Revisionist Theology

[Akita Suggagaki]

REVISIONIST THEOLOGY​

"In the broadest sense, "revisionist theology" refers to such recent theological movements as process theism and various forms of political and liberation theology (i.e., feminist, black and Third World as well as the work of other individual theologians. What is characteristic of and common to such diverse forms of theological reflection is their attempt to reformulate from various critical perspectives the meaning and truth-claims of the Christian tradition's central theological and Christological affirmations."

Revisionist Theology | Encyclopedia.com

REVISIONIST THEOLOGY In the broadest sense, "revisionist theology" refers to such recent theological movements as process theism and various forms of political and liberation theology (i.e., feminist, black and Third World as well as the work of other individual theologians. Source for...

www.encyclopedia.com

I have been very interested in David Tracy lately.
"For Tracy, a revisionist fundamental Christian theology is best described as philosophical reflection on the meanings present in common human experience and those present in the Christian tradition. The broad and the narrow senses of the term are not unrelated. Revisionist theology as a formal model of theological method is characterized by a specific understanding of the web of commitments which define the standpoint of the individual theologian's approach to the Christian faith. "

Anyone care to discuss?

 

[Vambram]

This is an interesting topic. I don't want to dig deeply into the weeds of it right now. But, what are some of the changes and/or differences that revisionist theology make and/or have with traditional theology?

 

[Akita Suggagaki]

This is an interesting topic. I don't want to dig deeply into the weeds of it right now. But, what are some of the changes and/or differences that revisionist theology make and/or have with traditional theology?

I can understand your hesitance to enter the weeds right now. They can get quite deep. I am not sure I can even identify some of the changes and/or differences. But you give me a good goal. What good does it do to read all this stuff if I cannot identify and summarize?

The recent history of theology goes from orthodox ( as we all know and love since the council creeds) to liberal ( assimilating insights from the enlightenment and modern scripture scholarship) to neo-orthodox ( Hey, "liberal" is not all it is cracked up to be. Lets go back to orthodox with more careful interpretation), to radical (Liberation theology).

"Revisionist theology seeks to carry on the tradition of Schleiermacher and liberal theology, with its nineteenth century optimism appropriately chastened by the insights of neo-orthodoxy , indeed by the whole grim history of the twentieth century . Revisionist theology (both theological language and Scripture symbolically convey a religious dimension of experience or a possibility for human existence). "

Project MUSE - Revisionist and Postliberal Theologies and the Public Character of Theology

muse.jhu.edu

 

[Offline4Better.]

REVISIONIST THEOLOGY​

"In the broadest sense, "revisionist theology" refers to such recent theological movements as process theism and various forms of political and liberation theology (i.e., feminist, black and Third World as well as the work of other individual theologians. What is characteristic of and common to such diverse forms of theological reflection is their attempt to reformulate from various critical perspectives the meaning and truth-claims of the Christian tradition's central theological and Christological affirmations."

Revisionist Theology | Encyclopedia.com

REVISIONIST THEOLOGY In the broadest sense, "revisionist theology" refers to such recent theological movements as process theism and various forms of political and liberation theology (i.e., feminist, black and Third World as well as the work of other individual theologians. Source for...

www.encyclopedia.com

I have been very interested in David Tracy lately.
"For Tracy, a revisionist fundamental Christian theology is best described as philosophical reflection on the meanings present in common human experience and those present in the Christian tradition. The broad and the narrow senses of the term are not unrelated. Revisionist theology as a formal model of theological method is characterized by a specific understanding of the web of commitments which define the standpoint of the individual theologian's approach to the Christian faith. "

Anyone care to discuss?

The AI on my computer is hooked up to thousands of pages of theology documents, from Catholic, Orthodox and Protestant denominations, but it will not be ready to answer any questions for a while (cos it is processing the US Law). Remind me in early August to ask it about this Revisionist Theology, and then see if it is compatible with most Catholics and Protestants.

 

[Akita Suggagaki]

The AI on my computer is hooked up to thousands of pages of theology documents, from Catholic, Orthodox and Protestant denominations, but it will not be ready to answer any questions for a while (cos it is processing the US Law). Remind me in early August to ask it about this Revisionist Theology, and then see if it is compatible with most Catholics and Protestants.

OK, probably a small %. It is Process Theology. (my favorite but some view it heterodox.
But Tracy is in good standing and I do not think ever challenged.

 

[Offline4Better.]

OK, probably a small %. It is Process Theology. (my favorite but some view it heterodox.
But Tracy is in good standing and I do not think ever challenged.

Small percent... Hmm. We will have to wait and see what the AI says. It is 2/3 of the way done with embedding the US Law, so maybe early August would work.

 

[Akita Suggagaki]

I am so eager to get my replacement copy of Blessed Rage for Order. He sets it out. I read it years ago an barely understood it, if at all.
After reading Layman's Guide to Protestant Theology I think I am better equipped now. He actually keeps me more comfortable in The Church.

