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Rich-man and Lazarus True story or Parable

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LittleLambofJesus

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LittleLambofJesus

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squint

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Jesus gave us the exact pattern and methodology to understand 'all parables' and the vital components, which are to be found in 'every parable' and in every 'allegory' and in every term deployed such as 'like' and 'as' where the terms are linked to other physical items.

It is quite simple. But if one has missing components the understandings are not sound or solid.

So, let's take a look:

Jesus said that The Word is in fact 'a parable.' Certainly not discounting the 'reality' of any statement in the scriptures, but the Word itself in relaying all of these matters are in fact parables also. Paul identifies this matter as well in Galatians 4 for example when he states that the 'Law' and the lives of Abraham, Hagar, Sarah, Ishmael and Isaac are in fact ALLEGORIES (or parables, take your pick.)

So yes, The Word from Jesus' Own Mouth is A PARABLE:

Luke 8:11
Now the parable is this: The seed is the word of God.


This fact is also 'confirmed' in the Old Testament:

Psalm 78:
1 Give ear, O my people, to my law: incline your ears to the words of my mouth.
2 I will open my mouth in a parable: I will utter dark sayings of old:

Got it so far? Good!

Now let's look again to the Words of Jesus who gave an exact understanding of 'all parables.' It's quite simple really. Set right here before our eyes. Yet many can not see the facts of the matters, which is in itself identified as to 'why' in the parables:

Mark 4:
13 And he said unto them, Know ye not this parable? and how then will ye know all parables?

Jesus then lays flat out before us the 'components' of 'all parables,' again from Mark 4:

15 And these are they by the way side, where the word is sown; but when they have heard, Satan cometh immediately, and taketh away the word that was sown in their hearts.

The components of 'all parables' are quite easily laid out, right there, from Jesus' Own Mouth.

-The Word of God
-Satan
-Mankind

These are thee components. Any dissection of parables that do 'not' contain these components are in fact void of understandings.

Now, we can go back to Jesus' statement in Mark 4 to the 'unlearned' and 'untrained' who were not his 'disciples' and hear how this same statement was stated to the 'non-disciples' and see another form of conveyance for the SATAN component:

3 Hearken; Behold, there went out a sower to sow:
4 And it came to pass, as he sowed, some fell by the way side, and the fowls of the air came and devoured it up.

We can easily see, IF we are allowed to, only 'disciples' can see, that Satan entering the heart to 'steal Word' from same was depicted to the untrained as 'fowls of the air' devouring the Word Seed.
Simple. But for non-disciples they can not and will not either hear or understand.

Why?

The disciple 'knows' why because we 'see' the vital component to 'all parables' is Satan's thievery.

A blinded stolen from person can not see this. Nor will they find true truthful dissections of any parables or allegories. They will flop around in the dark room of guessing and fanciful imaginations, not even knowing the 'basic constructs' of ALL PARABLES that are laid out IN PLAIN AND OPEN SIGHT...yet hidden from the BLINDED.

So, for Winslows posted dissection, does that dissection contain SATAN anywhere?

No.

Does lamb's? Nope. Sorry lamb. No offense intended to either of you, BUT the components have to be there and ordered as Jesus stated in order to be accurate and to find understandings.

enjoy!

squint




 
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LittleLambofJesus

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So, for Winslows posted dissection, does that dissection contain SATAN anywhere?

No.

Does lamb's? Nope. Sorry lamb. No offense intended to either of you, BUT the components have to be there and ordered as Jesus stated in order to be accurate and to find understandings.

enjoy!

squint
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drjean

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Whoa! Calling Jesus Christ a parable is beyond heretical!
thud.gif

Christ is The Word.

Anytime it was for sure a parable, there was no exact name given.
Sometimes there are real stories that don't use real names.
All stories given using any real name is not a parable.

Just because He does speak in parables does not mean He always speaks in parables.

Psalm 78 describes the relationship between God and Israel.

Israel never got the true picture. Because they were walking by sight, and not by faith, they were so impressed with what they saw that they limited God's ability to create His heart and mind in them (verse 41).
 
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squint

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Whoa! Calling Jesus Christ a parable is beyond heretical!
thud.gif

Christ is The Word.

Anytime it was for sure a parable, there was no exact name given.
Sometimes there are real stories that don't use real names.
All stories given using any real name is not a parable.

Just because He does speak in parables does not mean He always speaks in parables.

Psalm 78 describes the relationship between God and Israel.

Israel never got the true picture. Because they were walking by sight, and not by faith, they were so impressed with what they saw that they limited God's ability to create His heart and mind in them (verse 41).

