Redemption of those in jail

[Evie1980]

The Bali 9 were a group of people who decided to smuggle drugs out of Bali to Australia. They got caught on the Indonesian side of things which means, for some, they have the death penalty. It was a big thing 5 years ago and it still is. All of them really did it for the money aspect.

Anyway I was just checking out the Australian papers today about some of them have turned to faith. I thought it was worth a read for you all.
God help us: Bali Nine pray

Blessings

 

[Sketcher]

Good, some of them have turned to God.

 

[Blank123]

thanks for sharing

 

[Lucis]

Where I live people sometimes say that nothing is as bad that it isn't good for something.

 

[Evie1980]

Where I live people sometimes say that nothing is as bad that it isn't good for something.

I like that saying! I think that I will have to remember it.

 

[Windmill]

I'm a smidgen radical, but I'd release most prisoneers from prisons and put into motion huge programmes to help criminals instead of putting them in jail.

Let alone the death penalty.

Disgusting.

 

[Evie1980]

I'm a smidgen radical, but I'd release most prisoneers from prisons and put into motion huge programmes to help criminals instead of putting them in jail.

Let alone the death penalty.

Disgusting.

well they broke Indonesian laws so unfortunately they will receive the death penalty as per their law not ours. Asian countries have no sympathy for drugs and drug trafficking.

 

[Sketcher]

I'm a smidgen radical, but I'd release most prisoneers from prisons and put into motion huge programmes to help criminals instead of putting them in jail.

Let alone the death penalty.

Disgusting.

It all sounds like a good idea until they victimize someone close to you.

 

[ProAntiRevolution]

It all sounds like a good idea until they victimize someone close to you.

You do realize that in the US the vast majority of people in prisons are there for minor drug offenses and minor property crimes. No, we shouldn't turn a blind eye to grand theft auto, but at the same time we ignore the reality that prisons are often responsible for creating violent criminals. The American solution of sending everyone to jail, for everything, needs to be rethought. Obviously it isn't working; the US has the highest crime rates of any country in the western world. The social cost is huge. On average we spend more than $30,000 per person, per year, to keep people in jail. If even a part of that money were ear marked for helping to create economic opportunities within the law for disenfrancshed men we'd have a lot less property crime. Not to mention that minor, low dollar property crimes result in harsh sentences. Whereas people that steal millions of dollars get a stint in club fed for a couple years and then it's back to the white collar world. While the blue collar felon is often ground down even out of that lifestyle after jail. The personal cost of ruined lives over minor property issues really can't be measured in dollar values.
There are criminals that need to be separated from soceity, however in any given prison you're much more likely to run across a guy that stole a TV, or was smoking pot, than a violent killer or rapist.

 

[Sketcher]

You do realize that in the US the vast majority of people in prisons are there for minor drug offenses and minor property crimes.

And you do realize that she didn't bother to differentiate between those kinds of people and the bigger time criminals, right?

 

[Trashionista]

You do realize that in the US the vast majority of people in prisons are there for minor drug offenses and minor property crimes. No, we shouldn't turn a blind eye to grand theft auto, but at the same time we ignore the reality that prisons are often responsible for creating violent criminals. The American solution of sending everyone to jail, for everything, needs to be rethought. Obviously it isn't working; the US has the highest crime rates of any country in the western world. The social cost is huge. On average we spend more than $30,000 per person, per year, to keep people in jail. If even a part of that money were ear marked for helping to create economic opportunities within the law for disenfrancshed men we'd have a lot less property crime. Not to mention that minor, low dollar property crimes result in harsh sentences. Whereas people that steal millions of dollars get a stint in club fed for a couple years and then it's back to the white collar world. While the blue collar felon is often ground down even out of that lifestyle after jail. The personal cost of ruined lives over minor property issues really can't be measured in dollar values.
There are criminals that need to be separated from soceity, however in any given prison you're much more likely to run across a guy that stole a TV, or was smoking pot, than a violent killer or rapist.

This.

Personally, though I would never do drugs, I really believe if you just legalize drugs, it takes away the likelihood of cartels profitting of it, or an underground black market. The War on Drugs has generally been completely mishandled.

At the same time, these Brokedown Palace/Bridget Jones in Thailand stories always seem a little... off to me.

 

[CoachR64]

it's easy to find God in your darkest moments, especially when you are convinced that God is the way to solve your problems. It's like the old saying, "there are no athiest in foxholes."

I am glad they found Christ. Yet they still have to pay the consequences of their past. Even though we are forgiven, our pasts still have consequences and we must accept those.

I have a friend that was in jail for murder. He found a saving relationship with Jesus Christ and now that he is out, he leads a ministry going into prisons to preach the word. Yet he still has to pay the consequences associated with his actions, including having to list he is a convicted felon on job applications and such.

