Reading Augustine

[JM]

I've been reading a lot of Augustine the last while. With a quick search I found the following article and thought, perhaps, someone else maybe interested in reading it.

Regarding St. Augustine, Luther wrote: Augustine has sometimes erred and is not to be trusted. Although good and holy, he was
yet lacking in the true faith, as well as the other fathers...But when the door was opended for
me in Paul, so that I understood what justification by faith is, it was all over with Augustine.
(Luther's Works 54, 49)

It was Augustine's view that the law...if the Holy Spirit assists, the works of the law do
justify...I reply by saying "No".
(Luther's Works 54, 10)

Well, why would Luther say Augustine erred by not teaching sola fide? Every RP knows that St.
Augustine was a Protestant, right? Well, before we say that, let's take a look at what St. Augustine has written:

When you shall have been baptized, keep to a good life in the commandments of God so that you may preserve your baptism to the very end. I do not tell you that you will live here without sin, but they are venial sins which this life is never without. Baptism was instituted forall sins. For light sins, without which we cannot live, prayer was instituted. . . . But do notcommit those sins on account of which you would have to be separated from the body ofChrist. Perish the thought! For those whom you see doing penance have committed crimes, either adultery or some other enormities. That is why they are doing penance. If their sinswere light, daily prayer would suffice to blot them out. . . . In the Church, therefore, there
are three ways in which sins are forgiven: in baptisms, in prayer, and in the greater humility of
penance
(St. Augustine, Sermon to Catechumens on the Creed 7:15, 8:16).

http://ic.net/~erasmus/RAZ474.HTM

 

[arunma]

Heh, I don't think for a minute that Saint Augustine was a "Protestant" in any sense of the word. To be sure, Saint Augustine was a Catholic. That said, he lived in a time when there wasn't any denominational division in the church. Besides that, the Catholic Church wasn't always the semi-biblical organization that it currently is. Roman Catholicism seems to have evolved out of the original church, as did most of our denominations. There was a time when they taught many great Biblical truths.

It's important for us to not read Augustine "this side of the Reformation." In his day, such things as the abuse of indulgances, papal tyrrany, church/state politics, and the other things that led to the Reformation had not yet happened. We know that sin is forgiven by repentance and faith in Jesus Christ. In a way, it could be said that baptism, prayer, and pennance effect this forgiveness, since they all (ideally) lead to repentance. Again, let us not read Augustine as if he lived in the sixteenth century.

 

[cygnusx1]

Heh, I don't think for a minute that Saint Augustine was a "Protestant" in any sense of the word. To be sure, Saint Augustine was a Catholic. That said, he lived in a time when there wasn't any denominational division in the church. Besides that, the Catholic Church wasn't always the semi-biblical organization that it currently is. Roman Catholicism seems to have evolved out of the original church, as did most of our denominations. There was a time when they taught many great Biblical truths.

It's important for us to not read Augustine "this side of the Reformation." In his day, such things as the abuse of indulgances, papal tyrrany, church/state politics, and the other things that led to the Reformation had not yet happened. We know that sin is forgiven by repentance and faith in Jesus Christ. In a way, it could be said that baptism, prayer, and pennance effect this forgiveness, since they all (ideally) lead to repentance. Again, let us not read Augustine as if he lived in the sixteenth century.

well said bro !!

 

[Rick Otto]

Agreed.