A parable still means 'it's a FACT.


s
 
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squint

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To some the term 'parable' means 'fairy tale.'

In Hebrew it's this:

Transliteration:
mashal {maw-shawl'}


Word Origin:
apparently from 4910 in some original sense of superiority in mental action

4910- TO RULE

Nope, no fairy tale parables. Divine Hard hitting facts baby!

s
 
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WarriorAngel

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Rich-man and Lazarus True story or Parable

Back to the OP...

Jesus changed the names of the parties or did not name them at all because He knew He was going to see a whole of this going on.
AND more than likely it has gone on.

Since we cannot see the next life as of yet - we can only ascertain that Judgment [His job] would see a lot of these occurrences and so He spoke it as it is/going to be.

Names dont matter - but Jesus wouldnt make the scenerio up since it is part of His job description.
 
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LittleLambofJesus

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Whoa! Calling Jesus Christ a parable is beyond heretical!
thud.gif

Christ is The Word.

Anytime it was for sure a parable, there was no exact name given.
Sometimes there are real stories that don't use real names.
All stories given using any real name is not a parable.

Just because He does speak in parables does not mean He always speaks in parables.

Psalm 78 describes the relationship between God and Israel.


Israel never got the true picture. Because they were walking by sight, and not by faith, they were so impressed with what they saw that they limited God's ability to create His heart and mind in them (verse 41).
Psalms 78:2 (King James Version) :: Forerunner Commentary :: Bible Tools
Good post!

Matt 8:10 When Jesus heard [it,] He marveled, and said to those who followed, "Assuredly, I say to you, I have not found such great faith, not even in Israel!
11 "And I say to you that many will come from east and west, and sit down with Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob in the kingdom of heaven.
12 "But the sons of the kingdom will be cast out into outer darkness. There will be weeping and gnashing of teeth."

2 Corin 5:7 For we walk by faith, not by sight.
 
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dollarsbill

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Jesus CLEARLY warned us of the eternal fire more than once.

Matthew 18:8-9 (NASB)
8 "If your hand or your foot causes you to stumble, cut it off and throw it from you; it is better for you to enter life crippled or lame, than to have two hands or two feet and be cast into the eternal fire. 9 "If your eye causes you to stumble, pluck it out and throw it from you. It is better for you to enter life with one eye, than to have two eyes and be cast into the fiery hell.

Luke 16 gives HIGHLY detailed description of Jesus' warning. It is clearly LITERAL using 3 well known Biblical men of God.

Rev. confirms this place of torment and tells us it is FOREVER.

Revelation 20:10 (NASB)
10 And the devil who deceived them was thrown into the lake of fire and brimstone, where the beast and the false prophet are also; and they will be tormented day and night forever and ever.

We can't say we weren't warned.
 
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Lion King

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Jesus CLEARLY warned us of the eternal fire more than once.

Matthew 18:8-9 (NASB)
8 "If your hand or your foot causes you to stumble, cut it off and throw it from you; it is better for you to enter life crippled or lame, than to have two hands or two feet and be cast into the eternal fire. 9 "If your eye causes you to stumble, pluck it out and throw it from you. It is better for you to enter life with one eye, than to have two eyes and be cast into the fiery hell.

Luke 16 gives HIGHLY detailed description of Jesus' warning. It is clearly LITERAL using 3 well known Biblical men of God.

Rev. confirms this place of torment and tells us it is FOREVER.

Revelation 20:10 (NASB)
10 And the devil who deceived them was thrown into the lake of fire and brimstone, where the beast and the false prophet are also; and they will be tormented day and night forever and ever.

We can't say we weren't warned.

When will this pass?
 
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brinny

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Originally Posted by drjean
Whoa! Calling Jesus Christ a parable is beyond heretical!
Christ is The Word.

Anytime it was for sure a parable, there was no exact name given.
Sometimes there are real stories that don't use real names.
All stories given using any real name is not a parable.

Just because He does speak in parables does not mean He always speaks in parables.

Psalm 78 describes the relationship between God and Israel.


Israel never got the true picture. Because they were walking by sight, and not by faith, they were so impressed with what they saw that they limited God's ability to create His heart and mind in them (verse 41).
Psalms 78:2 (King James Version) :: Forerunner Commentary :: Bible Tools

Good post!

Matt 8:10 When Jesus heard [it,] He marveled, and said to those who followed, "Assuredly, I say to you, I have not found such great faith, not even in Israel!
11 "And I say to you that many will come from east and west, and sit down with Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob in the kingdom of heaven.
12 "But the sons of the kingdom will be cast out into outer darkness. There will be weeping and gnashing of teeth."

