Rejoice vs. Mourning

doomsayer2

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Ok,really a simple question...are we as N.T. believers to do as Paul said in 1stThess.-5:16..."Rejoice always." And yes that is a two word verse,the shortest in the entire bible along with "Jesus wept",which is ironic,as Christ Himself didn't always follow paul's admonition.
Or are we to still adhere to Old covenant ways,such as Ecclesiastes-7:3...
"Sorrow is better than laughter,for by a sad countenance the heart is made better."
Or how about Psalms-34:18..."The Lord is near to those of a broken heart,and saves such as have a contrite spirit."
Psalms-51:17..."The sacrifices of God are a broken spirit;a broken and contrite heart O God,you will not despise."
Some might say this is just another contradiction in scriptures. But I think maybe it's just a matter of translation and wording,such as the use of "always",similar to "without ceasing" as in praying. Obviously you can do neither all of the time,and only an insane fool would be shouting for joy at a funeral procession,or upon hearing of severe physical suffering a close friend is enduring.
So my personal take is that it is vital to at least have a humbled heart before God,and be broken hearted over our sin,depending on how major it is. And then to rejoice when we can walk in victory with God. I guess the confusion comes when these are out of balance,and why so many professing believers suffer from mental disorders which leave them almost permanent state of melancholy and apathy. I suppose the $77,000 question is why exactly God permits these diseases in some and not others? But I would at least like to focus on the original question and settle it first if possible.
Thanks-
D.B.
 
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Andrea411

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Ok,really a simple question...are we as N.T. believers to do as Paul said in 1stThess.-5:16..."Rejoice always." And yes that is a two word verse,the shortest in the entire bible along with "Jesus wept",which is ironic,as Christ Himself didn't always follow paul's admonition.
Or are we to still adhere to Old covenant ways,such as Ecclesiastes-7:3...
"Sorrow is better than laughter,for by a sad countenance the heart is made better."
Or how about Psalms-34:18..."The Lord is near to those of a broken heart,and saves such as have a contrite spirit."
Psalms-51:17..."The sacrifices of God are a broken spirit;a broken and contrite heart O God,you will not despise."
Some might say this is just another contradiction in scriptures. But I think maybe it's just a matter of translation and wording,such as the use of "always",similar to "without ceasing" as in praying. Obviously you can do neither all of the time,and only an insane fool would be shouting for joy at a funeral procession,or upon hearing of severe physical suffering a close friend is enduring.
So my personal take is that it is vital to at least have a humbled heart before God,and be broken hearted over our sin,depending on how major it is. And then to rejoice when we can walk in victory with God. I guess the confusion comes when these are out of balance,and why so many professing believers suffer from mental disorders which leave them almost permanent state of melancholy and apathy. I suppose the $77,000 question is why exactly God permits these diseases in some and not others? But I would at least like to focus on the original question and settle it first if possible.
Thanks-
D.B.

First change your name, then sit - close your eyes and think on Jesus..... wrap yourself in His righteousness, for He is our righteousness... then relax, smile, remember the joy of the Lord is your strength.... take a breath.... and then another, stop over thinking it and let the Holy Spirit do His work in your life.... He was sent as your Comforter to stick closer then a brother, Jesus calls you "friend" ..... the one who condemns is Satan. You have been set free... enjoy it.
 
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Romans 14:8

for if we live, we live for the Lord, or if we die, we die for the Lord; therefore whether we live or die, we are the Lord's.

I guess the confusion comes when these are out of balance
Well, that could be... but also "balance" hints at knowing the right methods to deserve perfect health. Balance is important, but I doubt there is a "Right" way that will guarantee anything. We see smokers live to 100, and vegans get heart attacks while they're out running.

Life is not very predictable or controllable. And faith needs to stay in that tenous point of communication with God. Not reliance on methodology, but reliance on Him.
 
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rebornfree

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The OP posed a really good question, and had me thinking for a while.

The gospels clearly show that Jesus had compassion for suffering people, and He showed emotion Himself. When we look at Genesis Ch 1 and see what God had created for us to enjoy, and then look at the world as it is today I am not surprised that people have mental health problems, broken lives etc.

I wonder if we can have both sadness, when going through times of bereavement and loss, but at the same time know an underlying joy in being saved and having the hope of Heaven. IOW are rejoicing and mourning necessarily contradictory? Your example of a funeral is a case in point. If the deceased was a Christian we can rejoice that they are now with the Lord, and that Jesus won victory over death, but also feel sadness for the loss of the loved one.
 
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Matjohluk

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Hi doomsayer2,

Ok, really a simple question...is we as N.T. believers to do as Paul said in 1stThess.-5:16..."Rejoice always." And yes that is a two word verse, the shortest in the entire bible along with "Jesus wept", which is ironic, as Christ Himself didn't always follow Paul’s admonition.

(1) Our Messiah’s disciples for the past 2000 years have suffered difficulties from the outside and inside of the Body of Christ, we are warned that the day of “afflictions and distress” (1 Thess. 3:2-3) are here, and knowing that we need to remember that He is comforting us at that very moment, and we need to rejoice in it, because HE loves us.

