Samaritans Anticipating the Messiah?

[Jonaitis]

Recently, I was reading the story of the Samaritan woman at the well (John 4), and a thought occurred to me: why were the Samaritans expecting the arrival of a Jewish king (John 4:25)? To wrongly quote Tertullian, "What hath Athens to do with Jerusalem?" Help me understand.

 

[Guojing]

Recently, I was reading the story of the Samaritan woman at the well (John 4), and a thought occurred to me: why were the Samaritans expecting the arrival of a Jewish king (John 4:25)? To wrongly quote Tertullian, "What hath Athens to do with Jerusalem?" Help me understand.

They are probably aware of the timing since Daniel 69th week was already due during the 3 years of Jesus ministry

 

[Jonaitis]

They are probably aware of the timing since Daniel 69th week was already due during the 3 years of Jesus ministry

Daniel's audience was Jewish. Why would a Samaritan care about the restoration of the Davidic monarch? I also don't think their canon contain the prophets, but I could be wrong.

 

[Guojing]

Daniel's audience was Jewish. Why would a Samaritan care about the restoration of the Davidic monarch? I also don't think their "scriptures" contain the prophets, but I could be wrong.

Samaritan were actually half Jews. Did you recall the conversation Jesus had with the Samaritan woman in John?

"25 The woman said, “I know that Messiah” (called Christ) “is coming. When he comes, he will explain everything to us.”"

So, they are aware.

 

[Jonaitis]

Samaritan were actually half Jews. Did you recall the conversation Jesus had with the Samaritan woman in John?

"25 The woman said, “I know that Messiah” (called Christ) “is coming. When he comes, he will explain everything to us.”"

So, they are aware.

Not entirely true. The Samaritans claim that they are direct descendants of the Israelites that lived in Samaria who were not expelled by the Assyrians. This was well understood in the text:

"How is that you, a Jew, ask for a drink from me, a woman of Samaria?" (v. 9).

The term "Jew" relates to the Judean kingdom.

"Our fathers worshiped on this mountain (Mount Gerizim), but you say that in Jerusalem is the place where people out to worship." (v. 20).

From this response, what exactly was their idea of the Messiah?

"You worship what you do not know; we worship what we know, for salvation is from the Jews." (v. 22).

If they knew not what they worship, how do they expect or await what they don't know?

 

[Guojing]

Not entirely true. The Samaritans claim that they are direct descendants of the Israelites that lived in Samaria who were not expelled by the Assyrians. This was well understood in the text:

"How is that you, a Jew, ask for a drink from me, a woman of Samaria?" (v. 9).

The term "Jew" relates to the Judean kingdom.

"Our fathers worshiped on this mountain (Mount Gerizim), but you say that in Jerusalem is the place where people out to worship." (v. 20).

From this response, what exactly was their idea of the Messiah?

"You worship what you do not know; we worship what we know, for salvation is from the Jews." (v. 22).

If they knew not what they worship, how do they expect or await what they don't know?

Your last sentence does not contain mutually exclusive terms.

You can know the Jewish Messiah is coming without wanting to worship him.

 

[Jonaitis]

Your last sentence does not contain mutually exclusive terms.

You can know the Jewish Messiah is coming without wanting to worship him.

If they don't know who they worship, how do they know who the Messiah is?

 

[Philip_B]

The eschatological hope of the Samaritans was built around the Prophet like Moses and the figure identified as the restorer. It is lazy to divide the world into Jews and Gentiles, for the Samaritans were Semites, not Gentiles, and they did not see themselves as Jews either. John Chapter 4 makes a great deal of the Samaritans and the unexpected discourse on deep theology with a woman who did not come to this well with the other women, possibly in some sense an outcast or marginalised person, is profound. The role of the Samaritans in John is very significant, and if you compare the number of references to David, against the number of references to Moses (also The Prophet) is very telling. I wonder if one of the mistakes of our time is to over-emphasize the role of the Davidic line and minimise the role of Moses.