My problem with releasing criminals because "we are supposed to forgive" is the often the most heinous crimes are committed by those who are already convicted felons. I think the prison system is totally outdated. If a convict is deemed able to eventually be returned to society, the focus should be on counseling, education, and training so they can be a productive member of society when released. If they are deemed unworthy to be released due to the nature of the crime, don't waste the space and funds and just put them to death. As it is, prisons are currently awesome at doing one thing: producing criminals who are harder, colder, and better connected to gangs.

Coach

 

[ProAntiRevolution]

And you do realize that she didn't bother to differentiate between those kinds of people and the bigger time criminals, right?

Let's apply some critical thinking here. She said:
"I'm a smidgen radical, but I'd release most prisoneers from prisons and put into motion huge programmes to help criminals instead of putting them in jail."

Focus on the phrase "most criminals" for a moment. That denotes that there is indeed a separate of classes of criminals, and that she would not release all criminals. While she was not specific, if we use our critical thinking we would come to the conclusion that violent criminals would be the ones excluded by the use of the phrase "most criminals." You could nit pick it I suppose, but a person of average intelligence should be able to conclude that she was separating property criminals from murders and rapists.

 

[ProAntiRevolution]

it's easy to find God in your darkest moments, especially when you are convinced that God is the way to solve your problems. It's like the old saying, "there are no athiest in foxholes."

I am glad they found Christ. Yet they still have to pay the consequences of their past. Even though we are forgiven, our pasts still have consequences and we must accept those.

I have a friend that was in jail for murder. He found a saving relationship with Jesus Christ and now that he is out, he leads a ministry going into prisons to preach the word. Yet he still has to pay the consequences associated with his actions, including having to list he is a convicted felon on job applications and such.

My problem with releasing criminals because "we are supposed to forgive" is the often the most heinous crimes are committed by those who are already convicted felons. I think the prison system is totally outdated. If a convict is deemed able to eventually be returned to society, the focus should be on counseling, education, and training so they can be a productive member of society when released. If they are deemed unworthy to be released due to the nature of the crime, don't waste the space and funds and just put them to death. As it is, prisons are currently awesome at doing one thing: producing criminals who are harder, colder, and better connected to gangs.

Coach

Here's the thing, the vast majority of people aren't in jail for murder, rape, or offenses of that kind. In fact a huge part of the problem is we treat people that write some bad checks the same way we treat people that commit murder. When people talk about criminal recidivism they often ignore the fact that our justice system manufactors violent criminals. Taking a recent news story: Joe Blow had no criminal history whatsoever, lost his job and ended up being sentenced to 16 months for failure to pay child support. Now the logic of that is idiotic in and of itself, but that's another topic. While in prison Joe was forced to join the local chaper of the Aryan Brotherhood after weeks of being assualted by black inmates. Another unpleasant reality in American prisons is the racial and gang balkanization that is allowed to go on. So here we've taken a man that has no criminal history and stuck him in an envirnoment with violent predators, and now he's gone from no criminal history to being a member of a violent prison gang. Now Joe must commit violent criminal actions in order to maintain the protection the AB offers. The man in the story ended up having an additional 3 years added to his sentence in relation to gang fights he was involved in while in prison. Obviously had he never been stuck in prison it never would have happened. The other reality is that even after Joe was released he had to continue taking orders from the AB. If he didn't there was every chance another member on the outside would kill him. So Joe now ends up trafficking in meth to economically support the Aryan Brotherhood, and unsurprisingly, more trips to jail. Oh, and I don't know if it makes it better, but upon appeal it was ruled that he was indeed not willfully refusing to pay child support and should never have been to prison in the first place.
That's often the reality of prison: the inmate goes in for a minor nonviolent offense, is subjected to life where rape and extreme violence are a part of every day existence, and comes out a violent criminal himself. In addition to that, even though his sentence is long served we allow employers, banks, landlords, and everyone else to use that served sentence as a means to further disenfranchise the ex con. So we demand he go "straight" and yet throw up every roadblock we can to ensure that process will be as difficult as possible.
The entire criminal justice system needs to be reworked from the ground up, and the concept of prison needs to be changed drastically.

 

[CoachR64]

I've got a better idea... don't commit a crime to begin with and you don't have to worry about all the perils of prison life.

Coach

 

[Sketcher]

Let's apply some critical thinking here. She said:
"I'm a smidgen radical, but I'd release most prisoneers from prisons and put into motion huge programmes to help criminals instead of putting them in jail."

Focus on the phrase "most criminals" for a moment. That denotes that there is indeed a separate of classes of criminals, and that she would not release all criminals. While she was not specific, if we use our critical thinking we would come to the conclusion that violent criminals would be the ones excluded by the use of the phrase "most criminals." You could nit pick it I suppose, but a person of average intelligence should be able to conclude that she was separating property criminals from murders and rapists.

You could do that if you wanted to project what you wanted her to say on her post. The fact is, that she's in a different country, and that she didn't specify which criminals she would release, and which she would not.