(2) We also need to be aware that if we live Godly lives then we will be persecuted (2 Tim. 3:12). And our Lord Jesus Christ warned His disciples, us, that we will experience the same type of rejection that he had experienced (John 5:18-21). Many of us do get downcast when we are persecuted, but we are told that we should “rejoice and be glad of it” seeing that we have considered to suffer like our Yeshua, our Messiah.

(3) Like the Thessalonians many of us need to face the fact that we are not living as we should as believers of our Lord Jesus Christ, and we are “unruly” and we need to be warned about our behaviour. There are many “faint-hearted” and “weak” (stony and thorny Christians) who need “comforting”, to be treated with “patience”, and upheld in love by the mature 30-fold, 60-fold and 100-fold believers responding to their individual’s needs. Some Christians try to get revenge “evil for evil” (1 Thess.5:14-15), which isn’t our task for revenge, because it’s our Messiah’s revenge.

(4) Regardless of those difficulties (1 Thess. 3:2-3) we may experience, we always “have the grounds for rejoicing”, and we are told that our joy is not based on circumstances but on our growing awareness of our Messiah and our future of eternal life.


Or are we to still adhere to Old covenant ways, such as Ecclesiastes-7:3...
"Sorrow is better than laughter, for by a sad countenance the heart is made better."
Or how about Psalms-34:18..."The Lord is near to those of a broken heart, and saves such as have a contrite spirit."


(5) Ecclesiastes 7:2-4 expands upon the idea of “death” in verse 1, and we learn more about the meaning of life in the “house of mourning” than in the “house of feasting” were laughter if so loud that it sometimes sounds like fools and the unwise. We know that He hears us (v6), because “the Lord is near” and this gives us great comfort of knowing HE cares for us, which will heal any broken-heart (Psa. 34:17-19)

Psalms-51:17..."The sacrifices of God are a broken spirit; a broken and contrite heart O God, you will not despise."
Some might say this is just another contradiction in scriptures. But I think maybe it's just a matter of translation and wording, such as the use of "always", similar to "without ceasing" as in praying. Obviously you can do neither all of the time, and only an insane fool would be shouting for joy at a funeral procession, or upon hearing of severe physical suffering a close friend is enduring.


(6) In v16, “you do not desire sacrifice”, which means that we find pleasure in our Messiah’s pleasure, which isn’t in the animal sacrifice, but in the restoration of a person, and His pleasure is in those people who come to Him in obedience. Any action that isn’t accompanied by a “contrite heart” is not acceptable to our Messiah. And it all comes down to our Messiah’s pleasure in us, when we humble ourselves before Him, and these sacrifices, were a source of “JOY”!

So my personal take is that it is vital to at least have a humbled heart before God, and be broken hearted over our sin, depending on how major it is. And then to rejoice when we can walk in victory with God. I guess the confusion comes when these are out of balance, and why so many professing believers suffer from mental disorders which leave them almost permanent state of melancholy and apathy.

(7) The greatest sacrifice for any Christian is to admit and confess, forgive and repent their sin and not be broken-hearted over their sin. We need to be able to say that we are sorry for our sin through our “confession”, to forgive those who were part of our sin through hurt and offence and to ask for forgiveness from those people who we sinned against through hurt and offence. Then we are able to use God’s Word expressing our “repentance”! When our “house is empty, swept, and put in order” (Luke 11:24-26) then any form of mental disorder, anxiety, depression can dwell within our “house” placing us into a permanent state of melancholy and apathy.

(8) The only way to overcome our “empty house” and at the same time we need to realise that our “Lord resist the proud and gives grace to the humble” (James 4:6), and this is why many suffer unnecessarily. Our suffering comes from pain and thinking too much, and not enough action. When we fill our house with God’s Word and it’s put it into action, then mental disorder, anxiety and depression will depart leaving no ground for melancholy and apathy.

(9) Far too many Christians are still floundering at wayside, stony and thorny levels because of their “empty, swept and put in order house” that is open to sin and demonisation. This is so because they have only removed the top layer of dirt (simple sin), and not the deep-down garbage that feeds the rats, the carnal sin. As we go deeper into the carpet pile, and into our heart we will find much sin buried deep down within our heart---much unforgiveness. This is where the heavy work begins by cleansing our hands and purifying our heart. When we begin to confess our sins, and forgive by His Word, then our “house” will begin to move from “EMPTY” to “FULL”, which would be finalised by “REPENTANCE”. Once this is done, then our “house” will definitely be placed in order that we will be able to resist Satan and his forces with power and authority. When all of this is done, then only then, will we be able to draw near and submit to Him, and finally find the humility we desperately search for (James 4:7-10).

(10) After these steps are taken, and we reach our “Freedom in Christ”, then there will be no place for mental disorders or any other spiritual infirmity.

I suppose the $77,000 question is why exactly God permits these diseases in some and not others? But I would at least like to focus on the original question and settle it first if possible.
Thanks-


(11) Sorry but our Lord Jesus Christ doesn’t permit disease, we allow it to happen, because we don’t progress through the six levels of our heart soil and when new born-again Christians are brought into the fold they are not taken any further and remain wayside, stony and thorny, and fail to move on to maturity (30-fold, 60-fold and 100-fold believers) through confession of sin, forgiveness of sin, and repentance.
 
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