Right relationship with God query!

[Christie insb]

Hi , I've just recently read a thread about the right relationship with God and how to achieve it to be genuinely honest I've always had a problem with this whole idea of a 'right' relationship with God and rules of how to go about it to achieve it. We have different personalities as christians in the body of Christ how I worship might not be appropriate for my church but when i go to another church its the best way or how I dress may be considered bad in some denoms and in others how you dress doesn't matter ( but decent of course) of course there are the basics that just come naturally through transformation but why should there be rules on how to have a proper relationship with God maybe how I relate with Him He gets it even though you as a brother or sister won't get it and it draws me closer to God! Aren't this rules basically what's driving many to create new churches and end up confused in christianity because they don't know if God accepts them as they are because the rules of christianity state its not proper to be this way or that way? I just don't get it honestly where this proper relationship comes from why we impose it on each other while God wants us to just be us! And let Him transform us by the renewal of spirit and mind that's how ive always seen it this rules are what's confusing many of us christians young and old in many ways and I don't know maybe someone can explain to me how this whole thing works

I agree with you. Some people thrive on rules, but others of us, not so much. My experience is that I came from a Christian family, but I was abused in that family. Certain denominations emphasize things that are (yes, I will use the word) triggers for me. I end up not seeing God as loving. So anyway. Sometimes just attending a different church whose lingo is a little different has helped me.
Anyway. I have a lot of strong feelings about this subject but they usually do not effect me because I go where I feel comfortable. A pastor in my denomination whose teaching was fine didn't attract me because he was one of those sincere preachers who loudly declares the Gospel. That doesn't mean other people shouldn't go there, and I found a church that fit my personality better where the Gospel is declared in quieter voices.

 

[Missgrundy]

I've always had problems with understanding relationships, and realise that the adjectives we use to describe them can mean different things to different people. With God things get even more complicated, I think. Or maybe not - maybe it's just me thinking so.

There are kinds of relationships - formal (as in legal contracts, employer-employee, etc.), family or 'blood' relationships (father, mother, brother, sister, extended family, etc.), personal relationships (friends...maybe enemies or competitors?).

And there can be the status or standing of the relationship - is it good (or maybe not so good), right (a morally right or wrong relationship), close (or distant, stand off-ish), improving (or deteriorating), and so on?

So....I get confused when people equate 'right' with 'good.' (Even when you ask people how they are and they reply 'I'm good' I react, because I was brought up to think that good is not the same as 'healthy, well, not sick, happy,' or any such thing. Jesus said 'only God is good.') Other people don't seem to mind, don't see any distinction.

All personal relationships ultimately are individual and unique. My relationship with God is mine. MissG, your relationship with God is yours. We can both have good/strong/close and improving relationships with God that are very different from one another.

And yet we constantly find that our individual relationships affect each other. We get the situation where people say "Nobody who is a friend of hers can be a friend of mine!" Even God speaks this way sometimes. Either you serve God or you serve the devil. You can't have it both ways. 'You cannot serve God and mammon (money)' said Jesus.

In my relationship with God through time, I have found that He has shown me some things that are a hindrance to coming closer to him, things I used to think were OK, and which He is showing me aren't. Why didn't He say so earlier? Maybe I wasn't ready or receptive previously, and would have fought back. I think this is in part what the Bible means "He will not break a bruised reed." He knows better than me what I can tolerate. I have to pass grade 1 before I can cope with grade 2, so to speak.

Within groups of Christians I think the biggest lack may be grace. We somehow think everyone else is experiencing the same thing in their relationship with God as we ourselves are. We have 'got the light' so you should have too. We don't seem to understand that we all have individual journeys to travel with God. Yes, there are fundamentals that are common to all in our relationships with Him, but we don't all find them in the same order, or at the same rate. Because of our individual personalities and histories we have different issues to confront, different lessons to unlearn, and perhaps different lessons to focus on at any particular time. So you are OK, MissG, not feeling comfortable every time some group of Christians wants to tell you what is the "right" relationship with God.

