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Revelation 23

Apple Sky

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Just testing :D

There never has been a literal Revelation Chapter 23. Revelation ends with Chapter 22.

There are sermons that have been entitled “Rev 23”, but those are part of a figurative sermon(s) that seek to expound on the post New Heaven and New Earth life with Christ.

A similar analogy would be the Acts 29 movement in China. There is no literal Acts 29. But the movement seeks to follow Christ as if it's the 1st century as a continuation of the early church but now in the present tense. China persecutes Christians today like many were persecuted by the Roman govt.

You can find plenty of nonsense on YouTube including preachers and teachers that misguide and mislead others.

Rest assured that John ended this inspired letter to the 7 churches of Asia at the conclusion of Chapter 22.
 

keras

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Just testing :D

There never has been a literal Revelation Chapter 23. Revelation ends with Chapter 22.

There are sermons that have been entitled “Rev 23”, but those are part of a figurative sermon(s) that seek to expound on the post New Heaven and New Earth life with Christ.

A similar analogy would be the Acts 29 movement in China. There is no literal Acts 29. But the movement seeks to follow Christ as if it's the 1st century as a continuation of the early church but now in the present tense. China persecutes Christians today like many were persecuted by the Roman govt.

You can find plenty of nonsense on YouTube including preachers and teachers that misguide and mislead others.

Rest assured that John ended this inspired letter to the 7 churches of Asia at the conclusion of Chapter 22.
Yes: Revelation and God's 7000 year Plan for mankind finishes at Rev 22 and the Eternal state.
But there is an Acts chapter 29:
Acts of the Apostles. The missing Chapter 29:

220 years ago, this missing chapter of the Book of Acts, written in the same Greek as the rest of the New Testament, was found in the archives of the Sultan, in Istanbul by Frenchman; C.S. Sonnini. It was translated and printed in 1801.

There are other proofs of Pauls visit to Britain, in the writings of the Early Church Fathers and in many oral traditions of England.
Note that in the last two verses of Acts 28:30-31, Paul was free in Rome and he stayed there for two full years. Then......nothing more?

The Bible does not tell us the time and manner of Paul’s death, but we can be sure, he didn’t just retire and tend his garden! If he was beheaded by Nero, as some speculate, surely the Bible would have told us that. Anyway beheading wasn’t Nero’s style. No; Acts infers a departure from Rome....to where?

Acts of the Apostles 29:1 And Paul full of the blessings of Christ and abounding in the Spirit, departed out of Rome, determining to go to Spain, for he had for a long time purposed to go there and was minded also to go from there into Britain.

2/ For he had heard in Phoenicia that certain of the children of Israel, at the time of the Assyrian captivity, had escaped by sea to ‘the isles afar off’, as spoken by the prophet, [Jeremiah 31:10] and called by the Romans, Britain.

3/ As the Lord Commanded, the Gospel was to be preached to the Gentiles and to the lost sheep of the House of Israel. Matthew 15:24

4/ And no man hindered Paul, for he testified boldly of Jesus before the Tribunes and among the people. He took with him certain of the brethren who were with him in Rome. They took ship at Ostium and having the winds fair, were brought safely into a port of Spain.

5/ Many people gathered from the towns and the hill country, for they had heard of the conversion of Paul and the many miracles he had done.

6/ Paul preached mightily in Spain and a great multitude believed and became Christian, for they perceived that he was an Apostle sent by God.

7/ Then Paul and his company departed out of Spain, finding a ship in Armorica sailing to Britain, they went on it and passing along the south coast arrived in a port called Raphinus. [Portsmouth]

8/ Now when it was noised abroad that the Apostle had landed, great multitudes of the inhabitants met him and they treated Paul courteously as he entered their town by the East gate and lodged in the home of a Hebrew, one of his own kin. Romans 16:13

9/ Then they travelled to the main town of Britain, [Londinium] Paul stood upon Mount Lud, [Ludgate hill, where St Pauls Cathedral now stands] and the crowds thronged in Broadway as he preached Christ to them and many believed the Word and the Testimony of Jesus.

10/ In the evening the holy Ghost fell upon Paul and he prophesied, saying: ‘Behold, in the last days the God of peace shall dwell in this place and the citizens shall be numbered, then in the seventh numbering of the people, their eyes shall be opened and the glory of their inheritance will shine forth before them. Nations shall come up to worship on the mount that testifies to the patience and longsuffering of the servants of the Lord’.
11/ And in the latter days, new tidings of the Gospel shall issue forth out of Jerusalem and the hearts of the people will rejoice. Behold fountains will be opened and there will be no more plagues.

