for me.' (His parents did not know this was from the Lord, who was seeking an occasion to confront the Philistines.) ..." (Judges 14:3-4).

EGW: Yes
"A young woman dwelling in the Philistine town of Timnath engaged Samson's affections, and he determined to make her his wife ... The parents at last yielded to his wishes, and the marriage took place ... The time when he must execute his divine mission -- the time above all others when he should have been true to God -- Samson connected himself with the enemies of Israel. ... He was placing himself in a position where he could not fulfill the purpose to be accomplished by his life ... The wife, to obtain whom Samson had
transgressed the command of God, proved treacherous to her husband" (Patriarchs and Prophets, pp. 562, 563).


15) WERE THE TEN COMMANDMENTS WRITTEN ON BOTH SIDES OF THE TABLES?

BIBLE: Yes

And Moses turned, and went down from the mountain with the two tables in his hands, tables that were written on both sides; on the one side and on the other were they written. (Exodus 32:15 RSV)

EGW: No
In the ark was... the tables of stone which folded together like a book. Jesus opened them, and I saw the ten commandments. (EW 32)


16) DID THE ISRAELITES DIE OF GLUTTONY?

BIBLE: No
While the meat was yet between their teeth, before it was consumed ... the Lord smote the people with a very great plague ... (Numbers 11:33)

EGW: Yes
God granted their desire, giving them flesh, and leaving them to eat till their gluttony produced a plague. (CDF 148)


17) DID JESUS DIE TO GIVE US A SECOND PROBATION?

BIBLE: No
"I tell you, now is the time of God's favor, now is the day of salvation" (2 Corinthians 6:2).

"How shall we escape if we ignore such a great salvation?" (Hebrews 2:3)

"Man is destined to die once, and after that to face judgment, so Christ was sacrificed once to take away the sins of many people; and He will appear a second time, not to bear sin, but to bring salvation to those who are waiting for Him" (Hebrews 9:27-28).

NOTE: The Bible clearly teaches that there is no second chance for salvation. Everyone living before Christ was saved exactly the same way as everyone living after Christ -- during their lifetime everyone accepts either God's gift of salvation through Christ or is excluded from eternal life. Jesus death on the cross was not an afterthought, not a second probation and not a second chance.

EGW: Yes
"Death entered the world because of transgression. But Christ gave His life that man should have another trial. He did not die on the cross to abolish the law of God, but to secure for man a second probation" (Testimonies to Ministers, p. 134).


18) WAS THE ATONEMENT FOR SIN COMPLETED AT THE CR0SS?

BIBLE: Yes
"When He had received the drink, Jesus said, 'It is finished.' With that, He bowed His head and gave up His spirit." (John 19:30)

"But now a righteousness from God, apart from law, has been made known, to which the Law and the Prophets testify. This righteousness from God comes through faith in Jesus and fall short of the glory of God, and are justified freely by His grace through the redemption that came by Christ Jesus. God presented Him as a sacrifice of atonement, through faith in His blood." (Romans 3:21-25)

"Since we have now been justified by His blood, how much more shall we be saved from God's wrath through Him! For if, when we were God's enemies, we were reconciled to Him through the death of His Son, how much more, having been reconciled, shall we be saved through His life! Not only is this so, but we also rejoice in God through our Lord Jesus
Christ, through whom we have now received reconciliation." (Romans 5:9-11)

"Not only is this so, but we also rejoice in God through our Lord Jesus Christ, through whom we have now received reconciliation." (Romans 5:11 NIV)

EGW: No
"Instead of ... Daniel 8:14 referring to the purifying of the earth, it was now plain that it pointed to the closing work of our High Priest in heaven, the finishing of the atonement, and the preparing of the people to abide the day of His coming." (Testimonies, vol. 1, p. 58)

"Jesus entered the most holy of the heavenly (sanctuary), at the end of the 2300 days of Daniel 8, in 1844, to make a final atonement for all who could be benefited by His mediation." (Early Writings, p. 253)

NOTE: The Bible totally rejects EGW's idea of the 2300 days and an investigative judgment in the heavenly sanctuary beginning in 1844. Notice how the Bible texts quoted above were all written less than thirty years after Jesus' resurrection, and all clearly state that Christians living then were already fully justified, redeemed, sanctified and reconciled to God through Christ's death on the cross. As cult-watchers, Martin and Barnhouse stated: "The (SDA sanctuary doctrine) is the most colossal, psychological, face-saving phenomenon in religious history! We personally do not believe that there is even a suspicion of a verse in Scripture to sustain such a peculiar position. And we further believe that any effort to establish it is stale, flat, and unprofitable."


