Ritual
- Thread starter Gideon4God
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MissytheButterfly
Back and Better than EVER!
Hmmm, I hope Gideon didn't leave because of this off topic stuff..
Gideon did you get a chance to speak with your priest concering this matter ? Sometimes our religious leaders can shed a TREMENDOUS amount of clarity on our faiths.. I would be interest in learning what your priest stated if you got a chance to speak with him.
Missy
Gideon did you get a chance to speak with your priest concering this matter ? Sometimes our religious leaders can shed a TREMENDOUS amount of clarity on our faiths.. I would be interest in learning what your priest stated if you got a chance to speak with him.
Missy
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Gideon, here are some words from H.H. Pope Shenouda in his book "Characteristics of the Spiritual Path", it's not the most appropriate book for the subject, but it's the one I'm reading now:
p 148: "Here we would like to explain the true spiritual meaning of a metanoia or prostration. In the metanoia the person makes a prostration, he bows down and his head touches the ground, that is, the dust. This is the external apparent work. But there is an inner work which should accompany the bowing down of the body. The person should bow down his soul from within in contrition so as to abandon its haughtiness, as David the Prophet said: "My soul clings to the dust" (Ps. 119:25). Someone said to one of the Fathers: "Sometimes I make a metanoia before my brother apologizin gto him but he dos not accept it">
The Father answered: "It is because you did it in haughtiness". This means that the body bowed down whilst the sould remained in its haughtiness and did not reach the dust."
A reminder that the acts can be empty, and that we need to learn to make them full.
You might want to look at the chapter "Learning from Rites and Rituals" in H.H.'s book Dicipleship, available at: http://www.coptnet.com/books/disciple.pdf or http://www.coptnet.com/Pope-Books/disciple/index.htm . Many of his other books are also available from http://www.coptnet.com/Pope.htm
p 148: "Here we would like to explain the true spiritual meaning of a metanoia or prostration. In the metanoia the person makes a prostration, he bows down and his head touches the ground, that is, the dust. This is the external apparent work. But there is an inner work which should accompany the bowing down of the body. The person should bow down his soul from within in contrition so as to abandon its haughtiness, as David the Prophet said: "My soul clings to the dust" (Ps. 119:25). Someone said to one of the Fathers: "Sometimes I make a metanoia before my brother apologizin gto him but he dos not accept it">
The Father answered: "It is because you did it in haughtiness". This means that the body bowed down whilst the sould remained in its haughtiness and did not reach the dust."
A reminder that the acts can be empty, and that we need to learn to make them full.
You might want to look at the chapter "Learning from Rites and Rituals" in H.H.'s book Dicipleship, available at: http://www.coptnet.com/books/disciple.pdf or http://www.coptnet.com/Pope-Books/disciple/index.htm . Many of his other books are also available from http://www.coptnet.com/Pope.htm
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The Body and the Spirit by Pope Shenouda in Characteristics of the Spiritual Path:
He who is faithful in virtues practised by the body is elevated to virtues of the spirit. He who is faithful in controlling the body to abstain from food, God will entrust him with controlling the spirit to abstain from sins. He constrains his toungue to abstain from idle talk, controls his mind to abstain from evil thoughts, and restrains his heart from lust. But he who is not faithful in abstaining from food--and this is a little things which does not need much effort--how then can he reach abstinence of spirit? Thus said one of the saints:
"Through stillness of body we acquire stillness of soul." Stillness of soul is a great thing which we do not reach unless we are faithful in observing stillness of body. This means that the body should not be engaged in wandering from one subject to another, and the senses should be restrained from vain hearing, looking, touching and smelling.
Also through solemnity of body we attain solemnity of soul. And through faithfulness in humility of the body we acquire humility of the soul. He who prays with solemnity fo body; standing in reverence, liftin his eyes, preserving his senses and his motions, kneeling atthe time of kneeling, prostrating at the time fo prostration, if he does all these with fidelity, there is no doubt that God will endow him with solemnity of spirit and solemnity of intellect. He who is faithful in his prostrations God will grand himt o worhsip in Spirit and in trouth. There is no doubt that he who says hte word Agios (Holy) whilst bowing down in faith engenders solemnity in his heart.
Thus we benefit from taking off oru shoes when we enter or worship before the Sanctuary. These are physical gestures but if they are performed with loyalty and in faith they transfer the solemnity fo the body to the spirit, and the spirit will also worship solemnly. This is due to the correlation of the body and the spirit.
Thus if we are faithful in our physical temple, it will become a temple for God. And if we are faithful in the material body of Lord will entrust us with the illuminated spirtual body in the Day of Resurrection (1Cor15:44). If we are faithful in material mattters in general God will entrust us wit the spiritual matters. Let us take prayer as an example...
He who is faithful in virtues practised by the body is elevated to virtues of the spirit. He who is faithful in controlling the body to abstain from food, God will entrust him with controlling the spirit to abstain from sins. He constrains his toungue to abstain from idle talk, controls his mind to abstain from evil thoughts, and restrains his heart from lust. But he who is not faithful in abstaining from food--and this is a little things which does not need much effort--how then can he reach abstinence of spirit? Thus said one of the saints:
"Through stillness of body we acquire stillness of soul." Stillness of soul is a great thing which we do not reach unless we are faithful in observing stillness of body. This means that the body should not be engaged in wandering from one subject to another, and the senses should be restrained from vain hearing, looking, touching and smelling.
Also through solemnity of body we attain solemnity of soul. And through faithfulness in humility of the body we acquire humility of the soul. He who prays with solemnity fo body; standing in reverence, liftin his eyes, preserving his senses and his motions, kneeling atthe time of kneeling, prostrating at the time fo prostration, if he does all these with fidelity, there is no doubt that God will endow him with solemnity of spirit and solemnity of intellect. He who is faithful in his prostrations God will grand himt o worhsip in Spirit and in trouth. There is no doubt that he who says hte word Agios (Holy) whilst bowing down in faith engenders solemnity in his heart.
Thus we benefit from taking off oru shoes when we enter or worship before the Sanctuary. These are physical gestures but if they are performed with loyalty and in faith they transfer the solemnity fo the body to the spirit, and the spirit will also worship solemnly. This is due to the correlation of the body and the spirit.
Thus if we are faithful in our physical temple, it will become a temple for God. And if we are faithful in the material body of Lord will entrust us with the illuminated spirtual body in the Day of Resurrection (1Cor15:44). If we are faithful in material mattters in general God will entrust us wit the spiritual matters. Let us take prayer as an example...
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