12/ In those days there shall be wars and rumours of wars and a king shall rise up, his Sword will be the healing of the nations, his Peace-making shall abide and the glory of his kingdom a wonder to the world. [The Millennium Kingdom of Jesus]

13/ Then some of the Druids came to Paul privately and showed to Paul by their rites and ceremonies that they were descended from Israel, who had escaped from their bondage in the land of Egypt. The Apostle believed them and he gave them the kiss of peace.

13/ Paul stayed in his lodging for three months, preaching the Gospel continually and confirming those in the faith.

15/ After this Paul and his friends sailed from there to Atium in Gaul. [France]

16/ There Paul preached in the Roman garrisons and among the people, exhorting all to repent and to confess their sins.

17/ There came to him some of the Belgae, [North Europeans] to enquire of him about this new doctrine and about the man Jesus. Paul opened his heart to them and told them all that had befallen him and how Christ Jesus had come into the world to save sinners. They departed, pondering among themselves the things they had heard.

18/ After much preaching and toil, Paul and his labourers passed into Helvetia, [Switzerland] and came to Mount Pontius Pilate, where he who had condemned Jesus had dashed himself down headlong, so perishing miserably.

19/ Then a torrent gushed out of the mountain and washed his broken body into a lake.

20/ Paul stretched forth his hands over the water and prayed to the Lord: “O Lord God, give a sign that here Pontius Pilate, who condemned your only begotten Son, has gone down into the pit.”

21/ As Paul was speaking, there came a great earthquake and the sign of the Cross was formed upon the lake.

22/ A Voice came from heaven saying, “Even Pilate has escaped the wrath to come, because he washed his hands before the crowd at the blood shedding of Jesus.”

23/ When therefore, Paul and those who were with him, saw the earthquake and heard the Voice, they glorified God and were mightily strengthened in spirit.

24/ They journeyed on and came to Mt Julius, [the Julian Alps, now the Dolomites] where there stood two pillars; right and left, erected by Caesar Augustus,

25/ Then Paul filled with the Holy Spirit, stood between those two pillars and said, “Men and brethren, these stones you see here shall testify of my travels to here and I say with certainty that they will remain until the outpouring of the Spirit onto all nations and the way, [the Gospel] will not be hindered throughout all generations.”

26/ They went forth and come to Illyricum, [the Balkan area; Romans 15:19] where they prospered and had peace, as grace was found in all the churches.
Ref; logostelos.info
 
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Apple Sky

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Yes: Revelation and God's 7000 year Plan for mankind finishes at Rev 22 and the Eternal state.
But there is an Acts chapter 29:
Acts of the Apostles. The missing Chapter 29:

220 years ago, this missing chapter of the Book of Acts, written in the same Greek as the rest of the New Testament, was found in the archives of the Sultan, in Istanbul by Frenchman; C.S. Sonnini. It was translated and printed in 1801.

There are other proofs of Pauls visit to Britain, in the writings of the Early Church Fathers and in many oral traditions of England.
Note that in the last two verses of Acts 28:30-31, Paul was free in Rome and he stayed there for two full years. Then......nothing more?

The Bible does not tell us the time and manner of Paul’s death, but we can be sure, he didn’t just retire and tend his garden! If he was beheaded by Nero, as some speculate, surely the Bible would have told us that. Anyway beheading wasn’t Nero’s style. No; Acts infers a departure from Rome....to where?

Acts of the Apostles 29:1 And Paul full of the blessings of Christ and abounding in the Spirit, departed out of Rome, determining to go to Spain, for he had for a long time purposed to go there and was minded also to go from there into Britain.

2/ For he had heard in Phoenicia that certain of the children of Israel, at the time of the Assyrian captivity, had escaped by sea to ‘the isles afar off’, as spoken by the prophet, [Jeremiah 31:10] and called by the Romans, Britain.

3/ As the Lord Commanded, the Gospel was to be preached to the Gentiles and to the lost sheep of the House of Israel. Matthew 15:24

4/ And no man hindered Paul, for he testified boldly of Jesus before the Tribunes and among the people. He took with him certain of the brethren who were with him in Rome. They took ship at Ostium and having the winds fair, were brought safely into a port of Spain.

5/ Many people gathered from the towns and the hill country, for they had heard of the conversion of Paul and the many miracles he had done.

6/ Paul preached mightily in Spain and a great multitude believed and became Christian, for they perceived that he was an Apostle sent by God.

7/ Then Paul and his company departed out of Spain, finding a ship in Armorica sailing to Britain, they went on it and passing along the south coast arrived in a port called Raphinus. [Portsmouth]

8/ Now when it was noised abroad that the Apostle had landed, great multitudes of the inhabitants met him and they treated Paul courteously as he entered their town by the East gate and lodged in the home of a Hebrew, one of his own kin. Romans 16:13

9/ Then they travelled to the main town of Britain, [Londinium] Paul stood upon Mount Lud, [Ludgate hill, where St Pauls Cathedral now stands] and the crowds thronged in Broadway as he preached Christ to them and many believed the Word and the Testimony of Jesus.