19) DID SATAN TEMPT JESUS AT THE END, OR AT THE START, OF THE 40 DAYS?

BIBLE: End
And when He had fasted forty days and nights ... the tempter came to Him... (Matthew 4:2-3)

EGW: Start
As soon as Christ began His fast, Satan appeared. (Christ Our Saviour, p. 45)


20) ARE WE RECONCILED TO GOD BY OBEDIENCE TO THE LAW?

BIBLE: No
God hath reconciled us unto Himself by Jesus Christ ... (2 Corinthians 5:18)

We were reconciled to God by the death of His son ... (Romans 5:10)

EGW: Yes
He [man] must be reconciled to God through obedience to His law. (4T 294)

 

[deu58]

21) DID PAUL RECEIVE THE GOSPEL INDEPENDENTLY OF THE APOSTLES?

BIBLE: Yes
But I certify you, brethren, that the gospel which was preached of Me ... I neither received it of man, neither was I taught it ... I conferred not with flesh and blood: Neither went I up to Jerusalem to them which were apostles before me ... (Galatians 1:11-12, 16-17)

EGW: No
Paul must receive instruction in the Christian faith ... Christ sends him to the very disciples whom he had been so bitterly persecuting, to learn of them ... (3T 430)


22) DOES CHRIST'S BLOOD CANCEL SIN?

BIBLE: Yes
... He took away our sins through the blood of His Son. (Ephesians 1:6 LB)

Jesus suffered and died outside the city, where His blood washed our sins away. (Hebrews 13:12 LB)

EGW: No
The blood of Christ, while it was to release the repentant sinner from the condemnation of the law, was not to cancel sin. ( PP 357)


23) CAN WE ATTAIN A SINLESS STATE?

BIBLE: No
If we say that we have no sin, we deceive ourselves ... If we say that we have not sinned, we make Him a liar. (1 John 1:8-10)

... there is no man which sinneth not. (2 Chronicles 8:36)

EGW: Yes
In order to let Jesus into our hearts, we must stop sinning. (ST 3-3-1898)


24) WERE OUR SINS BLOTTED OUT AT CALVARY?

BIBLE: Yes
For God was in Christ, restoring the world to Himself, no longer counting men's sins against them but blotting them out. This is the wonderful message He has given us to tell others. (2 Corinthians 5:19 LB)

EGW: No
In 1844 began the work of blotting out sins. (Christ in His Sanctuary, p. 122)


25) IS CHRIST'S HEALING GIVEN FREELY TO ALL?

BIBLE: Yes
When the even was come, they brought Him many ... and [He] healed all ... (Matthew 8:16 RSV)

... multitudes followed Him, and He healed them all. (Matthew 12:15 RSV)

EGW: No
Prayer for the sick: We should first find out if the sick one has been withholding tithes or has made trouble in the church. (UT quoted in HL 237)


26) IS IT A SIN FOR MARRIED COUPLES TO HAVE SEX?

BIBLE: No
Marriage is honorable in all, and the bed undefiled ... (Hebrews 13:4)

EGW: Yes
Because you are married you think you commit no sin. (2T 473)


27) IS IT PROPER TO STAND FOR PRAYER?

BIBLE: Yes
And when ye stand praying ... (Mark 11:25)

EGW: No
Where have our brethren obtained the idea that they should stand upon their feet when praying to God? ... As I beheld him standing ... my soul was stirred within me to give him an open rebuke. Calling him by name, I said, "Get down upon your knees. This is the proper position always." (MS 84b)

[Elder D.E. Robinson, a secretary to Ellen White from 1902-1915, reported: "I have been present repeatedly at camp meetings and General Conference sessions in which Sister White has offered prayer with the congregation standing, and she herself standing." Letter, March 4, 1934]


28) IS THE SABBATH "THE SEAL OF GOD"?

