Saving people

Status
Not open for further replies.

Joshua260

Well-Known Member
Oct 30, 2012
1,448
42
North Carolina
✟9,504.00
Faith
Baptist
Marital Status
Married
Politics
US-Republican
The goal of the gospel is to prevent your own god from putting people in hell. Something that is a part of his own plan.

Lee, you actually made me laugh at this one!

Of course, you know that sin cannot dwell with God. Therefore, after mankind rebelled and took on that sin nature, God made a path for us so that we could still get to him. That path is Jesus, and it is us who ultimately decide whether or not to follow and thus where we end up.
 
Upvote 0

Harry3142

Regular Member
Apr 9, 2006
3,749
259
Ohio
✟20,229.00
Faith
Anglican
Marital Status
Married
Politics
US-Republican
Lee M-

We have prevented nothing. It is God himself who has done all that is necessary to prevent anyone from going to hell. As the saying goes, "Those who go to hell must climb over the cross of Christ to get there." And it is God himself who has placed that cross in the way of those who would go there:

Now we know that whatever the law says, it says to those who are under the law, so that every mouth may be silenced and the whole world held accountable to God. Therefore no one will be declared righteous in his sight by observing the law; rather, through the law we become conscious of sin.

But now a righteousness from God, apart from law, has been made known, to which the Law and the Prophets testify. This righteousness from God comes through faith in Jesus Christ to all who believe. There is no difference, for all have sinned and fall short of the glory of God, and are justified freely by his grace through the redemption that came by Christ Jesus. God presented him as a sacrifice of atonement, through faith in his blood. He did this to demonstrate his justice, because in his forbearance he had left the sins committed beforehand unpunished - he did it to demonstrate his justice at the present time, so as to be just and the one who justifies those who have faith in Jesus. (Romans 3:19-26,NIV)
 
Upvote 0

bling

Regular Member
Site Supporter
Feb 27, 2008
16,211
1,816
✟829,153.00
Faith
Non-Denom
Marital Status
Married
And the alternative is something you believe must absolutely be prevented. You think the loving and just thing to do is make sure he doesnt do something that he is completely able and willing to do and that he will do? You are trying to prevent him from destroying your friends because if you dont he will and you dont want him to? You need to prevent your own god from doing horrible things?
This is what I said: “God is doing everything He can to help people to accept His gifts that include salvation, but God is not going to force His Love on anyone (that would be like a shotgun wedding with God holding the shotgun).”

What “alternative” to doing everything He can is there?

For God to do “more” would mean for God to go against your desires and force you to go to heaven where you will be unhappy?
 
Upvote 0

talitha

Cultivate Honduras
Nov 5, 2004
8,356
993
59
Tegucigalpa, Honduras
Visit site
✟22,601.00
Faith
Charismatic
Marital Status
Married
The wages of sin is death; death is separation from God and His people. People distance themselves from God at their own peril. God is not sending anyone away; he wants everyone to come near him, but as John wrote, men prefer darkness to light because their deeds are evil.
 
Upvote 0

dlamberth

Senior Contributor
Site Supporter
Oct 12, 2003
19,253
2,834
Oregon
✟758,223.00
Faith
Other Religion
Politics
US-Others
Upvote 0

Lee M

Well-Known Member
Nov 22, 2012
1,480
9
✟1,868.00
Faith
Deist
Marital Status
Single
Once again, my sharing the gospel (good news) with someone will not keep them from Hell. Repentance and faith are necessary components of salvation, neither of which I can do for a person.

However, He has chosen to use believers to spread that good news, and that is truly humbling. Could He have written the gospel in the clouds? I suppose, but that is not the reality of the situation.

you seem to feel like you are belaboring something but you are not. you witness as a tool to help people have this faith. so that they can go to heaven. this is paul called witnessing plucking people out of the fire. if that's not why YOU witness then alright.
 
Upvote 0

Lee M

Well-Known Member
Nov 22, 2012
1,480
9
✟1,868.00
Faith
Deist
Marital Status
Single
Lee, you actually made me laugh at this one!

Of course, you know that sin cannot dwell with God. Therefore, after mankind rebelled and took on that sin nature, God made a path for us so that we could still get to him. That path is Jesus, and it is us who ultimately decide whether or not to follow and thus where we end up.

Do you feel a need to witness to people? why? what will god do to them if they are not saved?

why would you laugh? you may be a bit too emotionally involved.
 
Upvote 0

Lee M

Well-Known Member
Nov 22, 2012
1,480
9
✟1,868.00
Faith
Deist
Marital Status
Single
This is what I said: “God is doing everything He can to help people to accept His gifts that include salvation, but God is not going to force His Love on anyone (that would be like a shotgun wedding with God holding the shotgun).”

What “alternative” to doing everything He can is there?

For God to do “more” would mean for God to go against your desires and force you to go to heaven where you will be unhappy?

... the alternative of us accepting and going to heaven... is god doing something that you are doing things to try to prevent him from doing. no?
 
Upvote 0

bling

Regular Member
Site Supporter
Feb 27, 2008
16,211
1,816
✟829,153.00
Faith
Non-Denom
Marital Status
Married
... the alternative of us accepting and going to heaven... is god doing something that you are doing things to try to prevent him from doing. no?
I am not trying to prevent God from doing anything?

I cannot decide for you that you will be happy in heaven, but I can present you with Godly Love and allow you to decide.
 
