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Rick Santorum is NOT a Conservative

Lion Hearted Man

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"Thou shalt have no other gods before me."

Okay, so what happens to all of us who do not believe in the Hebrew God?

Also, no work on Sundays? No coveting? Might as well destroy the economy as we know it.

And no adultery? While I don't think people should cheat, do you seriously think the government should punish it?
 
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Anovah

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That should be his new campaign slogan. "Santorum, he's all we've got"
 
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NightHawkeye

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So...forgot that doing yard work on Saturday was punishable by death huh:

tulc(knows most people do)
Perhaps tulc doesn't understand Christianity nearly so well as he thinks he does.

Old covenant --> Judaic law

The Israelis don't even adhere to strict Judaic law, though some sects of Judaism are more strict than others.

New covenant --> tolerance, forgiveness, love and commandments as the path to God's kingdom ... in other words, an individual calling


Given that Christianity is all about the new covenant, I fail to see how all the flaming rhetoric about Santorum's religiosity is anything other than sheer hyperbole ... which is to say, completely without merit.
 
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Lion Hearted Man

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New covenant =/= 10 Commandments

10 Commandments = part of the Old covenant
 
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tulc

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Uhmmm...you said the Mosaic Law was pretty much like today's law (except for adultery) I was pointing out if we just lived by the 10 Commandments one of those Commandments was to keep the Sabbath and if you keep the Sabbath, that's part of the Sabbath Laws. That most of us don't remember that doesn't make it go away.
tulc(thinks someone who called President Obama an advocate of "totalitarian government" has little room to accuse others of indulging in "flaming rhetoric")
 
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Wolseley

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Santorum is a theocratic ultra social conservative. A very dangerous person. But apparently a lot of people here like the idea of the United States looking more like Iran under Ahmadinejad's rule.

Not as many as those here who want the United States to look like the Soviet Union under Stalin's rule....
 
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NightHawkeye

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"Thou shalt have no other gods before me."

Okay, so what happens to all of us who do not believe in the Hebrew God?
To be honest ... it's not really my concern. It's a voluntary call. Seriously. I don't have an obligation to force you to convert ... or to punish you for not converting. Even Mormon missionaries go away if you tell them to.

That restriction is even codified in the constitution. I do appreciate your concern though, being as so much of the constitution has been trashed recently.

I'll offer my own personal perspective ... as exemplified in the book of Micah.
Micah 4:1-13 But in the last days it shall come to pass, that the mountain of the house of the LORD shall be established in the top of the mountains, and it shall be exalted above the hills; and people shall flow unto it.

And many nations shall come, and say, Come, and let us go up to the mountain of the LORD, and to the house of the God of Jacob; and he will teach us of his ways, and we will walk in his paths: for the law shall go forth of Zion, and the word of the LORD from Jerusalem.

And he shall judge among many people, and rebuke strong nations afar off; and they shall beat their swords into plowshares, and their spears into pruninghooks: nation shall not lift up a sword against nation, neither shall they learn war any more.

But they shall sit every man under his vine and under his fig tree; and none shall make them afraid: for the mouth of the LORD of hosts hath spoken it.

For all people will walk every one in the name of his god, and we will walk in the name of the LORD our God for ever and ever.

In that day, saith the LORD, will I assemble her that halteth, and I will gather her that is driven out, and her that I have afflicted;

And I will make her that halted a remnant, and her that was cast far off a strong nation: and the LORD shall reign over them in mount Zion from henceforth, even for ever.

And thou, O tower of the flock, the strong hold of the daughter of Zion, unto thee shall it come, even the first dominion; the kingdom shall come to the daughter of Jerusalem.

Now why dost thou cry out aloud? is there no king in thee? is thy counsellor perished? for pangs have taken thee as a woman in travail.

Be in pain, and labour to bring forth, O daughter of Zion, like a woman in travail: for now shalt thou go forth out of the city, and thou shalt dwell in the field, and thou shalt go even to Babylon; there shalt thou be delivered; there the LORD shall redeem thee from the hand of thine enemies.

Now also many nations are gathered against thee, that say, Let her be defiled, and let our eye look upon Zion.