BIBLE: No
You were marked in Him [the Holy Spirit] with a seal, the promised Holy Spirit. (Ephesians 1:13)

Do not grieve the Holy Spirit of God with whom you were sealed for the day of redemption. (Ephesians 4:30)

EGW: Yes
The sign, or seal, of God is revealed in the observance of the seventh-day Sabbath, the Lord's memorial of creation. (Testimonies, vol. 8, p. 117)

The enemies of God's law, from the ministers down to the least among them, have a new conception of truth and duty. Too late they see that the Sabbath of the fourth commandment is the seal of the living God. (GC 640)


29) CAN MINISTERS EAT MEAT?

BIBLE: Yes
And when the hour was come, He sat down, and the twelve apostles with Him. And [Jesus] said unto them, With desire I have desired to eat this passover [lamb] with you ... (Luke 22:14-15)

EGW: No
Let not any of our ministers set an evil example in the eating of flesh meat. (CDF 399)


30) DID GOD PROVIDE FLESH AS FOOD FOR MAN?

BIBLE: Yes
And the LORD spake unto Moses and to Aaron, saying ... These are the beasts which ye shall eat ... (Leviticus 11:1-2)

... thou mayest kill and eat flesh in all thy gates, whatsoever thy soul lusteth after, according to the blessing of the LORD thy God which He hath given thee ... (Deuteronomy 12:15)

EGW: No
God did not provide for the flesh of dead animals to compose the diet of man. (CDF 410)


31) DOES A MEAT DIET MAKE A PERSON LESS SPIRITUAL?

BIBLE: No
Commanding the crowd to sit down on the ground, [Jesus] took the seven loaves and the fish, and ... gave them to the disciples, and the disciples gave them to the crowds. And they all ate and were satisfied. (Matthew 15:35-37)

... [Jesus] said unto them, Have ye here any meat? And they gave Him a piece of a broiled fish, and of an honeycomb. And He took it, and did eat before them. (Luke 24:41-43)

EGW: Yes
The more largely flesh composes the diet of teachers and pupils, the less susceptible will be the mind to comprehend spiritual things. (CDF 395)


32) ARE EGGS GOOD TO EAT?

BIBLE: Yes
If a son shall ask bread of any of you that is a father, will he give him a stone?...Or if he shall ask an egg, will he offer him a scorpion? If ye then, being evil, know how to give good gifts unto your children: how much more shall your heavenly Father .... (Luke 11:11-13)

EGW: No
Eggs should not be placed upon your table. They are an injury to your children. (2T 400)


33) IS CHEESE GOOD TO EAT?

BIBLE: Yes
Now Jesse said to his son David, "... Take along these ten cheeses to the commander of their unit. (1 Samuel 17:17-18 NIV)

They also brought wheat and barley, flour and roasted grain, beans and lentils, honey and curds, sheep, and cheese from cows' milk for David and his people to eat. (2 Samuel 17:28-29)

EGW: No
Cheese is wholly unfit for food. (CDF 368)


34) IS BUTTER GOOD TO EAT?

BIBLE: Yes
Behold, a virgin shall conceive, and bear a son, and shall call His name Immanuel. Butter and honey shall He eat ... (Isaiah 7:14-15)

EGW: No
... spices, butter, cheese...do their work of deranging the stomach ... and enfeebling the intellect. (3T 136)


35) IS IT A SIN TO TAKE THE LIVES OF ANIMALS TO EAT THEIR FLESH?

BIBLE: No
He said to Simon, "Put out into the deep and let down your nets for a catch." [Jesus ordered the disciples to kill these fish] ... And when they had done this they enclosed a great shoal of fish...and filled both the boats. (Luke 5:4-7 RSV)

EGW: Yes
What man with a human heart...could look into their eyes ... and willingly devour their flesh? (MH 316)

... the selfishness of taking the lives of animals... (UT, Aug 30, 1896)


36) ARE WE NOT TO TASTE OR TOUCH CERTAIN FOODS?

