Responding to Suffering

[tobethebest]

No more false promises. No more formulas and no more phoney potions. We want reality. The Bible says " I live by the faith of the Son of God" not our faith, but by the faith of the Son of God. "In the world you shall have tribulation" John 16:32.

Tragedy, suffering, affliction do come from God that He might build us up. We might not understand it, we might not appreciate any part of it, but it is as it is.

Isaiah 6 says He hath torn and He hath smitten. Jer 1:10 says He is responsible for pulling down, destroying, throwing down, rooting out. Job said the chastening of the Lord maketh sore and that it is He who woundeth.

So, is God part of or responsible for tragedy, suffering or affliction? Yes, but we must remember "All things work to the good for them who love God and are called according to His purpose." Reality thinking.

 

[FallingWaters]

I agree. R. C. Sproul was just teaching about this the other day. Since God is Sovereign, He is ultimately in control of the difficulties that enter our lives. And since He is a loving Father, we know that even what the devil has meant for evil, God will use for our ultimate and eternal good.

 

[tobethebest]

To Falling Waters - Thank you very much for the response. My concern is for you and your new life apart from your past. As many readers know, my wife has gained almost seventy pounds over the past two years due to a progressive illness. She has not been able to drive for that period of time as well, having had five small fender benders over a three year period. Her three year restriction to driving is nearing its final few months and she may well be able to get around again, but we are afraid her medications may jepardize her ability to drive carefully, or too carefully, from what many women in her condition comment. She is only 50 years old. During this time I sought social security disability for her and it was finally accepted and she is receiving financial assistance now, as well as good health care from our insurance company.

She has not been out of the house a dozen times in the past twenty seven months and her dependency on medications has become deeply embedded in her. Her doctor instructs me that her medications are a necessity and that I am not to belittle her in any way because of her usage. Her pain levels are chronic and debilitating.

If you have the strength, I would like to know more about what happened to your husband. He sounds like a cool guy. Any man who will take on the care and responsibility of a wife, sole supporter and all, is a heck-of-a-man to me. It isn't easy.

What are you considering taking on as employment? The loss of so many jobs over the past couple years has our area of the country devastated. Unemployment is depression like. So don't beat yourself up if things are slow right now for you. It is slow all over. Someone should make politicans, dishwashers for a year and give them a taste of their own medicine.

Thinking about you,
Denny

 

[God&me]

No more false promises. No more formulas and no more phoney potions. We want reality. The Bible says " I live by the faith of the Son of God" not our faith, but by the faith of the Son of God. "In the world you shall have tribulation" John 16:32.

Tragedy, suffering, affliction do come from God that He might build us up. We might not understand it, we might not appreciate any part of it, but it is as it is.

Isaiah 6 says He hath torn and He hath smitten. Jer 1:10 says He is responsible for pulling down, destroying, throwing down, rooting out. Job said the chastening of the Lord maketh sore and that it is He who woundeth.

So, is God part of or responsible for tragedy, suffering or affliction? Yes, but we must remember "All things work to the good for them who love God and are called according to His purpose." Reality thinking.

You forgot to finish Jn 16: 33,
"BUT BE OF GOOD CHEER: I HAVE OVERCOME THE WORLD".
Jesus never overcome the world for Himself, He overcame it for us, So we can have the victory.
The original meaning for this verse is,
I have deprived it [the world] of it'd power to hurt you.
1 Jn 5: 4, Says the Christians are world overcomers, But we do it by faith.

God sent Jesus to deliver us from suffering and afflictions.
All things only work together for our good when we let the Holy Spirit intercced for us, Rom 8: 26--28.
V26, The Spirit helps our infirmities, The Greek word for, "Infirmities" Is our inabilities to produce results.
The Greek word for, "Helpeth" means,
"Stands together with us, Against any problems".

Then, & then only do things work togeth for our good,
Sickness, Tragedy, suffering and afflictions don't work for our good, and none of them come from God.
People quote Job a lot, But Job was in the old testament under the law, We are now living in the new testament days, under grace, love, mercy and blessings.
God has given us,
His word,[The Bible]
The name of Jesus.
Nine gifts of the Holy Spirit
Power &
Authority.
And faith.
If we can't live in triumph, 2 Cor 2: 14. Victory, 1 Cor 15: 57. As more than conqerors, Rom 8: 37,
And as overcommers, 1 Jn 5: 4--5,
Then that is our fault, not God's

 

[AndOne]

We do live in triumph - we have been given eternal life and accepted into the loving arms of our Father through the precious blood of his son Jesus. No where does the Bible promise us that we will all be delivered from sickness, tragedy or sufferring in this life. This doesn't mean we don't believe in healing or ask for it - but it does mean that when God withholds his healing hand we trust in His soveign will and accept His answer because - well because He is God and we are not...

 

[FallingWaters]

...
The word will always work for those who work it.

This is the NON- Word-of-faith forum.

God's word is not something we use to manipulate God's will.

We do NOT always get what we want. And it's NOT because we don't have enough faith. It's because what we wanted was in conflict with God's will.