10/ In the evening the holy Ghost fell upon Paul and he prophesied, saying: ‘Behold, in the last days the God of peace shall dwell in this place and the citizens shall be numbered, then in the seventh numbering of the people, their eyes shall be opened and the glory of their inheritance will shine forth before them. Nations shall come up to worship on the mount that testifies to the patience and longsuffering of the servants of the Lord’.
11/ And in the latter days, new tidings of the Gospel shall issue forth out of Jerusalem and the hearts of the people will rejoice. Behold fountains will be opened and there will be no more plagues.

12/ In those days there shall be wars and rumours of wars and a king shall rise up, his Sword will be the healing of the nations, his Peace-making shall abide and the glory of his kingdom a wonder to the world. [The Millennium Kingdom of Jesus]

13/ Then some of the Druids came to Paul privately and showed to Paul by their rites and ceremonies that they were descended from Israel, who had escaped from their bondage in the land of Egypt. The Apostle believed them and he gave them the kiss of peace.

13/ Paul stayed in his lodging for three months, preaching the Gospel continually and confirming those in the faith.

15/ After this Paul and his friends sailed from there to Atium in Gaul. [France]

16/ There Paul preached in the Roman garrisons and among the people, exhorting all to repent and to confess their sins.

17/ There came to him some of the Belgae, [North Europeans] to enquire of him about this new doctrine and about the man Jesus. Paul opened his heart to them and told them all that had befallen him and how Christ Jesus had come into the world to save sinners. They departed, pondering among themselves the things they had heard.

18/ After much preaching and toil, Paul and his labourers passed into Helvetia, [Switzerland] and came to Mount Pontius Pilate, where he who had condemned Jesus had dashed himself down headlong, so perishing miserably.

19/ Then a torrent gushed out of the mountain and washed his broken body into a lake.

20/ Paul stretched forth his hands over the water and prayed to the Lord: “O Lord God, give a sign that here Pontius Pilate, who condemned your only begotten Son, has gone down into the pit.”

21/ As Paul was speaking, there came a great earthquake and the sign of the Cross was formed upon the lake.

22/ A Voice came from heaven saying, “Even Pilate has escaped the wrath to come, because he washed his hands before the crowd at the blood shedding of Jesus.”

23/ When therefore, Paul and those who were with him, saw the earthquake and heard the Voice, they glorified God and were mightily strengthened in spirit.

24/ They journeyed on and came to Mt Julius, [the Julian Alps, now the Dolomites] where there stood two pillars; right and left, erected by Caesar Augustus,

25/ Then Paul filled with the Holy Spirit, stood between those two pillars and said, “Men and brethren, these stones you see here shall testify of my travels to here and I say with certainty that they will remain until the outpouring of the Spirit onto all nations and the way, [the Gospel] will not be hindered throughout all generations.”

26/ They went forth and come to Illyricum, [the Balkan area; Romans 15:19] where they prospered and had peace, as grace was found in all the churches.
Ref; logostelos.info

Thanks Keras, I didn't know this, very interesting read. No wonder they took it out of the Bible as this tells us a lot about England. It wouldn't surprise me if Jesus once visited England too.

Jerusalem
Song


And did those feet in ancient time
walk upon England's mountains green?
And was the holy Lamb of God
on England's pleasant pastures seen?
And did the countenance divine
shine forth upon our clouded hills?
And was Jerusalem builded here
among those dark Satanic Mills?
 
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David Lamb

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Thanks Keras, I didn't know this, very interesting read. No wonder they took it out of the Bible as this tells us a lot about England. It wouldn't surprise me if Jesus once visited England too.

Jerusalem
Song


And did those feet in ancient time
walk upon England's mountains green?
And was the holy Lamb of God
on England's pleasant pastures seen?
And did the countenance divine
shine forth upon our clouded hills?
And was Jerusalem builded here
among those dark Satanic Mills?
It would surprise me, because we are given in the bible details of the birth, life, ministry, death, resurrection and ascension of Jesus Christ, and there is no mention of Him ever going abroad from His home country.
 
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Apple Sky

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It would surprise me, because we are given in the bible details of the birth, life, ministry, death, resurrection and ascension of Jesus Christ, and there is no mention of Him ever going abroad from His home country.

There was no mention of Paul going until now.
 
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David Lamb

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There was no mention of Paul going until now.
If you mean "of Paul going to England", I had assumed that the post containing "Acts 29" was written "tongue-in-cheek", and was not intended to be taken seriously.
 