BIBLE: No
Since you died with Christ and this has set you free from following the world's ideas of how to be saved -- by doing good and obeying various rules -- why do you keep right on following them anyway, still bound by such rules as not eating, tasting, or even touching certain foods? Such rules are mere human teachings, for food was made to be eaten and used up. These rules may seem good, for rules of this kind require strong devotion and are humiliating and hard on the body, but they have no effect when it comes to conquering a person's evil thoughts and desires.* They only make him proud. (Colossians 2:20-21 LB)

EGW: Yes
The Lord would bring His people into a position where they will not touch or taste the flesh of dead animals. (CDF 380)

[* Dozens of EGW statements assert that abstaining from meat (particularly ham) has an enormous effect in purifying one's thoughts and desires.]


37) CAN MEAT EATERS ENJOY THE COMPANY OF ANGELS?

BIBLE: Yes
... [Jesus] said unto them, Have ye here any meat? And they gave Him a piece of a broiled fish, and of an honeycomb. And He took it, and did eat before them... And He led them out as far as to Bethany, and He lifted up His hands, and blessed them. And it came to pass, while He blessed them, He was parted from them, and carried up into heaven. (Luke 24:41-43, 50-51)

EGW: No
How can those who are seeking to become pure and holy that they may have the companionship of heavenly angels ... take the life of God's creatures that they may consume the flesh? (CDF 380)


38) WILL GOD COMMAND US TO ABSTAIN FROM MEAT IN THE LATTER DAYS?

BIBLE: No
Now the Spirit speaketh expressly, that in the latter times some shall depart from the faith ... commanding to abstain from meats, which God hath created to be received with thanksgiving of them which believe and know the truth. For every creature of God is good, and nothing to be refused, if it be received with thanksgiving. (1 Timothy 4:1-4)

EGW: Yes
Among those who are waiting for the coming of the Lord, meat eating will eventually be done away. (CDF 380)


39) WILL WE KNOW WHEN JESUS WILL COME?

BIBLE: No
But of that day and hour knoweth no man, no, not the angels of heaven, but my Father only ... Watch therefore: for ye know not what hour your Lord doth come. (Matthew 24:36, 42)

EGW: Yes
As God has shown me in holy vision...we heard the voice of God ... which gave us the day and hour of Jesus' coming. (WLF 14)


40) CAN WE SAY WE ARE SAVED RIGHT NOW BY CHRIST'S GRACE?

BIBLE: Yes
I write these things to you who believe in the name of the Son of God so that you may know that you have eternal life. (1 John 5:13)

EGW: No
Those who accept the Saviour, however sincere their conversion, should never be taught to say or feel that they are saved ... Those who accept Christ, and in their first confidence say, I am saved, are in danger of trusting to themselves. (COL 155)

This is actually a very very small sample of the many many additions and deletions that Ellen G White has made to the Bible claiming that these things were revealed to her by divine authority,

yours in Christ
deu 58

 

[Cliff2]

I wonder how many of those objections that deu58 found out for himself?

Probably got them off some anti-EGW site.

 

[EdmundBlackadderTheThird]

I wonder how many of those objections that deu58 found out for himself?

Probably got them off some anti-EGW site.

Does that make them any less true? Do you want links to the official EGW site where most of those quotes are published for the world to see? Those are EGW quotes that anyone can look up and verify the authenticity of. They contradict the word of God. They add to and take away from scripture. There really is no defense for them.

 

[deu58]

Hi Cliff

I wonder how many of those objections that deu58 found out for himself?

Probably got them off some anti-EGW site.

I can actually find alot more than those all by myself cliff, You seem to forget that I am the Webmaster of my own Anti EGW site,

I have gone through the first 16 Chapters of Patriarchs and Prophets line by line page by page using the Bible and history, Documets and letters etc and that is just one section of my site,

I have a sabbath section, Investigative section, SDA Arianism section etc,

All using the writings of the SOP compered to the Bible, Every word, Every article I have personally spent many hours researching, I have every word that EGW ever wrote on CD-rom.