Which brings me to my problem, which is my lack of grace towards people who tell me the same thing! I also need to learn grace toward all. And focus on my own relationship with God, through Jesus, rather than look at and judge other people's.

God bless you. Let Him draw you close. Listen to him, trust Him and obey; listen to others and evaluate against what God Himself has taught you. Try to be gracious, even when it's hard. [/QUOTEn
Monna!! You def understood what I was asking n where I was coming from wow!! God bless you so much I'm just smiling to the point of tears God bless you I agree and thank God you got what I meant!

 

[Missgrundy]

I agree with you. Some people thrive on rules, but others of us, not so much. My experience is that I came from a Christian family, but I was abused in that family. Certain denominations emphasize things that are (yes, I will use the word) triggers for me. I end up not seeing God as loving. So anyway. Sometimes just attending a different church whose lingo is a little different has helped me.
Anyway. I have a lot of strong feelings about this subject but they usually do not effect me because I go where I feel comfortable. A pastor in my denomination whose teaching was fine didn't attract me because he was one of those sincere preachers who loudly declares the Gospel. That doesn't mean other people shouldn't go there, and I found a church that fit my personality better where the Gospel is declared in quieter voices.

I completely get what you mean and yes that's basically what I've been trying to do until I felt strongly convicted by how that seems to be pushing beleivers away from church than to church for growth n fellowship

 

[Missgrundy]

In the Lutheran tradition we make several important distinctions, for example the distinction between Law and Gospel; the distinction between what God commands us to do (e.g. don't murder, don't steal, don't worship other gods, love our neighbor as our self, turn the other cheek, etc) which is Law and what God promises and accomplishes by His own kindness and grace, which is Gospel. So when we say the good news is that God so loved the world that He gave His only-begotten Son, and that by Christ's death and resurrection we have been freely justified by God, by His grace, which we receive through faith, we are saying this is what God does for us, it isn't a work, an effort, something we do--it's something God does for us out of the richness of His own kindness. The Law cannot save or justify us, only the Gospel can do this--because only God by His own kindness can rescue lost sinners and reconcile them to Himself, which He does freely for us in, by, and through Christ who died on the cross and rose from the dead as victor over sin, death, hell, and the devil.

Part of this distinction, therefore, is what we describe as the distinction between Coram Deo (us before God) and Coram Hominibus (us before our fellow human beings). Coram Deo, who we are before God, can only be understood through the Gospel--of God's own loving kindness toward us in Jesus. Our relationship with God is not based upon our merits, our works, our efforts, or any contribution or activity on our part; it is purely this fundamental truth: that God, in Jesus, is for us, He loves us, calls us His children, He says we are His and He is ours, and that we have hope and eternal life with Him on account of His great and incomprehensible love toward us. The relationship we have with God is not about us going up to meet God where He is, but about God meeting us where we are--God in His kindness comes down to us, in Jesus Christ, in His death and resurrection, in His Word, in His Sacraments. God meets us here, God comes down to us, we don't go up to Him. And it is right here, where we are, that God loves us, saves us, and makes us His.

So then, why should we seek to live good and God-honoring lives? To impress God? God isn't impressed by our paltry and sinful works, but you know who does need our good works? Our neighbors. So even as God has come down to us, to meet us where we are, He sends us out to be for others, in love, service, and sacrifice. But don't look to your works to know where you are with God, look only to Jesus Christ and His cross, for this and this alone makes you right with God.

-CryptoLutheran

That's a clear explanation thankyou! But shouldn't our relationship with those around us be based on our relationship with God and it flows inside out ? Because where will we draw the line of sincerely loving our neighbour and pretending to because its our duty?

 

[ViaCrucis]

That's a clear explanation thankyou! But shouldn't our relationship with those around us be based on our relationship with God and it flows inside out ? Because where will we draw the line of sincerely loving our neighbour and pretending to because its our duty?

