Reve 16 and Great Hail question

LittleLambofJesus · Dec 2, 2011

Bourne said:
I think they're a symbolic representation of the stones launched from Roman catapults during the siege of Jerusalem, which would be consistent with the fact that Revelation is apocalyptic in nature and discusses events in the early churches immediate future.

That is my view also

The Destruction of Jerusalem - George Peter Holford, 1805AD

As a consequence, the legions were able to build their redoubts almost without any trouble; soon, their catapults started to throw heavy stones into the city. Under cover of this artillery fire, the Roman soldiers could start to bash the northern wall with their battering-rams.

Gnarwhal · Dec 2, 2011

LittleLambofJesus said:
That is my view also

The Destruction of Jerusalem - George Peter Holford, 1805AD

As a consequence, the legions were able to build their redoubts almost without any trouble; soon, their catapults started to throw heavy stones into the city. Under cover of this artillery fire, the Roman soldiers could start to bash the northern wall with their battering-rams.

(Highfive)

That's a great resource, thanks for sharing.

LittleLambofJesus · Dec 3, 2011

Bourne said:
(Highfive)

That's a great resource, thanks for sharing.

Are there many Christians that view OC Jerusalem as the "babylon" shown in Revelation?

http://www.christianforums.com/t7444613/#post54520485
Babylon = Imitation of Jerusalem?

brinny · Dec 3, 2011

Originally Posted by James 75
Why the hail wouldn't you believe they are literal?

LittleLambofJesus said:
Hail if I know

LOL!

LittleLambofJesus · Dec 3, 2011

Originally Posted by LittleLambofJesus That is my view also

The Destruction of Jerusalem - George Peter Holford, 1805AD

As a consequence, the legions were able to build their redoubts almost without any trouble; soon, their catapults started to throw heavy stones into the city. Under cover of this artillery fire, the Roman soldiers could start to bash the northern wall with their battering-rams.

Bourne said:
(Highfive)

That's a great resource, thanks for sharing.

Another interesting connection is that of Luke 19:41 and "siege work" which Josephus also describes. I take that very literal

Luke 19:41 And as He nears being aware the City He laments upon Her
42 saying "that if thou knew and thou even indeed in the day, this, the toward Peace of thee, now yet it was Hid from thy eyes.
43 That shall be arriving days upon thee and thy enemies shall be casting up a siege-work to thee and shall be encompassing thee and pressing thee every which place.
44 And shall be leveling thee and thy offspring in thee, and not shall be leaving stone upon stone in thee, stead which not thou knew the time of thy visitation/overseeing/inspection/epi-skophV <1984>".

The Destruction of Jerusalem - George Peter Holford, 1805AD

..............The day on which Titus encompassed Jerusalem, was the feast of the Passover.............

The Romans decided to starve the enemies into surrender. In three days, Jerusalem was surrounded with an eight kilometer long palisade.
All trees within fifteen kilometres of the city were cut down. The camps of the legions V Macedonica, XII Fulminata and XV Apollinaris were demolished; these troops were billeted on Bezetha.

brinny · Dec 3, 2011

me thinks da hail stones are real, mon

LittleLambofJesus · Dec 3, 2011

brinny said:
me thinks da hail stones are real, mon

Tis a possibility

John 10:33 Answered Him, the Judeans saying, "about a good work not we are stoning Thee, but about blasphemy,
and that Thou being a man are making thyself a god ".

Reve 16:21 And hail great as talent-weight is descending out of the Heaven upon the men.
And the men blaspheme the God out of the blow of the hail, that great is the blow of it/her, tremendous

brinny · Dec 3, 2011

LOL! Where DO you find these things?

Great verses, by the way

LittleLambofJesus · Dec 4, 2011

brinny said:
LOL! Where DO you find these things?

Great verses, by the way

By reading the signs in the hailstones me thinks

http://www.christianforums.com/t7405089-4/#post53043894
What the sign?

LittleLambofJesus · May 15, 2012

Any more repsonses/votes on this thread? Thanks

http://www.christianforums.com/t7354592-3/#post58827770

Achilles6129 · May 15, 2012

LittleLambofJesus said:
Greetings. How do other Christians here view this event in Reve 16:21. Is the hailstones falling from Heaven literal or is it symbolic. This is the only place in the NT that uses this word though it is used a number of times in the OT. Please just keep this on the topic of the "hailstones". Thanks

Reve 16:21 And Hail/calaza <5464>great as talent-weight is descending out of the Heaven upon the Men, and blaspheme the God the Men out of the blow of the Hail/calazhV <5464> , that great is the blow of it/her, tremendous. [LXX # 5464 used in Ezekiel 38:22]

Textus Rec.) Revelation 16:21 kai calaza megalh wV talantiaia katabainei ek tou ouranou epi touV anqrwpouV kai eblasfhmhsan oi anqrwpoi ton qeon ek thV plhghV thV calazhV oti megalh estin h plhgh authV sfodra

5464. chalaza khal'-ad-zah probably from 5465; hail:--hail. Used 4 times Reve 8:7, 11:19, Reve 16:21 [2 times]
5465. chalao khal-ah'-o from the base of 5490; to lower (as into a void):--let down, strike.