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Apple Sky

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If you mean "of Paul going to England", I had assumed that the post containing "Acts 29" was written "tongue-in-cheek", and was not intended to be taken seriously.

How do you know ?
 
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David Lamb

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How do you know ?
How do I know what? That Paul didn't visit England? Only that the New Testament, which describes Paul's journeys in some detail, makes no mention of such a visit. Or did you mean to ask how I know that the earlier post was not intended seriously? Simply the made-up extra chapter of Acts that it contained. (Also, if it had been serious, I would have had to correct an error, because London didn't become the capital until long after Paul died!)
 
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Apple Sky

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I would have had to correct an error, because London didn't become the capital until long after Paul died!)

When Paul was there London was not as the Capitol, it was just known as Lud, I've heard this before.
 
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David Lamb

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When Paul was there London was not as the Capitol, it was just known as Lud, I've heard this before.
Not only did it have various names, the capital was Colchester, then Winchester before it was in London/Londinium/Lud!
 
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Apple Sky

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Not only did it have various names, the capital was Colchester, then Winchester before it was in London/Londinium/Lud!

The Phoenicians came to UK long ago and named London - El On Don I believe, established the site where St Paul's cathedral is as a Holy place.

The Phoenicians had records of sailing far enough to where the day's have no nights.

I always wondered why they called it St Paul's cathedral ???
 
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eleos1954

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Just testing :D

There never has been a literal Revelation Chapter 23. Revelation ends with Chapter 22.

There are sermons that have been entitled “Rev 23”, but those are part of a figurative sermon(s) that seek to expound on the post New Heaven and New Earth life with Christ.

A similar analogy would be the Acts 29 movement in China. There is no literal Acts 29. But the movement seeks to follow Christ as if it's the 1st century as a continuation of the early church but now in the present tense. China persecutes Christians today like many were persecuted by the Roman govt.

You can find plenty of nonsense on YouTube including preachers and teachers that misguide and mislead others.

Rest assured that John ended this inspired letter to the 7 churches of Asia at the conclusion of Chapter 22.
Ecclesiastes 1

8 All things are wearisome, more than one can describe; the eye is not satisfied with seeing, nor the ear content with hearing. 9What has been will be again, and what has been done will be done again; there is nothing new under the sun. 10Is there a case where one can say, “Look, this is new”? It has already existed in the ages before us.…

The 7 churches depict the type of conditions of the churches of today and going forward.

What happened in the past here and there will eventually happen globally. The Bible gives us examples of what has happened in the past so we know what is coming in the future. The difference is that things will escalate and things will happen globally.

All roads lead to Rome. No there isn't a Revelation chapter 23 ... that's nonsense.
 
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keras

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How do I know what? That Paul didn't visit England? Only that the New Testament, which describes Paul's journeys in some detail, makes no mention of such a visit. Or did you mean to ask how I know that the earlier post was not intended seriously? Simply the made-up extra chapter of Acts that it contained. (Also, if it had been serious, I would have had to correct an error, because London didn't become the capital until long after Paul died!)
The historical fact is that Paul could easily have visited England. There are records of very early Christianity in Britian.
Also Jesus was not known in Galilee when He commenced His ministry, He was a foreigner who had to pay the Temple tax. Matthew 17:22-27 Verse 26 shows He was an alien, because He had lived in Britain from His childhood until age about 27. His uncle Joseph of Aramathea, was an exporter of lead and tin to Rome.
 
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David Lamb

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The Phoenicians came to UK long ago and named London - El On Don I believe, established the site where St Paul's cathedral is as a Holy place.

The Phoenicians had records of sailing far enough to where the day's have no nights.

I always wondered why they called it St Paul's cathedral ???
Whatever the Phoenicians may have done, (and I have never heard about them coming to what is now the UK), and whatever they might have called the place we now call "London", my point was that at the time Paul lived, London was not the capital, and in that the person who fabricated "Acts 23" was mistaken.

As to why it was called "St Paul's Cathedral", you probably know that Anglicans name their church buildings, "St So-and-so". Many villages, towns and cities have a church building called "St Paul's". No indication that Paul visited all those places. Indeed, some church buildings are called "All Saints" and certainly not all saints visited those places either!
 
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Apple Sky

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Whatever the Phoenicians may have done, (and I have never heard about them coming to what is now the UK),

Tarshish in the bible is Europe.
Tarshish is where Jonah fled too.
 
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David Lamb

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Tarshish in the bible is Europe.
Tarshish is where Jonah fled too.
Sorry, you'll need to explain what relevance this has to London, apart from it being in the same continent as Tarshish.
 
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