 

[AndOne]

Why would God withold something He has already prvided for us.
Healing is a provision that we receive by faith.
God has already caused us to triumph and we can walk in the victory by Faith.
Where people miss it is when they are waiting for God to do something for us, when He already has, But God is waiting for us to receive the blessings.
God has already blessed us with every spiritual blessing. Eph 1: 3.
By the stripes of Jesus we WERE HEALED. "Were is past tense" as far as God is concerned we are healed, All we have to do is agree with God and receive our healing.

There are those who believe and walk in the victory, And there are those who dis-believe and walk in defeat.
The word will always work for those who work it.

So you are saying Paul walked in defeat - because he constantly suffered and was not healed of the "thorn in his flesh" after he asked God to deliver him.

Sooner or later - everyone suffers... To deny this is ignoring the inevitable. Take a look at the book of Ecclesiastes... Take a look at Job...

Why God withholds healing to some is HIS business. If we are to suffer we should do it with grace and through the power of the Holy Spirit. Not everyone will be healed - nor is it promised in the Bible. The text referred to from Isaiah and Ephesians is referring to the sinful condition of fallen man - not cancer or lukemia....

Your demand for belief for healing only gives despair to those who don't get it. Have some freakin compassion, bro....

 

[Simon Peter]

God&Me,

You now have four posts that break the rules of this forum, and you continue to post your WoF arguments even after being warned that this is the Non-WoF forum.

I don't think people would like it if I went into the WoF forum and started preaching God's hand in suffering. Now please show us the same respect and post your WoF formulas in the WoF or debate forum.

Thank you,
Simon

 

[Mobiosity]

God's word is not something we use to manipulate God's will.

Shouldn't we pray His word? Prayer changes the praying person as well as letting God know what is going on in our lives. (Not that he doesn't know already,) sometime I think He wants us to come to Him so we can know Him better. We have sometimes moved God's hands by prayer. Moses bargained with God several times.

We do NOT always get what we want. And it's NOT because we don't have enough faith. It's because what we wanted was in conflict with God's will.

Sometimes it's not that our desires are in conflict with His will, sometimes we need to wait for the time to be right.

 

[ARBITER01]

Just so back up what simon was saying,..

2. We believe in praying for healing as a significant part of our ministry. However, following on in the example of the Apostle Paul, we believe that healing does not always occur, and that God does not come at our bidding, but rather he works through us serving him in prayer

3. We believe that while God does not necessarily give us money from Heaven, he provides for our needs. We believe in miraculous provision, not as a right to be claimed, but as an answer to prayer as He wills.

Read the rules before you post in a forum.

 

[AndOne]

[1] Who said Paul wasn't delivered from his thorn in the flesh, Paul didn't, Jesus didn't and God didn't, Only the religious people say that. Even if Paul never got delivered it doesn't change God or His word.

Look again. 2 Corinthians 12:8-10 says: Three times I pleaded with the Lord to take it away from me. But he said to me, "My grace is sufficient for you, for my power is made perfect in weakness." Therefore I will boast all the more gladly about my weaknesses, so that Christ's power may rest on me. 1That is why, for Christ's sake, I delight in weaknesses, in insults, in hardships, in persecutions, in difficulties. For when I am weak, then I am strong.

It IS in God's word that Paul didn't get healed.

[2] People migh get sick and suffer, But they can, And will be set free if they stand in faith on God's word,[By His stripse ye WERE HEALED].

Again - Paul is a perfect example that this is not always the case - at least not on this side of eternity. It's in the word.

[3] Why do people always quote Job, Job himself tells us why he suffered,
Because of his mouth and his fear, And his suffering didn't come from God.
Besides We are living in the new testament days now, Under grace, mercy love and blessings.

The only reason Job suffered is because God allowed Satan to assualt him. Check Job 1:12. Ah - people always quote Job because it's scripture!

[4] God never witholds healing, Where did you get that idea from, Jesus has paid the price for our healing, there are three main reasons why people don't receive healing.

I know from personal experience that God withholds healing. And it is in scripture as already shown from 2 Corinthians 2. God also allows persecution and redicule... It's in scripture.

[A] Lack of knowledge.
If people don't know they receive any time they put their faith out, They'll still wait and wait and wait hoping God to do somthing He has already done, [Healed them]

Where is the scripture that supports this idea? Do you have any?

Lack of faith.
People who believe receive, people who don't believe, don't receive. Check how many time Jesus said,
"YOUR FAITH has made you whole, According to YOUR FAITH be it done unto you".

This is in reference to salvation - not healing. Saying a brother's lack of faith caused him to get sick or hurt is both uncompassionate and unloving.


I'll respond to the rest later...

 

[Mobiosity]

God's word is His will, All His promises are YES AND AMEN.

And His answers to prayer are yes, no, and wait.

 

[AndOne]

[3] I dont care about your personal experience

Matthew 25: 41-43

"Then he will say to those on his left, 'Depart from me, you who are cursed, into the eternal fire prepared for the devil and his angels. For I was hungry and you gave me nothing to eat, I was thirsty and you gave me nothing to drink, I was a stranger and you did not invite me in, I needed clothes and you did not clothe me, I was SICK and in prison and you did not look after me.'

I will just let those sobering words speak for themselves. When you tell me my lack of faith is contributing to my sufferring you are not speaking in love... You might want to check your own faith - it truly reflects what is said in these verses...

 

[FreeinChrist]

Admin Hat

I am closing this thread for staff review. The md staff will be looking at it.

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