Originally Posted by squint

Spin it however you see it. Don't recall any history of 100lb hailstones

Hey LLOJ,

I had a thread on this a while ago. The hailstones are literal. Basically, in my thread I showed how the 6th seal = the 7th trumpet = the 7th vial. The reason why they're hiding themselves in the caves at the 6th seal is because of the hail falling on their heads in the 7th vial.

Think about it - if 100 lb hailstones are falling upon your head, where's the only place you could go to hide yourself? That's right - the caves of the mountains. That's where they go in the 6th seal.

Gnarwhal · May 15, 2012

This thread's been going for a while so I'm sure this has been mentioned already, but I'll post it anyway. I think Josephus' description suffices:

Josephus - “Now the stones that were cast were of the weight of a talent, and were carried two furlongs and further. The blow they gave was no way to be sustained, not only by those that stood first in the way, but by those that were beyond them for a great space. As for the Jews, they at first watched the coming of the stone, for it was of a white color, and could therefore not only be perceived by the great noise it made, but could be seen also before it came by its brightness;” (5:6:3)

Achilles6129 · May 16, 2012

Bourne said:
This thread's been going for a while so I'm sure this has been mentioned already, but I'll post it anyway. I think Josephus' description suffices:

The book of Revelation was written after 70 AD.

Also, there are other places in the Scriptures where hail is linked with God' return:

"30 And the Lord shall cause his glorious voice to be heard, and shall shew the lighting down of his arm, with the indignation of his anger, and with the flame of a devouring fire, with scattering, and tempest, and hailstones." Isa. 30:30

Ave Maria · May 17, 2012

I believe they could be literal but I don't think it is talking about hail as in balls of ice. I think maybe it is talking about meteorites and such.

razeontherock · May 18, 2012

Ave Maria said:
I believe they could be literal but I don't think it is talking about hail as in balls of ice. I think maybe it is talking about meteorites and such.

Meteorites and comets are comprised of significant amounts of ice

Going Merry · May 18, 2012

Literal

Voluntary Joe · May 18, 2012

As someone who has spent the good part of 10 years studying eschatology, I am pretty certain that this is literal hailstones. I say this looking at the series of judgements throughout Revelation and comparing them to other plagues throughout the Bible. Also looking at Revelation and other eschatological passages as a whole there are contextual clues concerning when something is literal versus symbolic. The descriptive nature of natural phenomena within the plagues shows where they are literal.

Gnarwhal · May 18, 2012

Achilles6129 said:
The book of Revelation was written after 70 AD.

That's something that has been debated for a while.

LittleLambofJesus · Jul 9, 2012

This thread's been going for a while so I'm sure this has been mentioned already, but I'll post it anyway. I think Josephus' description suffices:

Bourne said:
This thread's been going for a while so I'm sure this has been mentioned already, but I'll post it anyway. I think Josephus' description suffices:

Josephus - Now the stones that were cast were of the weight of a talent, and were carried two furlongs and further. The blow they gave was no way to be sustained, not only by those that stood first in the way, but by those that were beyond them for a great space. As for the Jews, they at first watched the coming of the stone, for it was of a white color, and could therefore not only be perceived by the great noise it made, but could be seen also before it came by its brightness; (5:6:3)

Click to expand...

Ironic that the wording "weight of a talent" is also used in Revelation 16.
I and a lot of others view OC Jerusalem/Herod's Temple as being symbolized in Revelation chapt 1-19.

NKJV) Revelation 16:21 And great hail from heaven fell upon men, [each hailstone] about the weight of a talent. Men blasphemed God because of the plague of the hail, since that plague was exceedingly great.

http://www.bible.ca/pre-destruction70AD-george-holford-1805AD.htm

The day on which Titus encompassed Jerusalem, was the feast of the Passover ; and it is deserving of the very particular attention of the reader, that this was the anniversary of that memorable period in which the Jews crucified their Messiah !

At this season multitudes came up from all the surrounding country, and from distant parts, to keep the festival. How suitable and how kind, then, was the prophetic admonition of our LORD, and how clearly he into futurity when he said "Let not them that are in the countries enter into Jerusalem." Luke xxi. 21.

brinny · Jul 9, 2012

i thinks it's literal....it speaks of an indescribably awful time...those kinds of hailstones fit such awfulness

Reve 16 and Great Hail question

Hail from Heaven in Reve 16 literal or symbolic

Yes I believe they are literal hail stones from Heaven

No I believe it is symbolic

I have no view on it right now

Other please explain

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Hebrews 2:14.... Pesky Devil, git!

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Hebrews 2:14.... Pesky Devil, git!

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Hebrews 2:14.... Pesky Devil, git!

Hebrews 2:14.... Pesky Devil, git!

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