2 Corin 5:7 For we walk by faith, not by sight.

I agree.
 
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LittleLambofJesus

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Jesus CLEARLY warned us of the eternal fire more than once.

Matthew 18:8-9 (NASB)
8 "If your hand or your foot causes you to stumble, cut it off and throw it from you; it is better for you to enter life crippled or lame, than to have two hands or two feet and be cast into the eternal fire. 9 "If your eye causes you to stumble, pluck it out and throw it from you. It is better for you to enter life with one eye, than to have two eyes and be cast into the fiery hell.

Luke 16 gives HIGHLY detailed description of Jesus' warning. It is clearly LITERAL using 3 well known Biblical men of God.

Rev. confirms this place of torment and tells us it is FOREVER.

Revelation 20:10 (NASB)
10 And the devil who deceived them was thrown into the lake of fire and brimstone, where the beast and the false prophet are also; and they will be tormented day and night forever and ever.

We can't say we weren't warned.
When will this pass?
When the last plague is poured out on apostate Israel/Jerusalem and their Temple, as was done in AD70? :confused:

Revelation 16:17 And the seventh messenger did pour out his vial to the air, and there came forth a great voice from the sanctuary of the heaven, from the throne, saying, `It hath come to pass!/gegonen <1096> (5754)'

Revelation 21:6 And He said to me, "It hath come to pass! /gegonen <1096> (5754)
I am the Alpha and the Omega, the Beginning and the End. I will give of the fountain of the water of life freely to him who thirsts.

....
 
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LittleLambofJesus

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Whoa! this is quite a study.....we gotta pay heed when Jesus Himself emphasizes something, brothers and sisters, amen?
:)
AMEN!
What would you or others say is the greatest emphasis from Jesus concerning the parable? :groupray:

......
 
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LittleLambofJesus

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What "parable"?
A lot of commentators view it as a "parable"
Here are a few examples below.

Lazarus and the Rich Man - Here a little, there a little - Commentary

The parable of Lazarus and the rich man has been the foundation for many of the erroneous beliefs about "hell" within traditional Christianity. Some have viewed it not as a parable, but as a true story Yeshua told to give details about the punishment of sinners in hell. Yet a thorough, unbiased examination of this story will show that the generally accepted interpretations of this passage of Scripture are erroneous and misleading. In this article, we will go through the parable verse by verse to determine what the Messiah was truly teaching.
Those who insist that this is not a parable but a true, literal story Yeshua told to describe the condition of the lost in hell must overlook several facts to arrive at that conclusion. First, Yeshua the Messiah never accuses the rich man of any sin. He is simply portrayed as a wealthy man who lived the good life. Furthermore, Lazarus is never proclaimed to be a righteous man. He is just one who had the misfortune to be poor and unable to care for himself. If this story is literal, then the logical implication is that all the rich are destined to burn in hell, while all the homeless and destitute will be saved. Does anyone believe this to be the case?

Kindgdom Bible Studies Template Page

....................Then why was the singular used - "this parable"? It should be clear to any thinking mind that all these stories were ONE PARABLE, like the facets of a diamond, as they turn each scintillates with new brilliance. Each was illustrating a view point of one great truth, and together they compose a whole.

And this parabolic discourse of Jesus is continued into chapter sixteen of Luke, including the story of the rich man and Lazarus. The truth is that all five stories are each a fractional part of the complete parable, and when we read, "He spoke this parable unto them," this embraces the entire collection of symbol-pictures which in their completeness constituted the parable which He spoke. It is a careless assumption and an unfounded assertion to argue that the story of the rich man and Lazarus is not a parable! ..........

Commentary - The Parable of Lazarus and the Rich Man
&#12288;
Usually, when the story of the rich man and Lazarus is considered, its setting is ignored. At the time the story was told Jesus had just eaten dinner with a Pharisee, at which time He not only healed a man with dropsy, but gave some pointed advice about how to give a dinner party. When He left the house, great throngs followed Him. Many of this great company were publicans and sinners who drew near to hear His teaching, and mingled with them were a great number of the scribes and Pharisees. The scribes and Pharisees complained openly and bitterly against Jesus, condemning Him because He received sinners into His company and ate with them. Against this background of biting criticism Jesus stood and gave the teachings found in chapters fifteen and sixteen of Luke.
There are five stories which follow consecutively. It is well known, of course, that chapters and verses were not in the original scriptures. We are at liberty to change them when they do not synchronize with other scripture. Any arrangement of chapter and verse division that clarifies or harmonizes other scripture, is more authoritative than that division that beclouds other statements of the Bible. At the beginning of Jesus' discourse in chapter fifteen of Luke the statement is made that "He spoke this parable unto them, saying," (Lk. 15:3).
The Greek is very definite in making the word for parable clearly a singular noun. It is "the parable this.."
...............
 