It is the official CD sold by the Ellen G White estate, The very same one your pastors use so no one can say that I am making things up or using an unauthorized copy of the writings,

I do not need to go to any site to get evidence to prove my point that EGW is a False Prophetess

yours in Christ
deu 58

 

[Cliff2]

EGW: No
Those who accept the Saviour, however sincere their conversion, should never be taught to say or feel that they are saved ... Those who accept Christ, and in their first confidence say, I am saved, are in danger of trusting to themselves. (COL 155)

Page 155



"Peter's fall was not instantaneous, but gradual. Self-confidence led him to the belief that he was saved, and step after step was taken in the downward path, until he could deny his Master. Never can we safely put confidence in self or feel, this side of heaven, that we are secure against temptation. Those who accept the Saviour, however sincere their conversion, should never be taught to say or to feel that they are saved. This is misleading. Every one should be taught to cherish hope and faith; but even when we give ourselves to Christ and know that He accepts us, we are not beyond the reach of temptation. God's word declares, "Many shall be purified, and made white, and tried." Dan. 12:10. Only he who endures the trial will receive the crown of life. (James 1:12.)

Those who accept Christ, and in their first confidence say, I am saved, are in danger of trusting to themselves. They lose sight of their own weakness and their constant need of divine strength. They are unprepared for Satan's devices, and under temptation many, like Peter, fall into the very depths of sin. We are admonished, "Let him that thinketh he standeth, take heed lest he fall." 1 Cor. 10:12. Our only safety is in constant distrust of self, and dependence on Christ.

It was necessary for Peter to learn his own defects of character, and his need of the power and grace of Christ. The Lord could not save him from trial, but He could have saved him from defeat. Had Peter been willing to receive Christ's warning, he would have been watching unto prayer. He would have walked with fear and trembling lest his feet should stumble. And he would have received divine help so that Satan could not have gained the victory.

It was through self-sufficiency that Peter fell; and it was through repentance and humiliation that his feet were again established. In the record of his experience every repenting sinner may find encouragement. Though Peter"

Look at the full quote and see how much different it is when most of the page has been left out.

You cannot be trusted to give the full quote and let all to see what has been written.

 

[statrei]

The biggest problem facing Christians is that they are more interested in group warfare than in seeking truth. It is so much more pleasing to the Creator and more productive when we keep our prejudices under control.

We have here accusations of material being added to Scripture but those making the accusations are unable to clearly define what Scripture is. Nor will they because it will quickly paint them into a corner.

It is being suggested that it is somehow unChristian to add to Scripture yet no support has been offered to bolster that claim.

I am a lifelong member of the Adventist church and I believe that EGW had a divinely inspired ministry. But that is nothing unique. Everyday millions of individuals are being used as instruments of the kingdom. The problem comes from believing that only a few people can be used as messengers of the Creator, a false belief clearly held by many of the EGW detractors here, or in believing that when the Creator commissions an individual with a mission that this act renders that individual incapable of making errors of one sort or other where that mission is concerned, a fallacy believed by most of those on this forum. The truth is that the Creator uses all and He does not stop us from being human. The Hebrews made mistakes, the Jews made mistakes, the early church made mistakes and all of these mistakes are clearly documented in the pages of the Holy Bible. Somehow these are overlooked as if they never happened. It is no surprise that modern churches, no matter what they claim also make mistakes. Unlike many of my Adventist brothers I also accept that EGW made mistakes as well. And all these mistakes had to do with substantial areas of truth.

 

[deu58]

Hello Cliff

Page 155



"Peter's fall was not instantaneous, but gradual. Self-confidence led him to the belief that he was saved, and step after step was taken in the downward path, until he could deny his Master. Never can we safely put confidence in self or feel, this side of heaven, that we are secure against temptation. Those who accept the Saviour, however sincere their conversion, should never be taught to say or to feel that they are saved. This is misleading. Every one should be taught to cherish hope and faith; but even when we give ourselves to Christ and know that He accepts us, we are not beyond the reach of temptation. God's word declares, "Many shall be purified, and made white, and tried." Dan. 12:10. Only he who endures the trial will receive the crown of life. (James 1:12.)

