Right and Wrong

[shunammite]

I meant to say what I believe the Bible says.

Occupation with "the law", in the literal sense, means a person is operating as a "child"...who is under tutors and governors (Gal 4:1)...or as "wicked", "knowing this, that the law was not made for a righteous man, but for the lawless and disobedient..." I Tim 1:9, and "by the works of the law shall no flesh be justified", Rom 3:20, law keeping or law breaking is neither here nor there when it comes to being rightly related to the Creator, we may hurt each other and ourselves however...it is a guide for "expediency".

"If thou sinnest, what doest thou against him? If thou be righteous, what givest thou him?" Job 35:6-7.

I know people who equate "Christ" with "law-keeping" and I think that is childish at best, and DESPERATELY WICKED at worst.

People may say and think anything they like, but they may not say THAT IS WHAT THE BIBLE SAYS because it DOES NOT.

I Cor 6:12, "all things are lawful unto me, but all things are not expedient."

I Cor 10:23, "all things are lawful for me, but all things are not expedient, all things are lawful for me, but all things edify not."

"Blotting out the handwriting of ordinances that was against us, which was contrary to us, and took it out of the way, nailing it to his cross." Col 4:14.

Let no man therefore judge you, Col 4:16, the "praise of men"...or the "fear of men" is a DISQUALIFICATION for being a real "jew", Rom 2:29.

Occupation with "the law" is BONDAGE, represented by 'Agar and her "son", Gal 4:23-31, it doesn't matter how you define it, if you think there is SOMETHING that can separate you from God, that is where your focus is, on avoiding this "unforgiveable sin"..and you walk in fear not faith. And remain crippled spiritually, self-focused, defensive, weak, not looking outward.

He that feareth is not made perfect in love.

The "law" is part of the "powers that be" that are a "terror to wicked works", Rom 13, 1-3..."Caesar"...they keep us alive until we grow up...but it's shameful to be in kindergarten when you are mature.

To see no difference between Christ and Caesar.

 

[admtaylor]

Good is real ale, Evil is cheap lager Exports.

Here here!

lol

 

[Diatrive]

thanks to the 3 or 4 of you believers who gave meaningful answers and no thanks to the majority who gave the stereotypical responses of adamant non-believers. i thought the way the questions were phrased established the fact that i do believe in all those things. i thought this would have been ample evidence that i wasn't looking for a response from a frank, pessimistic atheistic point of view. about what shunammite said though...

AHHh hem I quote
"A new forum for the discussion and debate of general philosophy, epistemology & morality open to all members."

 

[Mephster]

For "good" to exist their must be "evil". Without the yin there is no yang. There is simply existence which is neither good nor evil, it simply exists. However to an outside observer with knowledge of good and evil they could recognize it as one or the other, but to the individual who knows only good there is simply existence.

Hmmm......

Ontologically-----
Aristotlelian: To exist is good. (i.e."being" controvertable with "good") Thus, something like, if it exists it is good. Is this what you are getting at with the last part of your paragraph?

Neo-platonism (Proclus, Plotinus) pretty much defined the One as Good and Being... and made evil "non-being"... (though the concept of evil was often identified somewhere between prime matter and matter). But in this schema, evil isn't really a counterpart in equity to the One. Its more a byproduct, and indeed, "desires" to achieve the One.

Hypothetically, for now-----
Why can't there be levels of "good"? Degrees of good that, somehow, never decrease into "evil"? And I am still not convinced that good and evil are in such direct opposition that they are necessarily co-existent. I guess, it seems so from a common sense, prima facie, sort of viewpoint, but is that all there is to it?

 

[Asimov]

Why can't there be levels of "good"? Degrees of good that, somehow, never decrease into "evil"? And I am still not convinced that good and evil are in such direct opposition that they are necessarily co-existent. I guess, it seems so from a common sense, prima facie, sort of viewpoint, but is that all there is to it?

I've heard of that before. What belief is that?

 

[Jet Black]

thanks to the 3 or 4 of you believers who gave meaningful answers and no thanks to the majority who gave the stereotypical responses of adamant non-believers. i thought the way the questions were phrased established the fact that i do believe in all those things.

If you only want a biblical point of view, then I strongly suggest that you stay in the christian only area.

 

[vajradhara]

isn't the belief that ''anything' that can be deadly to the flesh is wrong' somewhat of a slippery slope? i mean, skydiving is dangerous... does that mean it's wrong? i don't know if this is exactly what you meant to say; i was just wondering if it gets any more specific than that. thank you for one of the few thoughtful responses

Namaste chip,

there were plenty of thoughtful responses... apparently they were not the type of thoughtful response you were looking for...

i'd concur with JetBlack on this one... if you're only interested in a Christion POV, you would be happier in the Christian only forums.

 

[Riemann]

One thing is for sure. The Bible is flawed in many ways. Yes, it is a great piece of work but it is NOT perfect and it is open to wide interpretation about good and bad.

Example from Genesis:

The bible tells us that Man was innocent until he disobeyed God and ate of the fruit of The Tree Of Knowledge Of Good and Evil. Yet if he was innocent he could not know right from wrong. So how could God hold him accountable for his actions? It would seem that the only knowledge that Man gained from the tree was the concept of nakedness, he would have known right and wrong from the get-go. Is Good vs. Evil equivalent to Right and Wrong.

You need to look to logic and common sense for these answers. Not christian philosophy.

 

[jonah]

Sorry Riemann, completely disagree with your hermaneutics on Genesis.
The traditional view is Eve was decieved, but Adam knew better.
First the serpent posed a question to Eve that was a lie. God said not to eat, but he did not say it couldn't be touched. Ch 3:2
Adam had made the decision to go with his wife on this one (vs 17)and disobey Gods' directive. When confronted Adam blamed his wife....but God directly came and questioned Adam first...which is where the responsibility lay.

Yes, the Bible is inspired (God breathed) and no, it is not open to debate about what is good or bad. You either believe the first verse of the Bible, to the last verse of the Bible....or what would be the point of believing any of it at all??? from a hermaneutical pov it is consistant, reliable.

Evil is not the equivilant of right and wrong. Wrong is the absence of God's holiness, disobedience to His directives (scripture)....speaking from a Judeo-christian point of view.

And there you have it folks as it is time to go to bed. (icon for sleeping is not on my options for some reason.)

 

[chipdouglas]

about the answers i didn't want...

i had no idea there was a christian only area. if i had known i probably wouldn't have posted here. the main idea though was that i initially stated my belief in the principles of christianity and/or judaism. SO... i was hoping that would be evidence enough to what kind of religious perspective i was looking for. sorry if it was taken the wrong way or to be offensive. it wasn't...