Upvote 0
This site stays free and accessible to all because of donations from people like you.
Consider making a one-time or monthly donation. We appreciate your support!
- Dan Doughty and Team Christian Forums

Joshua260

Well-Known Member
Oct 30, 2012
1,448
42
North Carolina
✟9,504.00
Faith
Baptist
Marital Status
Married
Politics
US-Republican
Do you feel a need to witness to people? why? what will god do to them if they are not saved?

why would you laugh? you may be a bit too emotionally involved.

why witness? because maybe i can help point the way. it's kind of like God has thrown out a life-preserver, and I'm trying to convince the drowning person to grab it so that God can pull them in. God provided the way of salvation, but it's up to the drowning person to accept it. I consider it a blessing to be a part of that if i can.

why did i laugh? because your question is kind of like a person who asks a kid why he should love their father who is always disciplining them. Wouldn't it be better if the father just left them alone? I think most Christians would say that they believe God loves them so much that...you know the rest. So when you ask something like, "why do you keep loving this guy who always does mean things to you?", I think many Christians would have to conclude that you are looking at the situation incorrectly.

A quote from Adrian Rogers just came to mind that kind of relates: "Don't ask God to cram His plan into your puny little mind, because then God would be limited by your understanding." Sometimes, we don't understand everything God does (just like our earthly fathers), but I believe we know enough to know that he(God) loves us.

Thus, my all-time favorite verse: Job 13:15 "Though he slay me, yet will I trust in him"Job 13:15 (KJV)
 
Upvote 0

Lee M

Well-Known Member
Nov 22, 2012
1,480
9
✟1,868.00
Faith
Deist
Marital Status
Single
i agree that christians generally consider that i have it wrong. I just thought it odd that you laugh. It implies that you dont take me or my request seriously.

my point is not that your god is bad. my point was it is apparant that you are trying to prevent him from doing something. this conflict is my concern. you seem to agree that are doing things because their is a possibility that he might do something horrible. your willingness to accep this situation is my concern.
 
Upvote 0

Lee M

Well-Known Member
Nov 22, 2012
1,480
9
✟1,868.00
Faith
Deist
Marital Status
Single
I am not trying to prevent God from doing anything?

I cannot decide for you that you will be happy in heaven, but I can present you with Godly Love and allow you to decide.

I know you can't decide or force anything.. but your actions seem to be a way of trying though with no surety.
 
Upvote 0

Joshua260

Well-Known Member
Oct 30, 2012
1,448
42
North Carolina
✟9,504.00
Faith
Baptist
Marital Status
Married
Politics
US-Republican
i agree that christians generally consider that i have it wrong.my point was it is apparant that you are trying to prevent him from doing something. this conflict is my concern. you seem to agree that are doing things because their is a possibility that he might do something horrible. your willingness to accep this situation is my concern.

Yes, you "have it wrong", and that's the short answer. It's like driving a car. If you don't step on the brake, you're going over the cliff. It is the driver's action that determines the result.
 
Upvote 0
This site stays free and accessible to all because of donations from people like you.
Consider making a one-time or monthly donation. We appreciate your support!
- Dan Doughty and Team Christian Forums

food4thought

Loving truth
Site Supporter
Jul 9, 2002
2,929
725
50
Watervliet, MI
✟384,329.00
Country
United States
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Single
Hi again, Lee. Does it really seem to you that our mission to share our faith with the lost is nothing more than playing a game of cosmic soul keep-away, with God as "monkey in the middle"?



Is your intense focus on hell so great that whenever you think about Jesus all you see is this literal lake of fire burning, just waiting for Him to toss in some tinder?


My friend, I think you have lost all perspective on the God of the Bible... you are so focused on one tree that you completely disregard the beauty and wonder of the Divine forest. When I share my faith, it is because God so loved me that He gave Jesus in my place, taking upon Himself the just wrath rightfully directed at me due to my horrible sins and His holy righteousness, so that I might be reconnected with God's overwhelming love through faith... and someone else loved me enough to share this message with me, so now I "pay it forward", just as God has commanded us to do.

Someone once paid it forward to you, Lee. Yet now instead of sharing His message of love, your questions are consistently turning the focus away from His great love for us, and focusing instead on the grim future reality of those who reject that love... yet doing this is the very thing that you claim drove you away from the God you once loved! Doing this is only reinforcing what broke your heart to begin with. Are you even open to thinking about God's love for humanity displayed for us at the cross, as you once did?
 
Upvote 0

Joshua260

Well-Known Member
Oct 30, 2012
1,448
42
North Carolina
✟9,504.00
Faith
Baptist
Marital Status
Married
Politics
US-Republican
alright I think you seriously misunderstand your own system ...

Didn't you say "christians generally consider that i have it wrong"? I've only echoed how most other Christians have responded on this subject.

Since, by your own admission, you have already asked this question of other Christians in the past and they "generally consider that you have it wrong", which implies that you have already received several answers, what is your purpose in continuing to ask the same question over and over?

This explains more about why I laughed earlier...because I had a feeling that you already knew what our answer would be (which was confirmed by your admission), and you actually had other reasons for posting your question.
 
Upvote 0
This site stays free and accessible to all because of donations from people like you.
Consider making a one-time or monthly donation. We appreciate your support!
- Dan Doughty and Team Christian Forums

Lee M

Well-Known Member
Nov 22, 2012
1,480
9
✟1,868.00
Faith
Deist
Marital Status
Single
I said most christians think I misunderstand christianity I didn't say I had asked this question before and even if I had the answers still vary. I know christian theology already I am learning about you as a person not what the bible teaches or what typical christianity is. I am trying to learn makes christianity happen not what it teaches. this is why I do not ask what the bible teaches but rather what you do or how you respond etc. I did not ask "what makes christianity happen" because I don't think you know.

if you think I'm being deceptive then please do not respond so I do not have to respond to you when you are not seriously trying to discuss with me
 
Last edited:
Upvote 0
Status
Not open for further replies.