Removing the laws of God- what does it really mean?

[Nathan@work]

What I say isn't worth a penny. What God says matters, not me

What does God say then?

It was an honest question. Wanting to know if that’s what you thought.

 

[SabbathBlessings]

What does God say then?

It was an honest question. Wanting to know if that’s what you thought.

About what? Sorry I am not sure what you're looking for. What is your question.

 

[SabbathBlessings]

Exodus 16:23, "He said to them, “This is what the Lord commanded: ‘Tomorrow is to be a day of sabbath rest, a holy sabbath to the Lord. So bake what you want to bake and boil what you want to boil. Save whatever is left and keep it until morning.’"

Exodus 20:9-11, "Six days you shall labor and do all your work, but the seventh day is a sabbath to the Lord your God. On it you shall not do any work, neither you, nor your son or daughter, nor your male or female servant, nor your animals, nor any foreigner residing in your towns. For in six days the Lord made the heavens and the earth, the sea, and all that is in them, but he rested on the seventh day. Therefore the Lord blessed the Sabbath day and made it holy."

Exodus 31:14-15, “‘Observe the Sabbath, because it is holy to you. Anyone who desecrates it is to be put to death; those who do any work on that day must be cut off from their people. For six days work is to be done, but the seventh day is a day of sabbath rest, holy to the Lord. Whoever does any work on the Sabbath day is to be put to death."

Exodus 23:32, "It is a day of sabbath rest for you, and you must deny yourselves. From the evening of the ninth day of the month until the following evening you are to observe your sabbath.”

And of course there are many more references...

The point is that there is one day a week to not do any unnecessary work, but to rest. That concept was unknown in the ancient world. God rested on the seventh day as an example to us.

Why would you leave out part of the 4th commandment? The very first verse?

Exodus 20:8 “Remember the Sabbath day, to keep it holy.

 

[pescador]

His instructions say to keep the seventh day Holy. It's the day God blessed, made holy, told us to hallow and sanctified. He never said that about any other day. Saturday was the primary day of worship until it was changed by the Roman Catholic church.

Isaiah 66:23

23 And it shall come to pass, that from one new moon to another, and from one sabbath to another, shall all flesh come to worship before me, saith the Lord.

You wrote, "It's the day God blessed, made holy, told us to hallow and sanctified" I'm not sure what the last phrase "told us to hallow and sanctified" means, but it's an addition to God's Word.

Isaiah 66:17-24, “As for those who consecrate and ritually purify themselves so they can follow their leader and worship in the sacred orchards, those who eat the flesh of pigs and other disgusting creatures, like mice—they will all be destroyed together,” says the Lord. “I hate their deeds and thoughts! So I am coming [future!] to gather all the nations and ethnic groups; they will come and witness my splendor. I will perform a mighty act among them and then send some of those who remain to the nations—to Tarshish, Pul, Lud (known for its archers), Tubal, Javan, and to the distant coastlands that have not heard about me or seen my splendor. They will tell the nations of my splendor. They will bring back all your countrymen from all the nations as an offering to the Lord. They will bring them on horses, in chariots, in wagons, on mules, and on camels to my holy hill Jerusalem,” says the Lord, “just as the Israelites bring offerings to the Lord’s temple in ritually pure containers. And I will choose some of them as priests and Levites,” says the Lord. “For just as the new heavens and the new earth I am about to make will remain standing before me,” says the Lord, “so your descendants and your name will remain. From one month to the next and from one Sabbath to the next, all people will come to worship me,” says the Lord. “They will go out and observe the corpses of those who rebelled against me, for the maggots that eat them will not die, and the fire that consumes them will not die out. All people will find the sight abhorrent.”

It is a serious error to take one phrase out of context to try to prove an erroneous point. The sabbath is about a day of rest unless you're interested in observing corpses, as God commanded.

 

[pescador]

Why would you leave out part of the 4th commandment? The very first verse?

Exodus 20:8 “Remember the Sabbath day, to keep it holy.

It's very unfortunate that Scripture was divided into verses as there was no such division in the early texts. Here is that passage in its entirety, “Remember the Sabbath day to set it apart as holy. For six days you may labor and do all your work, but the seventh day is a Sabbath to the Lord your God; on it you shall not do any work, you, or your son, or your daughter, or your male servant, or your female servant, or your cattle, or the resident foreigner who is in your gates. For in six days the Lord made the heavens and the earth and the sea and all that is in them, and he rested on the seventh day; therefore the Lord blessed the Sabbath day and set it apart as holy.