My point is that the eschatological hope of the Samaritans was very different to the eschatological hope of Israel. For the Samaritans, Jesus is the Restorer, just as he is the Messiah for the Jews. The end of this chapter accords the Christological title, Savior of the world - the Greek being soterion ton kosmon. I think translating is as Saviour of the Cosmos would be valid and appropriate. John 4 sets Jesus mission on a much broader canvas.

 

[Jonaitis]

The eschatological hope of the Samaritans was built around the Prophet like Moses and the figure identified as the restorer. It is lazy to divide the world into Jews and Gentiles, for the Samaritans were Semites, not Gentiles, and they did not see themselves as Jews either. John Chapter 4 makes a great deal of the Samaritans and the unexpected discourse on deep theology with a woman who did not come to this well with the other women, possibly in some sense an outcast or marginalised person, is profound. The role of the Samaritans in John is very significant, and if you compare the number of references to David, against the number of references to Moses (also The Prophet) is very telling. I wonder if one of the mistakes of our time is to over-emphasize the role of the Davidic line and minimise the role of Moses.

My point is that the eschatological hope of the Samaritans was very different to the eschatological hope of Israel. For the Samaritans, Jesus is the Restorer, just as he is the Messiah for the Jews. The end of this chapter accords the Christological title, Savior of the world - the Greek being soterion ton kosmon. I think translating is as Saviour of the Cosmos would be valid and appropriate. John 4 sets Jesus mission on a much broader canvas.

I like that interpretation.

I was thinking something similar to what you were saying, but more like, this was a time when talk of a Messiah-like figure became commonplace, and that Jesus' popularity, beginning with John and his baptismal ministry, intensified the anticipation enough that it eventually reached Samaria. The Samaritans, having been subjugated under the same oppressive rule as the Jewry, sought a new found eschatological hope in rumors about Jesus. This event with the woman at the well may have been the first encounter of any Samaritan with Jesus himself, and so he likely was largely unnoticed when he passed through their cities, unlike other places where Jesus travelled, he was immediately recognised. We do not find the woman quoting from their tradition, but states it like a generally accepted fact:

"The woman said to him, 'I know that Messiah is coming. When he comes, he will tell us all things.'" (John 4:25).

This statement leads me to believe that she said this on Jesus' account. She wanted to take advantage of this unique opportunity, after discussing a broad range of personally sensitive subjects, with a religious Jew. He confirms his identity to her:

"I who speak to you am he." (John 4:26).

What happens next?

"So the woman left her water jar and went away into town and said to the people, 'Come, see a man who told me all that I ever did. Can this be the Christ?' They went out of the town and were coming to him." (John 4:28-30).

Did they examine his words like the Pharisees and lawyers? Did they test him like the Sadducees and Herodians? Nope. We do not find a Berean among them. Instead, we read:

"Many Samaritans from that town believed in him because of the woman's testimony." (John 4:39)

It seems that they were like the Athenians, who, "spend their time in nothing except telling or hearing something new" (Acts 17:21).

I believe that their eschatology was on the fly of the times. They sought relief and freedom and clung to the Jewish hope among many others.

 

[dqhall]

"The woman said to him, 'I know that Messiah is coming. When he comes, he will tell us all things.'" (John 4:25).

The Samaritans read the Torah. Deuteronomy is one of the five books of the Torah. In Deuteronomy 18:18 Moses spoke to the assembly:

18 I will raise them up a Prophet from among their brethren, like unto thee, and will put my words in his mouth; and he shall speak unto them all that I shall command him.

19 And it shall come to pass, that whosoever will not hearken unto my words which he shall speak in my name, I will require it of him.

20 But the prophet, which shall presume to speak a word in my name, which I have not commanded him to speak, or that shall speak in the name of other gods, even that prophet shall die.

Messiah means anointed (king). Was the Samaritan woman told by God to expect a prophetic Messiah? How was she the only woman from the village to meet Jesus at the well?