Our actions toward our neighbor ought to be a reflection of the grace and love which God has shown us in Jesus. In the Lord's prayer we pray, "Forgive us our sins, even as we forgive those who have sinned against us." Similar language is used throughout Scripture to direct us to love others even as we have been loved. So yes, God's grace is ours in Jesus, and in Jesus we are called out into the world to love our neighbor. But always remember that it isn't the works you do which makes you right with God, what makes you right with God is what God has done for you in Jesus. It is in light of this, in response to God's grace, that you can in boldness go and love your neighbor, not out of fear, but love. Love for love's sake.

-CryptoLutheran

 

[Missgrundy]

Our actions toward our neighbor ought to be a reflection of the grace and love which God has shown us in Jesus. In the Lord's prayer we pray, "Forgive us our sins, even as we forgive those who have sinned against us." Similar language is used throughout Scripture to direct us to love others even as we have been loved. So yes, God's grace is ours in Jesus, and in Jesus we are called out into the world to love our neighbor. But always remember that it isn't the works you do which makes you right with God, what makes you right with God is what God has done for you in Jesus. It is in light of this, in response to God's grace, that you can in boldness go and love your neighbor, not out of fear, but love. Love for love's sake.

-CryptoLutheran

Now that I completely agree with amen amen!

 

[Missgrundy]

Now that I completely agree with amen amen!

Thankyou and God bless you

 

[Swan7]

@Missgrundy

I know where you're coming from and we really have to be careful what "rules" we are following and by whom. I've heard of many cults form like this and lo and behold people are stuck in torment in the form of "punishments" from these cults. I've heard of many organizations bearing Christ's name but having absolutely no reflection of Him behind those closed doors. It's seriously sad and infuriating.

So I say again, we really have to be careful to who we are listening to and to always test the spirits - not believing everyone by their word alone.
1 John 4:1-6

Now, the Pharisees loved their "rules" over people themselves where Jesus was trying to teach them otherwise. People are much more valuable to Him than we could ever know. We are made in His image, after all - and Jesus Christ died in this fallen image to redeem us. The only thing I have ever seen/read through His Word is that if we love Him, we will do what He has taught us to do.
Matthew 22:37-38
John 14:15-31

Jesus is the Sword that divides truth from lies and faith from unbelief. If you know Him and do what He has taught us, you have a relationship with God. Let no man tell you different, but rather go to God for confirmation.
Romans 3:4

 

[Missgrundy]

@Missgrundy

I know where you're coming from and we really have to be careful what "rules" we are following and by whom. I've heard of many cults form like this and lo and behold people are stuck in torment in the form of "punishments" from these cults. I've heard of many organizations bearing Christ's name but having absolutely no reflection of Him behind those closed doors. It's seriously sad and infuriating.

So I say again, we really have to be careful to who we are listening to and to always test the spirits - not believing everyone by their word alone.
1 John 4:1-6

Now, the Pharisees loved their "rules" over people themselves where Jesus was trying to teach them otherwise. People are much more valuable to Him than we could ever know. We are made in His image, after all - and Jesus Christ died in this fallen image to redeem us. The only thing I have ever seen/read through His Word is that if we love Him, we will do what He has taught us to do.
Matthew 22:37-38
John 14:15-31

Jesus is the Sword that divides truth from lies and faith from unbelief. If you know Him and do what He has taught us, you have a relationship with God. Let no man tell you different, but rather go to God for confirmation.
Romans 3:4

Amen swan that is very trie and i love the scriptures youve auoted in relation to our lives and situations God is our omly confirmation through the power of the holy spirit e

 

[Long Island Pilgrim]

Hi Missgrundy,

I think you raise a very fair question. I suspect that God is working with us each individually based on our unique personal qualities and needs. And he may not lead everyone to the same place in the same timing. I had been a spiritual seeker and a student of comparative religion for several years prior to getting saved. I had invested a lot of time into learning all kinds of spiritual traditions and it was getting me nowhere. I was tired of investing my time and energy in false paths. And, interestingly enough, not long before I actually became born again, I spoke to the man in the sky and said " If you are real...I'm ready for a truly devotional path now. I'm tired of all these dead end false paths".