Those who accept Christ, and in their first confidence say, I am saved, are in danger of trusting to themselves. They lose sight of their own weakness and their constant need of divine strength. They are unprepared for Satan's devices, and under temptation many, like Peter, fall into the very depths of sin. We are admonished, "Let him that thinketh he standeth, take heed lest he fall." 1 Cor. 10:12. Our only safety is in constant distrust of self, and dependence on Christ.

It was necessary for Peter to learn his own defects of character, and his need of the power and grace of Christ. The Lord could not save him from trial, but He could have saved him from defeat. Had Peter been willing to receive Christ's warning, he would have been watching unto prayer. He would have walked with fear and trembling lest his feet should stumble. And he would have received divine help so that Satan could not have gained the victory.

It was through self-sufficiency that Peter fell; and it was through repentance and humiliation that his feet were again established. In the record of his experience every repenting sinner may find encouragement. Though Peter"

Look at the full quote and see how much different it is when most of the page has been left out.

You cannot be trusted to give the full quote and let all to see what has been written.

The full quote does not change anything, Did Peter lose his salvation??? No,

Every time we make a mistake or sin in our daily lives we deny Christ, Just like Peter, So is christ crucified daily so we can be resaved daily?? No,

One sacrifice for all for all time for those who trust in him,

The bible message is that we can not rely upon our own strength to maintain our salvation, It is not something we earn over time it is something that is given at the time we truly accept Christ

According to Ellen White basically you need to save your self through Commnadment keeping first before you can be saved by the Blood of Christ,

yours in Christ
deu 58

 

[EdmundBlackadderTheThird]

Page 155



"Peter's fall was not instantaneous, but gradual. Self-confidence led him to the belief that he was saved, and step after step was taken in the downward path, until he could deny his Master. Never can we safely put confidence in self or feel, this side of heaven, that we are secure against temptation. Those who accept the Saviour, however sincere their conversion, should never be taught to say or to feel that they are saved. This is misleading. Every one should be taught to cherish hope and faith; but even when we give ourselves to Christ and know that He accepts us, we are not beyond the reach of temptation. God's word declares, "Many shall be purified, and made white, and tried." Dan. 12:10. Only he who endures the trial will receive the crown of life. (James 1:12.)

Those who accept Christ, and in their first confidence say, I am saved, are in danger of trusting to themselves. They lose sight of their own weakness and their constant need of divine strength. They are unprepared for Satan's devices, and under temptation many, like Peter, fall into the very depths of sin. We are admonished, "Let him that thinketh he standeth, take heed lest he fall." 1 Cor. 10:12. Our only safety is in constant distrust of self, and dependence on Christ.

It was necessary for Peter to learn his own defects of character, and his need of the power and grace of Christ. The Lord could not save him from trial, but He could have saved him from defeat. Had Peter been willing to receive Christ's warning, he would have been watching unto prayer. He would have walked with fear and trembling lest his feet should stumble. And he would have received divine help so that Satan could not have gained the victory.

It was through self-sufficiency that Peter fell; and it was through repentance and humiliation that his feet were again established. In the record of his experience every repenting sinner may find encouragement. Though Peter"

Look at the full quote and see how much different it is when most of the page has been left out.

You cannot be trusted to give the full quote and let all to see what has been written.

Regardless of the context it still contradicts scripture no matter how good the advice sounds. Look to scripture and find one place where it says we cannot be sure, as Christians, of our salvation.

 

[deu58]

Hello Stateri

Unlike many of my Adventist brothers I also accept that EGW made mistakes as well. And all these mistakes had to do with substantial areas of truth.

Is this a mistake in grammer or is what you really mean???? She had a divine Ministry but made mistakes in sustantial areas of truth?????

What good is a divine ministry that makes mistakes in Substantial areas????

yours in Christ
deu 58