But they know not the thoughts of the LORD, neither understand they his counsel: for he shall gather them as the sheaves into the floor.

Arise and thresh, O daughter of Zion: for I will make thine horn iron, and I will make thy hoofs brass: and thou shalt beat in pieces many people: and I will consecrate their gain unto the LORD, and their substance unto the Lord of the whole earth.
The verse above talks about all men living in peace ... each looking to his own god. Though the book of Micah was written about 700 BC, it was Micah who, in the very next book, prophesied the coming of a messiah from Bethlehem. Don't read Micah 5 though ... you might not like it.



Also, no work on Sundays? No coveting? Might as well destroy the economy as we know it.
Meh ... there's always something to complain about.

As for coveting ... consider that in the old testament multiple wives were not unheard of. Just sayin'

And no adultery? While I don't think people should cheat, do you seriously think the government should punish it?
Think I already covered that ad nauseum ... Jesus didn't punish adultery.
 
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Lion Hearted Man

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So what I'm getting out of this is that the only commandments that ought to be punished (as in, made into law) are thou shall not steal and thou shall not murder. This renders the Ten Commandments utterly pointless.
 
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NightHawkeye

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New covenant =/= 10 Commandments
Not entirely correct ... consider the last chapter in the last book of the Bible.
Rev 22:12-17 And, behold, I come quickly; and my reward is with me, to give every man according as his work shall be.
I am Alpha and Omega, the beginning and the end, the first and the last.
Blessed are they that do his commandments, that they may have right to the tree of life, and may enter in through the gates into the city.
For without are dogs, and sorcerers, and whoremongers, and murderers, and idolaters, and whosoever loveth and maketh a lie.
I Jesus have sent mine angel to testify unto you these things in the churches. I am the root and the offspring of David, and the bright and morning star.
And the Spirit and the bride say, Come. And let him that heareth say, Come. And let him that is athirst come. And whosoever will, let him take the water of life freely.
10 Commandments = part of the Old covenant
Being in the old testament does not mean they are excluded from the new covenant.
 
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Jase

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You are completely goalpost shifting. You were talking about the 10 Commandments. The 10 Commandments are the pinnacle of Jewish law, from which all other 603 Commandments fall under. The death penalty was given for several of the 10 commandments. The most obvious being the 4th Commandment, which everyone except Orthodox Jews breaks.

So if our laws were based on the 10 commandments, everyone would have to be executed. Christianity doesn't follow the 10 commandments, but that's not what you claimed.
 
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Jase

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Good thing we don't live under the Law, eh? Good thing Jesus didn't pick up a stone and nail the adulterous woman with it, eh? That play is really weak and old.

Did you too ignore the fact that Nighthawk said worst case scenario is we become bound by the 10 commandments?

Here it is:

Let's explore that worst-case possibility then:

A. Santorum --> Ten commandments

B. Ahmadinejad --> Sharia law

The 10 Commandments are Jewish law. And under Jewish law, breaking some of those commandments was a capital offense.

And Jesus didn't abolish the law.
 
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Jase

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Depends on what part of Christianity you're referring to. I consider Fundamentalism very much like Islam.
 
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Jase

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It's actually no work on Saturday (Friday sundown to Saturday sundown). Sunday never has, nor ever will be the Sabbath.

But let us not forget honoring thy mother and father. Cursing one's parents was a capital offense under Jewish law. Or how about idolatry? That's a big one. Lots of Christians are in trouble with that one, since the Bible itself has become an idol among many Conservative divisions.
 
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Jase

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Funny how most Christians don't follow the new covenant. They just throw Leviticus at gay people all day instead.
 
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Lion Hearted Man

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I would argue that Jesus never came to abolish any of the original Jewish laws. Matthew 5:18, after all.

It's actually no work on Saturday (Friday sundown to Saturday sundown). Sunday never has, nor ever will be the Sabbath.

Thanks for the correction on Saturday being the Sabbath
 
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Desk trauma

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In response to all the John 8 references, please look at the note in the margin of your bible. The story of the woman caught in adultery is not in the oldest documents, it is a later addition Jeus did not say that.
 
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