Be careful what you ask for. lol I specifically asked for a "devotional path" and thats exactly what was revealed to me.

So...I'll just answer from my own experience because I've had five years of of very clear communication and guidance from God since the first moment of my Salvation. I'm in prayer every day and I clearly hear his voice and I know his presence is close. I am not walking in darkness. I have the companionship of the Holy Spirit at all times.

So how did this happen? I ignored what "man" told me and I followed the leading of the Holy Spirit as soon a I got baptized. He led me to John 15:10
"If ye keep my commandments, ye shall abide in my love; even as I have kept my Father's commandments, and abide in his love."

This was not easy to do because a lot of denominations called me names and told me that I was trying to justify myself through my actions. I didn't listen to them. I listened to the Holy Spirit. And because of this my life has been transformed from despair to victory on every level.

And I eventually learned that many , many , many Christians all over the world actually do keep the commandments. But I didn't know that for years because most people just told me how wrong I was and called me names.

I don't keep all the commandments perfectly but when I fail I just ask for forgiveness in prayer and all is well. God doesn't expect perfection.

So thats what has worked for me. Hope that helps.

God Bless.

 

[Missgrundy]

Hi Missgrundy,

I think you raise a very fair question. I suspect that God is working with us each individually based on our unique personal qualities and needs. And he may not lead everyone to the same place in the same timing. I had been a spiritual seeker and a student of comparative religion for several years prior to getting saved. I had invested a lot of time into learning all kinds of spiritual traditions and it was getting me nowhere. I was tired of investing my time and energy in false paths. And, interestingly enough, not long before I actually became born again, I spoke to the man in the sky and said " If you are real...I'm ready for a truly devotional path now. I'm tired of all these dead end false paths".

Be careful what you ask for. lol I specifically asked for a "devotional path" and thats exactly what was revealed to me.

So...I'll just answer from my own experience because I've had five years of of very clear communication and guidance from God since the first moment of my Salvation. I'm in prayer every day and I clearly hear his voice and I know his presence is close. I am not walking in darkness. I have the companionship of the Holy Spirit at all times.

So how did this happen? I ignored what "man" told me and I followed the leading of the Holy Spirit as soon a I got baptized. He led me to John 15:10
"If ye keep my commandments, ye shall abide in my love; even as I have kept my Father's commandments, and abide in his love."

This was not easy to do because a lot of denominations called me names and told me that I was trying to justify myself through my actions. I didn't listen to them. I listened to the Holy Spirit. And because of this my life has been transformed from despair to victory on every level.

And I eventually learned that many , many , many Christians all over the world actually do keep the commandments. But I didn't know that for years because most people just told me how wrong I was and called me names.

I don't keep all the commandments perfectly but when I fail I just ask for forgiveness in prayer and all is well. God doesn't expect perfection.

So thats what has worked for me. Hope that helps.

God Bless.

Thankyou longisland! Thankyou ive read your answer and yes it helps i have been seeking the real life experience answers too very much. I thank God for who He has been in your life and im glad you followed the holyspirit and answered me accordingly. God bless you long island and thankyou! May He trully continue to show us the way

 

[rockytopva]

Smith Wigglesworth was a plumber and he met his future wife Polly while attending the Salvation Army and together they opened a mission and raised a family. They both grew together and had a family. When Smith and Polly both became Spirit filled, it opened the doors to a worldwide ministry. Good story!

 

[rockytopva]

One of the most interesting figures I have read about was in the person of William Seymour, a preacher of African descent and also the architect of the Pentecostal revival. When the Holy Spirit did fall....

