School Prayer

[Belk]

These a significant difference between the signficance of what happens informally, and what is formalised and part of the way the whole community operates.


Surely that's part of the point - to expose students even to things they don't see the point of and/or don't agree with in a controlled way. That's how you build a respectful diverse community.



That's good as well, but there is a difference between experiencing praxis and talking about it. And that lacks the reflective element.

Besides, a good deal of my point is that we ought to be dealing with these issues, not trying to avoid them.

I agree whole heartedly that we should be addressing these issues. As our world gets smaller we need more then ever before to be understanding and tolerant of those with different cultures and religions. I just don't see having everyone pray in a different fashion every day as the way to achieve that. It seems to me that will cause more issues then it will solve. Most notably from those who will be horrified with the thought of their child having to pray to what they consider a false idol.

 

[ebia]

I agree whole heartedly that we should be addressing these issues. As our world gets smaller we need more then ever before to be understanding and tolerant of those with different cultures and religions. I just don't see having everyone pray in a different fashion every day as the way to achieve that. It seems to me that will cause more issues then it will solve. Most notably from those who will be horrified with the thought of their child having to pray to what they consider a false idol.

They don't have join in the prayer, just remain respectfully observant.

We might have trouble selling this to the fundamentalists, but that's precisely what we need to do. If we can't at least work towards that what hope is there?

 

[b&wpac4]

They don't have join in the prayer, just remain respectfully observant.

We might have trouble selling this to the fundamentalists, but that's precisely what we need to do.

Well, how do you handle a situation where the teacher does not know how to or cannot by the religion lead the class in prayer?

 

[ebia]

Well, how do you handle a situation where the teacher does not know how to or cannot by the religion lead the class in prayer?

In an ideal world I would want the students leading prayer on a rotation basis under the teacher's supervision. Any competent teacher ought to be able to cope with that with a small amount of professional development where necessary to clarify expectations.

 

[flicka]

Homeroom prayer on a rotating basis....so when it's the atheists turn? Nah, the non relegious folks would once again come out on the bottom while being told "just sit quietly and be respectful". You say that to someone often enough and the resentment will grow. I've sat "quietly and respectfully" for over 50 years and even though I won't make a scene because I'm polite, it creeps me out each and every time. Nobody should have to put up with it on a daily basis when they have no choice but to be there (ie: work, school)

Best to leave the unprovable out of the schools altogether, and let the students do what they want on their own time.

 

[ebia]

Homeroom prayer on a rotating basis....so when it's the atheists turn?

Some kind of reflexion. I want everyone's participation. Give a short reflection on an issue you feel is significant. Show a slideshow that illustrates something in the world. Play a piece of relective music, read out a "thought for the day"....

Learning how to be reflective in a way compatible with one's tradition ought to be a part of one's education regardless.

Best to leave the unprovable out of the schools altogether, and let the students do what they want on their own time.

School isn't about transmitting provable facts, but about learning to live and to learn.

 

[TeddyKGB]

So one minute of Catechism per semester is going to counteract the hours of Catholic-bashing that fundamentalist Baptists and Church-of-Christers encounter at home and elsewhere? One minute of Koranic prayer will set right all the anti-Islam propaganda?

Right.

 

[Belk]

They don't have join in the prayer, just remain respectfully observant.

We might have trouble selling this to the fundamentalists, but that's precisely what we need to do. If we can't at least work towards that what hope is there?

The one I mentioned. using other methods that they find less objectionable and would likely be more efficient. You seem fixated on the idea of morning prayers for some reason.

 

[b&wpac4]

Some kind of reflexion. I want everyone's participation. Give a short reflection on an issue you feel is significant. Show a slideshow that illustrates something in the world. Play a piece of relective music, read out a "thought for the day"....

Could a student give a slide show presentation about how prayer it morning bothers them because they don't believe in God and they find it silly to pray to a being they don't feel exists? Nice music and a moment of silence could then follow.

 

[PreachersWife2004]

I hope to God prayer time doesn't ever become mandatory in public schools.

As long as my child can pray before he takes a test, or eats his lunch, or whenever he wants to and is not being disruptive about it, I'm a happy camper.

Yes, we hear the stories about some schools not allowing this. I'm quite confident that it's not the majority. And until it becomes the majority, then it's not an issue.

My oldest child attends a private Lutheran school these days, and we hope to continue that through his college years, but if there ever were a time that any of my kids were in a public school, I wouldn't want them forced into praying with those who don't believe as he does. Nor would I expect those who don't believe as he does to want to pray with him.

Prayer is private. If we are praying to make a public spectacle of ourselves, or to beat our chests and say "look at us! We're good! We PRAY!" then we are no better than the Pharisees that Jesus rebuked.

 

[ebia]

Could a student give a slide show presentation about how prayer it morning bothers them because they don't believe in God and they find it silly to pray to a being they don't feel exists? Nice music and a moment of silence could then follow.

I wouldn't normally accept any presentation that attempts to undermine the very activity the students are being invited to participate in. If you want to turn that into a postive rather than negative thing - say a reflection on how the student can appreciate the beauty of a sunset without for itself, then fine. I wouldn't allow your one unmodified any more than I would alllow a prayer "for all the atheists to find Jesus" in the same context.

The one I mentioned. using other methods that they find less objectionable and would likely be more efficient. You seem fixated on the idea of morning prayers for some reason.

A morning reflection is an example picked out of my own context in order to discuss the principle and what I see the students missing out.

So one minute of Catechism per semester is going to counteract the hours of Catholic-bashing that fundamentalist Baptists and Church-of-Christers encounter at home and elsewhere? One minute of Koranic prayer will set right all the anti-Islam propaganda?

There are no magic wands that are going to suddenly make all the problems go away, but living, working and praying/reflecting together does help - particularly when children grow up with that. In Northern Ireland and in Israel there are initiatives to do exactly that, so that at least some of the next generation grow up seeing the others less as the "other group" and more as fellow people, sometimes friends, with far more in common than our differences. It is harder to hate Muslims if you know some of them personally. It is even harder if you've experienced their worship and seen that it's not much different from yours. You are much less likely to buy into the misinformation and depersonalisation of the propaganda.