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SDA and after death

SavedSinner777

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Yes, but it's also seems that no one is actually sleeping. There is no soul that is sleeping (correct me if that's off). Does SDA consider "soul sleep" pejorative?

Sleep is a convenient metaphor that the Bible uses for death. The fact that the Bible describes death as sleep is one of many reasons why Adventists regard death as an unconscious state.

 
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public hermit

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Sleep is a convenient metaphor that the Bible uses for death. The fact that the Bible describes death as sleep is one of many reasons why Adventists regard death as an unconscious state.


Okay, that makes sense. It's a metaphor coupled with a specific conception of the person as physical body + breath of life. I just noticed above that someone put sleep in quotes, i.e., "sleep." Thank you.
 
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BobRyan

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Yes, but it's also seems that no one is actually sleeping. There is no soul that is sleeping (correct me if that's off). Does SDA consider "soul sleep" pejorative?

yes there is a soul that is sleeping. Jehovah's Witnesses believe the soul ceases to exist at death - but SDAs claim that the soul still exists - and in death it is in a dormant state. A "living soul" is the case of a person who is not physically dead.

Ez 18 says none of the righteous die - and only the wicked died. But it starts with "the soul that sins will die". The only way both are true is if all of Ezek 18 is referencing the second death mentioned in Rev 20. In that case only the wicked die and in that second death - "the soul that sins will die" 18:4.

Matt 10:28 "do not fear those who kill the body but not the soul"
John 11 "our friend Lazarus sleeps" not "our friend Lazarus no longer exists"
1 Thess 4:13-18 "regarding those WHO have fallen asleep in Jesus" rather than "regarding those who no longer exist"
 
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Freth

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An easier explanation is this:

Rather than having a soul, you are a living soul. When you, a living soul, die, you are no longer a living soul, but in a sleep state. A living soul, again, consists of a physical body + breath of life. Upon death, the body decays and returns to dust eventually. The breath of life goes back to God. What's left behind is in a sleep state.

This then begs the question. Is the part of you that remains and is in a sleep state what you would call a soul? Not in the traditional sense, I don't think. Even the SDA Fundamental Beliefs make it a point to use the word soul in quotes in the statement, "Our “souls” go to sleep when we die."

I don't think scripture defines exactly what that part of us (in the sleep state) is called, since whenever it refers to a soul it's the living soul before death, still having the breath of life.

I refrain from calling it a soul, mainly because it can be misconstrued as the traditional Christian definition of what a soul is (which confuses the matter further), then leading to the term "soul sleep", which many Christians instantly have negative reactions to.

A living soul has consciousness and awareness, according to scripture. When you die, what scripture calls sleep is more like a pause button. That part of you has no awareness, no part in any thing. I think that's why our website calls it a soul in quotes, for lack of a better term.

Here's some interesting reading. It's an Andrews University article called Death as Sleep: The (Mis)use of a Biblical Metaphor. It appears I'm not the only one.

Excerpts:

The point is rather simple: the persistent appeal of our pioneers to the sleep metaphor to describe death, giving this metaphor a doctrinal status, and even referring to it in terms of the sleep of the soul, made us vulnerable, leading many people to think that we believe in an intermediate state in which the souls of the dead remain dormant and unconscious in the grave waiting for the resurrection. It is important to highlight that for non-SDAs the soul-sleep concept could still be understood dualistically in connection with the immortality of the soul, and throughout Christian history there have been several immortalists who believed just that.

This was, for example, the case of some early Syrian writers such as Ephrem (or Ephraem), John Wyclif, William Tyndale, and Martin Luther. Many Anabaptists and Socinians apparently also subscribed to this view, which was also fairly widespread in England in the sixteenth and seventeenth centuries. Even to this day “soul sleep” is generally defined as “a kind of temporary suspended animation of the soul between the moment of personal death and the time when our bodies will be resurrected.” In view of such a scenario, our emphasis on the sleep of the soul was in fact doomed to misapprehension (emphasis added).

...

The problem, however, is that the improper use of the sleep metaphor was not confined to our pioneers. In several more recent publications by Adventist authors concerning the state of the dead we find statements—even official ones—that could inadvertently be taken as an endorsement of soul-sleep concept as it has traditionally been understood in some dualistic circles. One thinks, for example, of the following paragraph of Carlyle B. Haynes: “Death is really and truly a sleep, a sleep that is deep, that is unconscious, that is unbroken until the awakening at the resurrection. In death,” Haynes continues, “man enters a state of sleep. The language of the Bible makes clear that it is the whole man which sleeps, not merely a part. No intimation is given that man sleeps only as to his body, and that he is wakeful and conscious as to his soul. All that comprises the man sleeps in death.”

...

Death is not sleep. One may resemble the other, but they are in fact two different things. Andrew T. Lincoln concurs: the NT use of sleep for death “was not meant to indicate the actual state of those who had died as some sort of unconscious existence but was a metaphor that stressed the temporary and reversible effect of death.” Similarly, Bruce Reichenbach insists that “the metaphor ‘sleep’. . . does not describe the ontological state of the dead, but rather refers to the possibility of the deceased: that though they now no longer exist, by the power of God they can be recreated to live again.”

I think one of the biggest problems SDA like myself have is properly explaining exactly what death as sleep actually means. I came to these same conclusions before I found the article. My "on pause" analogy pretty much goes along the same lines of the last paragraph above, in what I was trying to convey; that I don't think you can necessarily call it "soul sleep", because it's a metaphor.
 
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SavedSinner777

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Based on various passages in Scripture, Adventists believe that the wicked will be destroyed on judgment day, rather than spending eternal conscious torment in hell.

Which teaching, annihilation or eternal conscious torment, reflects better on the character of God?
 
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BobRyan

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Based on various passages in Scripture, Adventists believe that the wicked will be destroyed on judgment day, rather than spending eternal conscious torment in hell.

Which teaching, annihilation or eternal conscious torment, reflects better on the character of God?

And scripture supports the "destruction of both body and soul" in hell fire in Matt 10:28 - so while it is true that this presents the more accurate picture of our loving God who says "God IS Love"

1 John 4:
7 Beloved, let us love one another, for love is of God; and everyone who loves is born of God and knows God. 8 He who does not love does not know God, for God is love.

Matt 10:28
28 And do not fear those who kill the body but cannot kill the soul. But rather fear Him who is able to destroy both soul and body in hell.

Jude 1:
24 Now to Him who is able to keep you from stumbling,
And to present you faultless
Before the presence of His glory with exceeding joy,
25 To God our Savior,
Who alone is wise,
Be glory and majesty,
Dominion and power,
Both now and forever.
Amen.

====================

At the same time -- the torment in fire and brimstone is real and as Luke 12 points out - some receive many stripes in that torment and others few. But all are punished "according to their deeds".
 
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