This is clearly about not doing any work on the Sabbath. There is no mention of worship; none.

 

[SabbathBlessings]

It's very unfortunate that Scripture was divided into verses as there was no such division in the early texts. Here is that passage in its entirety, “Remember the Sabbath day to set it apart as holy. For six days you may labor and do all your work, but the seventh day is a Sabbath to the Lord your God; on it you shall not do any work, you, or your son, or your daughter, or your male servant, or your female servant, or your cattle, or the resident foreigner who is in your gates. For in six days the Lord made the heavens and the earth and the sea and all that is in them, and he rested on the seventh day; therefore the Lord blessed the Sabbath day and set it apart as holy.

This is clearly about not doing any work on the Sabbath. There is no mention of worship; none.

Remember the Sabbath day and keep it holy. Its the very first verse, why would you disregard that?

Also to answer your other posts check out Ezekiel 20:12, Ezekiel 20:20, Exodus 31:13-17 I did not add anything to God's Word.

Isaiah 66:23

 

[Nathan@work]

About what? Sorry I am not sure what you're looking for. What is your question.

Are the heavens and earth Gods greatest creation?

You referenced it a few times so it made me wonder what you thought.

 

[SabbathBlessings]

Are the heavens and earth Gods greatest creation?

You referenced it a few times so it made me wonder what you thought.

My thought is God has declared He is the Creator of the heaven and earth and seas and He writes that in the 4th commandment. The Sabbath commandment is about the day of worship. His chosen day. Allowing God to be God. Giving glory to Him.

The mark of the beast is about who we worship according to scriptures:

Revelations 14: 6: Then I saw another angel flying in the midst of heaven, having the everlasting gospel to preach to those who dwell on the earth—to every nation, tribe, tongue, and people— 7 saying with a loud voice, “Fear God and give glory to Him, for the hour of His judgment has come; and worship Him who made heaven and earth, the sea and springs of water.”

This is similar verbiage in the 4th commandment

Exodus 20:
11 For in six days the Lord made the heavens and the earth, the sea, and all that is in them, and rested the seventh day. Therefore the Lord blessed the Sabbath day and hallowed it.

Another similar scripture:
Nehemiah 9:6 You alone are the Lord; You have made heaven, The heaven of heavens, with all their host, The earth and everything on it, The seas and all that is in them, And You preserve them all. The host of heaven worships You.

Revelations 14: 9 Then a third angel followed them, saying with a loud voice, “If anyone worships the beast and his image, and receives his mark on his forehead or on his hand, 10 he himself shall also drink of the wine of the wrath of God, which is poured out full strength into the cup of His indignation. He shall be tormented with fire and brimstone in the presence of the holy angels and in the presence of the Lamb. 11 And the smoke of their torment ascends forever and ever; and they have no rest day or night, who worship the beast and his image, and whoever receives the mark of his name.”

The end times will be about worship and keeping God’s commandments because the next verse says:

Revelation 14:12 Here is the patience of the saints; here are those who keep the commandments of God and the faith of Jesus.

And one of the last verses in the Bible

14 Blessed are those who do His commandments, that they may have the right to the tree of life, and may enter through the gates into the city.

I don’t think these verses are here by accident. I hope you consider them in prayer.

God bless

 

[Nathan@work]

My thought is God has declared He is the Creator of the heaven and earth and seas and He writes that in the 4th commandment. The Sabbath commandment is about the day of worship. His chosen day. Allowing God to be God. Giving glory to Him.

The mark of the beast is about who we worship according to scriptures:

Revelations 14: 6: Then I saw another angel flying in the midst of heaven, having the everlasting gospel to preach to those who dwell on the earth—to every nation, tribe, tongue, and people— 7 saying with a loud voice, “Fear God and give glory to Him, for the hour of His judgment has come; and worship Him who made heaven and earth, the sea and springs of water.”

This is similar verbiage in the 4th commandment

Exodus 20:
11 For in six days the Lord made the heavens and the earth, the sea, and all that is in them, and rested the seventh day. Therefore the Lord blessed the Sabbath day and hallowed it.

