Refuting OSAS in jesus name (2)

[nobdysfool]

this is what i was responding to you saying i was butting into a conversation that was clearly to me?
Im going to be frank your intentionally trying to get me upset.
im not just amassed how you keep going in circles

No I am not purposely trying to upset you. I am pointing out that you started taking me to task for something that was not directed at you, had nothing to do with you, and was not about you. Then you inserted something from another conversation and attributed it to me. When I pointed out that I had never said that, and asked you to provide proof of me or anyone else ever saying that (your words: "you cannot not have faith and be a christian"), then you started ripping me basically for speaking to FG2 without your permission, or something. I'm not even sure what your issue was at that point. But you were sure going to give me grief for it. You want to know why I said what I said to you? You got what you were giving.

what you said was not only wrong but very rude.
i pray you can find it in your heart to forgive what ever i have done to make you so upset at me? I have already forgiven you
and feel bad even attempting to correct you but trully its only to clear my name which isnt doing any good.
i wont go any further then this

It was neither wrong, nor rude. It was truth. You started something and didn't like it when it came back on you. I'm not upset with you. I just refuse to be misrepresented and chewed out for nothing. You've certainly proven that you are not good at taking a joke, even when it wasn't directed at you.

 

[FreeGrace2]

show me one

Every one that is presented as support for loss of salvation.

 

[FreeGrace2]

Just tell me already LOL

I already did. Which apparently is why it was dodged.

 

[FreeGrace2]

gift of eternal life is not irrevocable isn't even in the BIBLE

Yes it is. Eternal life is a gift of God, which you've acknowledged. And God's gifts are irrevocable, which you've also acknowledged. So, eternal life, a gift of God, IS IRREVOCABLE.

OK you are MIXING versus together to create something else or you've just said it to many times lol?

lol is right!! Here's the logic: If A = B, and B = C, THEN A = C
Rom 6:23 eternal life (A) is a gift of God (B).
Rom 11:29 God's gifts (B) are irrevocable {C}.

Therefore, eternal life (A) is irrevocable {C}.

Romans 11;29 for the gifts and calling of GOD are with out repentance!
what does repentance mean again? hhmm

Irrevocable. I don't recall any explanation from your posts about what "without repentance" means.

God doesn't regret giving anything to us or calling us to him!

So you're admitting that your understanding is better than the Greek scholars who translated the NASB? Wow.

This doesn't say guaranteed inheritance being irrevocable?
Gifts from GOD according to the bible would be our talent the holy ghost or just his Love being a gift , even his grace
but not eternal life until you receive it then it is a gift, until then it is a promise or hoped for gift.

All this is, is a flat denial of truth. Amazingly so.

 

[FreeGrace2]

Without Grace, we'd be lost. Where's the Grace in all this?

That's the huge problem for the conditional security types. They have no grasp of grace at all.

We are saved by grace, and kep by that same grace.

We don't earn or deserve salvation in the first place, so there is NOTHING we can do to earn or deserve loss of salvation.

Grace goes both ways. Or neither way. If they accept that we are saved by grace, then they only contradict themselves to suggest that there's anything that we can do to lose our grace based salvation.

 

[FreeGrace2]

I try to base what the BIBLE defines as Grace and not Mans traditional teachings of it is.

How about this, since this claim has been said before. Please define what the Bible means about grace and what "man's traditional teachings" are, so we actually understand your statement.

As it is, we have no idea what is meant by your statement.

 

[FreeGrace2]

it is obviously merited!
because its called FAVOR

Where does one get the notion that "favor" means merited??

gen 6:8
But Noah found grace H2580 in the eyes of the LORD.
what was the difference between all that died in the flood and Noah?

lol. It was grace. He earned NOTHING. And there are no verses that support your claims.

 

[FreeGrace2]

FG2 said:
The unwillingness to simply accept the clear and obvious truth that eternal life, a gift of God, is irrevocable is astounding to observe!!

What is astounding is those who denial the clarity of the fact that eternal lif3, a gift of God, is irrevocable.

But....but....but....we have to WORK for it!

Grace refutes your false claim.

it wouldn't be right to accept such a great gift and not have to do something in return to deserve it! Right?

What does one do to deserve a birthday present or a Christmas present? NOTHING.