I also am waiting for Analogical Imagination. I started a library copy and had to get my own.

 

[Akita Suggagaki]

I am so eager to get my replacement copy of Blessed Rage for Order. He sets it out. I read it years ago an barely understood it, if at all.
After reading Layman's Guide to Protestant Theology I think I am better equipped now. He actually keeps me more comfortable in The Church.

I also am waiting for Analogical Imagination. I started a library copy and had to get my own.

"The forces for the demystification of Western religious world-view were set loose by the Enlightenment's demand for freedom from oppressive authorities and freedom for autonomous, critical, rational thought. Such forces were eventually institutionalized when the soon all encompassing process of secularization took root in the basic vision and the academic institutions of Western intellectuals. Traditional Western Christianity in its major Catholic and Protestant forms soon felt the full force of this demand for rationality; as it most cherished cognitive, ethical, and existential beliefs were examined by the new methods of the now autonomous and soon dominant natural and social sciences, the historical disciplines, the new philosophies, and the new ethical systems.

"Most Christians now recognize that much of the traditional Christian manner of understanding the cognitive claims made in the Christian scriptures should be rejected by findings of history and of natural and human sciences." BRFO ps 4-5

I certainly would not say "most Christians". And that was in 1975. In fact I think today we have a revival or re-mystification of all sorts of cognitive claims made in Christin Scripture simple because it is Christian scripture. And that goes especially for eschatology.

 

[okay]

The AI on my computer is hooked up to thousands of pages of theology documents, from Catholic, Orthodox and Protestant denominations, but it will not be ready to answer any questions for a while (cos it is processing the US Law). Remind me in early August to ask it about this Revisionist Theology, and then see if it is compatible with most Catholics and Protestants.

In think you have way too much faith in AI. I am an R&D engineer, and while we use AI as a tool, we know that some fraction of the time it is downright wrong. We never use it to replace actual thinking, because we know it will lead us astray and result in terrible designs that fail.

You should think of it like that friend of a friend that is super smart, but has zero conscience and gets his kicks by lying some fraction of the time.

 

[Offline4Better.]

In think you have way too much faith in AI. I am an R&D engineer, and while we use AI as a tool, we know that some fraction of the time it is downright wrong. We never use it to replace actual thinking, because we know it will lead us astray and result in terrible designs that fail.

You should think of it like that friend of a friend that is super smart, but has zero conscience and gets his kicks by lying some fraction of the time.

Agreed. AI does not have discernment, while humans do. I have noticed that the AI gravitates to John Calvin for some reason, and that is a bit concerning, cos I did download John Calvin into the AI, in case I ever had to do discussions with Calvinists here, but now the AI is using it for answers. I am tempted to remove the John Calvin PDF document out of the AI's database.

 

[Akita Suggagaki]

"Faith in secularity:
That fundamental attitude which affirms the fundamental significance and final worth of our lives, our thoughts, and actions, here and now, in nature and in history.

"An explicit and full recognition of this faith as, in fact, the common faith shared by the secularist and modern Christian is perhaps the most important insight needed to understand contemporary theological situation in its full dimensions and its real possibilities."


"The revisionist theologian claims: nothing less than a proper understanding of those central beliefs - in "revelation," in "God" in "Jesus Christ" - can provided and adequate understanding, a correct "reflective inventory," or an existentially appropriate symbolic representation of the fundamental faith of secularity."

Do we all share the Faith in secularity.. but with the revisionist qualification?

 

[2PhiloVoid]

REVISIONIST THEOLOGY​

"In the broadest sense, "revisionist theology" refers to such recent theological movements as process theism and various forms of political and liberation theology (i.e., feminist, black and Third World as well as the work of other individual theologians. What is characteristic of and common to such diverse forms of theological reflection is their attempt to reformulate from various critical perspectives the meaning and truth-claims of the Christian tradition's central theological and Christological affirmations."

Revisionist Theology | Encyclopedia.com

REVISIONIST THEOLOGY In the broadest sense, "revisionist theology" refers to such recent theological movements as process theism and various forms of political and liberation theology (i.e., feminist, black and Third World as well as the work of other individual theologians. Source for...

www.encyclopedia.com

I have been very interested in David Tracy lately.
"For Tracy, a revisionist fundamental Christian theology is best described as philosophical reflection on the meanings present in common human experience and those present in the Christian tradition. The broad and the narrow senses of the term are not unrelated. Revisionist theology as a formal model of theological method is characterized by a specific understanding of the web of commitments which define the standpoint of the individual theologian's approach to the Christian faith. "

Anyone care to discuss?

In my estimation, all theology is "revisionist" whenever someone attempts to give their own perspective and/or understanding about what God's Message to the World is.