Another similar scripture:
Nehemiah 9:6 You alone are the Lord; You have made heaven, The heaven of heavens, with all their host, The earth and everything on it, The seas and all that is in them, And You preserve them all. The host of heaven worships You.

Revelations 14: 9 Then a third angel followed them, saying with a loud voice, “If anyone worships the beast and his image, and receives his mark on his forehead or on his hand, 10 he himself shall also drink of the wine of the wrath of God, which is poured out full strength into the cup of His indignation. He shall be tormented with fire and brimstone in the presence of the holy angels and in the presence of the Lamb. 11 And the smoke of their torment ascends forever and ever; and they have no rest day or night, who worship the beast and his image, and whoever receives the mark of his name.”

The end times will be about worship and keeping God’s commandments because the next verse says:

Revelation 14:12 Here is the patience of the saints; here are those who keep the commandments of God and the faith of Jesus.

And one of the last verses in the Bible

14 Blessed are those who do His commandments, that they may have the right to the tree of life, and may enter through the gates into the city.

I don’t think these verses are here by accident. I hope you consider them in prayer.

God bless

Interesting. I find it curious you would put the heavens and earth above mankind.

He created mankind after Himself.

He is going to destroy the heavens and the earth one day.

I pray you will see this one day.

Matthew 24:45-51 (ESV)

“Who then is the faithful and wise servant, whom his master has set over his household, to give them their food at the proper time? Blessed is that servant whom his master will find so doing when he comes. Truly, I say to you, he will set him over all his possessions. But if that wicked servant says to himself, ‘My master is delayed,’ and begins to beat his fellow servants and eats and drinks with drunkards, the master of that servant will come on a day when he does not expect him and at an hour he does not know and will cut him in pieces and put him with the hypocrites. In that place there will be weeping and gnashing of teeth.

 

[SabbathBlessings]

Interesting. I find it curious you would put the heavens and earth above mankind.

He created mankind after Himself.

He is going to destroy the heavens and the earth one day.

I pray you will see this one day.

Matthew 24:45-51 (ESV)

“Who then is the faithful and wise servant, whom his master has set over his household, to give them their food at the proper time? Blessed is that servant whom his master will find so doing when he comes. Truly, I say to you, he will set him over all his possessions. But if that wicked servant says to himself, ‘My master is delayed,’ and begins to beat his fellow servants and eats and drinks with drunkards, the master of that servant will come on a day when he does not expect him and at an hour he does not know and will cut him in pieces and put him with the hypocrites. In that place there will be weeping and gnashing of teeth.

I never said any such thing.

I think you completely missed the point. I need to go for now but its been nice chatting with you.

God bless

 

[Nathan@work]

I never said any such thing.

I think you completely missed the point. I need to go for now but its been nice chatting with you.

God bless

I assumed, since you replied with the same kind of statements as before, that it was what you thought. You seem to put a lot of emphasis on Gods creation and law - not on the one thing He made after the image of Himself and actually breathed life into.

I’m sorry if that is a misunderstanding, it is sometimes very difficult to interpret what your saying.

Maybe you can clarify it when you get back.

 

[BobRyan]

You profane the Sabbath when you go up on man-made hewn steps,

Profaning the Sabbath is done by doing those very things which God says not to do on the Sabbath - treating it as common and ordinary as if man "owns it and can do as he wishes" - every Bible scholar on Earth knows that this is what is being referenced in Isaiah 56:6-8 regarding gentiles who either choose to keep from profaning the Sabbath or to go ahead and disregard it altogether.

Nothing there about "man-made hewn steps" that I can see, unless you are saying that those who think they have god-like control of it and can disregard whatever God's Word says - are creating "man-made hewn steps"

It's debatable because I never said you cannot profane it.

well then we do agree - it can be profaned by man.

 

[BobRyan]

If a man does all kinds of wickedness on the day it will not make the day itself unholy. What it does is profane it for that person.

I agree that man does not make God's name unholy by taking His name in vain since God is "God" and cannot be brought down by man - and man cannot make God's Sabbath profane when man treats the Sabbath as a common/ordinary since God's Sabbath is made Holy by God - yet in the case of man and sin man can be guilty of profaning the Sabbath and guilty of taking God's name in vain.

 

[Leaf473]

Earlier in this thread, people were talking about dividing the law into different parts, like ceremonial civil moral.

What is the standard for dividing the law up this way? How was it decided if a particular commandment is moral or ceremonial?