 

[EmSw]

Yes it is. Eternal life is a gift of God, which you've acknowledged. And God's gifts are irrevocable, which you've also acknowledged. So, eternal life, a gift of God, IS IRREVOCABLE.

FG2, what is the assigned place of unbelievers? Is eternal life their assigned place?

Luke 12: -
45 But if that slave says in his heart, ‘My master will be a long time in coming,’ and begins to beat the slaves, both men and women, and to eat and drink and get drunk;
46 the master of that slave will come on a day when he does not expect him and at an hour he does not know, and will cut him in pieces, and assign him a place with the unbelievers.

Elsewhere -

Matthew 24 -
48 But if that evil slave says in his heart, ‘My master is not coming for a long time,’
49 and begins to beat his fellow slaves and eat and drink with drunkards;
50 the master of that slave will come on a day when he does not expect him and at an hour which he does not know,
51 and will cut him in pieces and assign him a place with the hypocrites; in that place there will be weeping and gnashing of teeth.

So much for eternal life being irrevocable. Being an evil servant, not expecting the Lord's return, beating men and women, and getting drunk will revoke eternal life.

 

[FreeGrace2]

FG2, what is the assigned place of unbelievers? Is eternal life their assigned place?

When the Bible speaks of "unbelievers", it means those who never believed. Those who have believed have been given the free gift of eternal life (Rom 6:23) and that gift is irrevocable (Rom 11:29).

So much for eternal life being irrevocable.

Neither passage presented said anything about eternal life being revoked.

Being an evil servant, not expecting the Lord's return, beating men and women, and getting drunk will revoke eternal life.

Nope. Neither passage said that.

Please exlain to me exactly what Paul meant by 'gift' in Rom 11:29. And show me the verse where he actually defined the gift that he was referring to in 11:29. Thanks.

 

[EmSw]

When the Bible speaks of "unbelievers", it means those who never believed. Those who have believed have been given the free gift of eternal life (Rom 6:23) and that gift is irrevocable (Rom 11:29).

I figured you wouldn't address the passages I gave.

 

[FreeGrace2]

I figured you wouldn't address the passages I gave.

I explained it. Your figuring is wrong.

 

[EmSw]

I explained it. Your figuring is wrong.

Let's try again.

Matthew 24 -
48 But if that evil slave says in his heart, ‘My master is not coming for a long time,’
49 and begins to beat his fellow slaves and eat and drink with drunkards;
50 the master of that slave will come on a day when he does not expect him and at an hour which he does not know,
51 and will cut him in pieces and assign him a place with the hypocrites; in that place there will be weeping and gnashing of teeth.

Who would be the evil slave?
Why does he beat his fellow slaves?
Why does he drink with drunkards?
Why does he not expect his master to return?
What is cut him in pieces?
What is assign him a place with hypocrites and unbelievers?
What is the place of hypocrites and unbelievers?
What is weeping and gnashing of teeth?

Answer these questions and you will have explained it?

 

[FreeGrace2]

Let's try again.

Matthew 24 -
48 But if that evil slave says in his heart, ‘My master is not coming for a long time,’
49 and begins to beat his fellow slaves and eat and drink with drunkards;
50 the master of that slave will come on a day when he does not expect him and at an hour which he does not know,
51 and will cut him in pieces and assign him a place with the hypocrites; in that place there will be weeping and gnashing of teeth.

Who would be the evil slave?

This is not an introduction of a different servant, but a change in perspective by the one who had been doing well: he thought his master had delayed his coming.

Why does he beat his fellow slaves?

The parable says he was evil. I would add, and a jerk.

Why does he drink with drunkards?

He likes liquor.

Why does he not expect his master to return?

He thought his master wasn't coming when he indicated.

What is cut him in pieces?

Certainly not literal. It's figurative hyperbole applied to unfaithful believers. Most naturally would refer to a strong verbal rebuke.

What is assign him a place with hypocrites and unbelievers?

Even believers can be hypocrites, per Matt 7:5, Gal 2:13, 1 Pet 2:1-2. The meaning of "unbelievers" means "the unfaithful".

What is the place of hypocrites and unbelievers?

Not specified, but would involve loss of certain privileges an joys associated with ruling in the kingdom.

What is weeping and gnashing of teeth?

An oriental expression, conveying intense emotion and signifies profound regret.

Answer these questions and you will have explained it?

Done. And we are free to disagree about it.