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squint

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Parables are most fun. And they result in many difficulties.

With the account of Lazarus, there are 'ways' to see that neither Lazarus or the 'rich man' actually DIED a physical death.

We know for example that in baptism, believers are baptized into partaking of The Lords death and we DIE to sin.

Lazarus, AS WE, are carried to Abraham's bosom, OUR FATHER OF FAITH. Abraham even speaking to us this day in his words and actions with God.

The words of Abraham speaking in the New Testament are the speakings of Abraham from the Old Testament, hard as they may be to perceive in the ways they are spoken in the parable and to find those same actions and intentions in Abraham's Old Testament life, they are in fact there to be seen. Even the blood of Abel speaks from the ground to this day. So does that of Abraham.

They were not 'new' understandings from Abraham in the New Testament Gospels. They were already there AND REVEALED by Grace and Truth, our Living Lord and Savior.

If a man bows to His Words and Spirit, they will be shown many matters.

The identity of the rich man is much more problematic. Those who have not bowed to Jesus' Words on matters of parable understandings WILL NOT understand, ever. And such will flail about trying to figure them out.

And they will all land in the exact same place with the exact same missing component, every last one of them.

Justifications to themselves
and condemnation to some other flesh man. That is the pattern shown by Jesus to see who sees and who does not see. Those who see that way do not actually see AT ALL.

Every parable is to be personally applied on every count of the parable.

In this particular parable, a believer, as a reality, whether they themselves see it or not, are in fact divided themselves from that 'rich man.' Even if they don't happen to see the reality of it. And that's OK. Jesus' Words are ROCK SOLID and no man can change them, neither are they meant to harm you as a believer. But they do apply personally to each of us, every single parable on every single count.

Those who go into automatic insulation mode from all the dire things do not, can not and will not have accurate understandings of ANY parable.

They will all insulate themselves. They will read 'this is how I am justified' and 'this is how it applies to SOME OTHER GUY.'

Think about this fact when you yourself read any parable. Do you not have that identical intent and direction? 'This is how I as a believer am justified' and 'this is how the other people' are condemned.

In this way, Jesus has already read your mind before you ever picked up the parable and PREDICTED and SHOWED in advance how you will read and what pattern you will follow in understandings.

If you read nearly any dissection of parables they are ALL THE SAME in this particular pattern. But to those who see parables, this pattern is actually already predicted in how such will read them. It's quite funny, once seen. In the parable itself, the parable says that is the exact direction they will go and even states so in advance.

Anywhere you read a parable dissection and that is where it lands, it is instant identification that the dissection really doesn't have a CLUE.

And there is always always always A HUGE MACK TRUCK that can be driven through the void in understandings.

There is always a MISSING COMPONENT in every one of these dissections down to the last one. It is a major missing piece.


And this too is a missing piece that Jesus shows WILL be missing, in advance even again. It is the same missing piece in every dissection.

Anytime I read a parable, and the components are not there as Jesus has given them, it is instantly recognizable as FALSE.

If anyone wants understandings of parables, go to Mark 4:15, the parable Jesus Himself says is thee parable to understand ALL parables.

And eat those Words personally as they assuredly apply to every one of us.

And the same thing will happen again and again in your own mind, predicted by Jesus in advance no less.

A voice will arrive in your own head right on cue that says 'this does not happen to me, I am a believer, I am justified.'

When you deny that voice in your head, and BELIEVE that what Jesus said IS TRUE for YOU and the voice in your own head NOT TRUE, you yourself will have The Holy Spirit come and TEACH YOU directly about every parable. And you will know the meaning of every parable in intimacy and accuracy.

They are in fact DIVINE and WONDERFUL and totally in your behalf anyway, even if you can not see them. To many they will not be given understandings.

Jesus will seem to bring you a personal offense, if taken personally in the parable and in every parable, and that is why you deny the parts on the other side of the ledger and also will deny that side of the ledger to yourself.

Passing by the surface offense, and accepting the Truth of the matter personally FROM JESUS WORDS, you will ALL see much better. To whom it is given from Above that is. That part is not my call, but His.

Luke 7:23
And blessed is he, whosoever shall not be offended in me.

enjoy!

s
 
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