"They shouted three days and three nights. It was Easter season. The people came from everywhere. By the next morning there was no way of getting near the house. As people came in they would fall under God's power; and the whole city was stirred. They shouted until the foundation of the house gave way, but no one was hurt."

The Holy Spirit reportedly fell in 1906 at Azusa Street Mission in Los Angeles, CA. Smith Wigglesworth testified of receiving it in 1907. This is a revival that spread very fast around the world!

One of the most interesting outcomes that I have read on the man is that he designed his doctrine in metaphor to King Solomons temple. As this doctrine died with William Seymour this is not something I teach, and I know of no one who teaches this, but present this as 'cold pizza' from an earlier time and something that you may find interesting. I also am interested in your responses as you guys are heavy in what we call the old testament.

1. The Outer Court - Justification - Faith to enter in.
2. The Altar - Salvation through the cross at Calvary.
3. The Laver - The clean effects of sanctification.
4. Table of Showbread – Daily into the word of God
5. Light at the Lightstand - Faith, hope, charity, joy, grace, love, warmth, etc. With sanctification came a sweet spirit!
6. The Golden Incense Alter - Prayer and Praise meetings.
7. The Holy of Holies - The Shekinah Glory and Baptism of the Holy Ghost.

And I also did a video tribute....

 

[corinth77777]

Hi , I've just recently read a thread about the right relationship with God and how to achieve it to be genuinely honest I've always had a problem with this whole idea of a 'right' relationship with God and rules of how to go about it to achieve it. We have different personalities as christians in the body of Christ how I worship might not be appropriate for my church but when i go to another church its the best way or how I dress may be considered bad in some denoms and in others how you dress doesn't matter ( but decent of course) of course there are the basics that just come naturally through transformation but why should there be rules on how to have a proper relationship with God maybe how I relate with Him He gets it even though you as a brother or sister won't get it and it draws me closer to God! Aren't this rules basically what's driving many to create new churches and end up confused in christianity because they don't know if God accepts them as they are because the rules of christianity state its not proper to be this way or that way? I just don't get it honestly where this proper relationship comes from why we impose it on each other while God wants us to just be us! And let Him transform us by the renewal of spirit and mind that's how ive always seen it this rules are what's confusing many of us christians young and old in many ways and I don't know maybe someone can explain to me how this whole thing works

Hello,
Well I have never known any rules.
But I guess if one has been going for a while, and is mentally sound they would know they just can't wear anything. There should be rules in my view for those who are mentally sound. I guess it should be what we call proper etiquette. What one wears to a club, should they wear to church? I believe we all have an answer in mind for that.
However, the truth is like this IF we truly are doing everything to honor God, and with good intentions, then would we wear clothes that could cause others to be unfocused from the sermon if they haven't reached your level. It is either true, that we can cause others to stumble or it is not. And my answer is: it is true. We are not to do anything to cause our brother or sister to stumble. So if wearing clothes that men or women can look all up into and get inappropriate thoughts causes them to stumble and take their mind off God, then should we do it?
It's not just about our growth, but about the other person's.

 

[messianist]

HI missgrundy

Just read through your post again, to answer why so many churches, there are many people out there who twist scripture to suit there needs a bit like pick a mix theology, If there is something they don't like they will twist the scripture to suit them selfs, there are around 147 thousand denominations and they all think they're right, but the Bible refers to church as the body of Christ his people which is something that's not attended, rather people are added to it daily, all those who are in yashua messhia are guided by the holy spirit if we are in error o dont understand something he always makes sure that we know the truth, his word sayIi will never leave you nor forske you, Howbeit when he, the Spirit of truth, is come, he will guide you into all truth: for he shall not speak of himself; but whatsoever he shall hear, that shall he speak: and he will shew you things to come.

You always know what is right and what is not right with God, the amazing thing he works 24 hours a day 7 days a week, where ever you are or whatever time it is he is right there by your side,

Every blessing