 

[Nathan@work]

Profaning the Sabbath is done by doing those very things which God says not to do on the Sabbath - treating it as common and ordinary as if man "owns it and can do as he wishes" - every Bible scholar on Earth knows that this is what is being referenced in Isaiah 56:6-8 regarding gentiles who either choose to keep from profaning the Sabbath or to go ahead and disregard it altogether.

Nothing there about "man-made hewn steps" that I can see, unless you are saying that those who think they have god-like control of it and can disregard whatever God's Word says - are creating "man-made hewn steps"



well then we do agree - it can be profaned by man.

So do you offer burnt offerings and sacrifices on Gods altar as the passage you speak of says?

 

[Nathan@work]

Earlier in this thread, people were talking about dividing the law into different parts, like ceremonial civil moral.

What is the standard for dividing the law up this way? How was it decided if a particular commandment is moral or ceremonial?

There is none. It’s mans way of interpreting what he wants of God. It’s foolish.

 

[Leaf473]

There is none. It’s mans way of interpreting what he wants of God. It’s foolish.

I'm not aware of a passage in the scriptures that talk about that, either.

When in the past I've asked people who favor keeping some parts of the law of Moses how they decide which parts, the answer is usually something like look for the intent, or it's obvious.

Sometimes I'll bring up the commandment that talks about when you want to use the toilet, take a spade and go outside the camp.

That's usually answered with well, the basic intent is to use modern sewage systems.

Seems like quite a stretch to me, also it requires the individual to understand God's intention.

if we're just going to go with the basic intent of the law of Moses, Jesus summed that up by saying treat other people the way you want to be treated.

Sounds good to me

 

[pescador]

Remember the Sabbath day and keep it holy. Its the very first verse, why would you disregard that?

Also to answer your other posts check out Ezekiel 20:12, Ezekiel 20:20, Exodus 31:13-17 I did not add anything to God's Word.

Isaiah 66:23

Again, here is that passage in its entirety, “Remember the Sabbath day to set it apart as holy. For six days you may labor and do all your work, but the seventh day is a Sabbath to the Lord your God; on it you shall not do any work, you, or your son, or your daughter, or your male servant, or your female servant, or your cattle, or the resident foreigner who is in your gates. For in six days the Lord made the heavens and the earth and the sea and all that is in them, and he rested on the seventh day; therefore the Lord blessed the Sabbath day and set it apart as holy."

The Sabbath is about a day of rest. God rested on the seventh day and we are to do the same. You can add anything you want to that but it's not scriptural.

 

[pescador]

Remember the Sabbath day and keep it holy. Its the very first verse, why would you disregard that?

Also to answer your other posts check out Ezekiel 20:12, Ezekiel 20:20, Exodus 31:13-17 I did not add anything to God's Word.

Isaiah 66:23

It's interesting to me that the verses that you chose are all about doing work on the Sabbath, which is what I have been saying all along.

 

[SabbathBlessings]

Again, here is that passage in its entirety, “Remember the Sabbath day to set it apart as holy. For six days you may labor and do all your work, but the seventh day is a Sabbath to the Lord your God; on it you shall not do any work, you, or your son, or your daughter, or your male servant, or your female servant, or your cattle, or the resident foreigner who is in your gates. For in six days the Lord made the heavens and the earth and the sea and all that is in them, and he rested on the seventh day; therefore the Lord blessed the Sabbath day and set it apart as holy."

The Sabbath is about a day of rest. God rested on the seventh day and we are to do the same. You can add anything you want to that but it's not scriptural.

Hi there,

You originally left out the very first sentence of the 4th commandment and now accusing me of changing God's Words. That carries a heavy consequence in the Bible and not one I take lightly.

This is from the KJV. God both spoke and wrote these Words:

Exodus 20:8 “Remember the Sabbath day, to keep it holy. 9 Six days you shall labor and do all your work, 10 but the seventh day is the Sabbath of the Lord your God. In it you shall do no work: you, nor your son, nor your daughter, nor your male servant, nor your female servant, nor your cattle, nor your stranger who is within your gates. 11 For in six days the Lord made the heavens and the earth, the sea, and all that is in them, and rested the seventh day. Therefore the Lord blessed the Sabbath day and hallowed it.

Yes, rest is part of the Sabbath commandment, not to do any work, but we are also told to keep it Holy. These are not my words, but God's.