 

[Jonaitis]

The Samaritans read the Torah. Deuteronomy is one of the five books of the Torah. In Deuteronomy 18:18 Moses spoke to the assembly:

18 I will raise them up a Prophet from among their brethren, like unto thee, and will put my words in his mouth; and he shall speak unto them all that I shall command him.

19 And it shall come to pass, that whosoever will not hearken unto my words which he shall speak in my name, I will require it of him.

20 But the prophet, which shall presume to speak a word in my name, which I have not commanded him to speak, or that shall speak in the name of other gods, even that prophet shall die.

Messiah means anointed (king). Was the Samaritan woman told by God to expect a prophetic Messiah? How was she the only woman from the village to meet Jesus at the well?

It is an interesting theory, like what Philip said, and I think that is highly plausible. However, would a Samaritan expect such a prophet to come from the Jews? I've heard that Joseph was seen as the blessed lineage in Samaritan interpretation (Genesis 49:22-26). Perhaps that is what Jesus was addressing when he said, "Salvation is from the Jews," to point out that the prophetic words of Moses were addressing the Judean people.

I find it odd that Samaria would care about the restoration of Jerusalem, not only in the context of Jesus' earthly ministry, but since the dissolution of the United Kingdom of Israel.

 

[Yekcidmij]

Recently, I was reading the story of the Samaritan woman at the well (John 4), and a thought occurred to me: why were the Samaritans expecting the arrival of a Jewish king (John 4:25)? To wrongly quote Tertullian, "What hath Athens to do with Jerusalem?" Help me understand.

Samaritans don't generally believe in a messiah in the ways that Jews do. They believe in the Taheb, which is a "prophet like Moses" based on verses out of Deut 18 and Deut 34. But it's not exactly the same as the Jewish concept of a King coming from Judah. They generally think the Taheb will restore Israel and instruct in the law.

 

[Philip_B]

It is an interesting theory, like what Philip said, and I think that is highly plausible. However, would a Samaritan expect such a prophet to come from the Jews? I've heard that Joseph was seen as the blessed lineage in Samaritan interpretation (Genesis 49:22-26). Perhaps that is what Jesus was addressing when he said, "Salvation is from the Jews," to point out that the prophetic words of Moses were addressing the Judean people.

I find it odd that Samaria would care about the restoration of Jerusalem, not only in the context of Jesus' earthly ministry, but since the dissolution of the United Kingdom of Israel.

The Samaritan expectation was of the Restorer, who would restore all things, and that probably had a lot to do with the Holy Mountain and Jacobs Well, the most probable site for the encounter. I think part of what Jesus is hinting at is the restoration of the divide between Jews and Samaritans.

The prophet like Moses is a theme in John, and I suggest you look at the enquiry of the Baptist in Chapter 1. John is not concerned with the Davidic lineage.

 

[dqhall]

It is an interesting theory, like what Philip said, and I think that is highly plausible. However, would a Samaritan expect such a prophet to come from the Jews? I've heard that Joseph was seen as the blessed lineage in Samaritan interpretation (Genesis 49:22-26). Perhaps that is what Jesus was addressing when he said, "Salvation is from the Jews," to point out that the prophetic words of Moses were addressing the Judean people.

I find it odd that Samaria would care about the restoration of Jerusalem, not only in the context of Jesus' earthly ministry, but since the dissolution of the United Kingdom of Israel.

The Samaritan woman realized she was speaking to a prophet as she had never seen him before and he told her about all the men she had married.

In Acts 8 Philip, Peter and John also went to the Samaritans to preach. A group of Samaritans were hungry for the word of God.

The Greeks also received the word of God as they listened to Paul’s teachings. Paul emphasized Christ more than Moses. Paul did not recommend circumcision of Gentiles except in the case of Timothy.

 

[Guojing]

If they don't know who they worship, how do they know who the Messiah is?

I don't see these 2 things as mutually exclusive.

If you feel they are, please explain.

 

[Jonaitis]

I don't see these 2 things as mutually exclusive.

If you feel they are, please explain.

I don't see how they are mutually exclusive either. My point is the opposite. If they don't know God, then they don't know who they are anticipating. The one implies the other.