For me, the real issue is the extent to which each person is epistemologically justified in his or her own view. So, sure, we can have dozens of forms of Christian theology emanating from the minds of various Christians thinkers, whether they're theologians or philosophers, but each attempt to offer a cogent and coherent theological accounting for the Christian message will have to be scrutinized and vetted and carefully thought over.

Some of what I'm saying here not only applies to the various modern theologies like Liberation theology or Process theology, but also to the reasons for why we see differences in the narratives of the Four Gospels, or differences in theological emphasis between someone like the Apostle Paul and James.

As for David Tracy, I haven't read him, but I might have some bit or chapter in some book somewhere on my shelves. I'll have to look, Akita.

 

[Akita Suggagaki]

Some of what I'm saying here not only applies to the various modern theologies like Liberation theology or Process theology, but also to the reasons for why we see differences in the narratives of the Four Gospels, or differences in theological emphasis between someone like the Apostle Paul and James.

And Hillel and Shammai.

 

[Akita Suggagaki]

" That basic faith in the worthwhileness of existence, in the final graciousness of our lives even in the midst of absurdity, may be named the religious dimension of our existence. " p. 119

"The present situation is more correctly described as a search for the significant similarities and differences between the scientific and the religious dimensions of our common humanity." p.95

These seem to be fundamental building block.

 

[Akita Suggagaki]

KW: Turning to the second part of your first-volume title, what do you mean by “The Existential Situation of Our Time”?

DT: For philosophers and theologians, I think, it’s nihilism. The sense that there is no meaning. The sense of the absurdity and meaninglessness of life. Even if it’s not brought to a theoretical level, when people live without religion, in my judgment, they eventually end up leading a nihilistic life, sometimes without knowing it. That’s the intellectual situation.

The more important existential situation, I think, remains the massive global suffering that human beings face—both as whole cultures and groups and of course as individuals. Christian salvation, after all, is fundamentally about responding to the profound sense of transience—that we are transient, and everything we own or love is transient, including our cultures, and our traditions. And of course death, and facing death, which remains a great existential issue for every human being. I call these kinds of issues “limit” questions, limit experiences, limit situations. These ultimate questions that any thoughtful human being eventually asks. And that is our existential situation.

DT: I would describe myself as a Christian theologian with the Catholic center of gravity. I am clearly Catholic, and at the same time I have tried to be not just ecumenical, which is maybe too easy a word, but to genuinely learn from the many Protestant traditions, and the Greek and Russian Orthodox traditions.

KW: What would you say to someone who asked: “David Tracy, do you believe that Christ is the one way of salvation?”

DT: For myself, Christ is the decisive way. And Jesus of Nazareth is the unsubstitutable person who is the Christ, and Jesus Christ is God and man. Now, does that mean you can’t honor other religious traditions? Certainly not. Because if you believe that Jesus Christ is the decisive manifestation of God, you have to honor that and ask others to honor it as what Christianity is about, which I think it is. So when you enter interreligious conversation, the dialogues that I spoke about as so important, I don’t myself think that one should immediately say “pluralism.” I’m pluralist on many things, but on that I think it’s much more subtle, nuanced, and difficult. If you hold as traditional, Chalcedonian Christianity does, and I do, the centrality of Jesus Christ, it’s more like inclusive Christianity. You’re open to the other traditions, and in some way, Christ includes, welcomes. I don’t believe in exclusivist Christianity.

In Praise of Fragments | Commonweal Magazine

Fr. David Tracy, widely regarded as one of the most creative and influential theologians of the past half-century, speaks about his life and work.

www.commonwealmagazine.org

 

[Akita Suggagaki]

In my estimation, all theology is "revisionist" whenever someone attempts to give their own perspective and/or understanding about what God's Message to the World is.

I think even David Tracy admits it is a form of Neo-orthodoxy.

Now I see his latest is something about 'fragments"
collecting essays from the 1980s to 2018 into a two-volume work

.https://www.thriftbooks.com/w/fragments-the-existential-situation-of-our-time-selected-essays-volume-one_david-tracy/20725378/#edition=22124970

In Praise of Fragments | Commonweal Magazine

Fr. David Tracy, widely regarded as one of the most creative and influential theologians of the past half-century, speaks about his life and work.

www.commonwealmagazine.org

I just finished Blessed Rage for Order and loved it, Along with On Naming the Present.

I have Analogical Imagination on my shelf.
But I hear Plurality and Ambiguity is good.
Now Fragments.

What am I to do? that is all probably 1,000 pages in total.

 

[Akita Suggagaki]

I am so eager to get my replacement copy of Blessed Rage for Order. He sets it out. I read it years ago an barely understood it, if at all.
After reading Layman's Guide to Protestant Theology I think I am better equipped now. He actually keeps me more comfortable in The Church.

I also am waiting for Analogical Imagination. I started a library copy and had to get my own.

I highly recommend this very readable book that gives the landscape of theology.

a layman's guide to protestant theology - Google Search