Perhaps I misunderstood you. What point were you making?Well, yes. That hardly changes the point though.
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Perhaps I misunderstood you. What point were you making?Well, yes. That hardly changes the point though.
Perhaps I misunderstood you. What point were you making?
A larger impact on what?
History....isn't that your whole point about lynching? Whatever you think lynching had an effect on.
Ok, what you seem to be saying is that you don't think the history of slavery in the US or the other examples of mistreatment of one ethnic group by another has any relevance in the present.
I can't think of any example where this idea would be true.
If you are right, then you might have missed a career as an international peacemaker - you could simply go in and tell the Tamils, or the IRA or any other group agrieved by some past event that it simply doesn't matter anymore, and they should forget about it.
Then you are referencing current violence within the black community - I don't see what the link to what the rest of what you are saying is.
It has the same relevance as all other history.
Lol the troubles in Ireland ended in 1998. Basically every Irish person over 30 will remember living through it.
Redlining was outlawed in 1968 (?) and even then, one would have had to have been old enough to buy a house to really remember it. Basically if you're not a black person older than 70 you probably don't remember a time when the law could specifically discriminate against you.
.you seem to think the past is a valid reason to be racist today,
is it a valid reason? For another decade? Two decades? Half a century?
How so?
We're in the online age where people have lost all sense of proportion....one act of violence by one person is somehow comparable to centuries of enslavement and violence towards a huge number of people....
Do you truly, honestly think this whole issue, wherever it happens, can be reduced to such a basic notion?
Yes it can. If you are going to hold a grudge against a certain group of people who probably had NOTHING to do with the injustices of the past to people you don't know and injustices you never experienced, then we have a right to know how long.
At some point you have to let it go. Especially when neither you nor the people of today had anything to do with it. So how long do we have a right to hold a grudge over a group of people for
I'm not talkin' about all the points you've made throughout the entire thread, I'm talking about the specific point that I commented on when you spoke of the disproportionate number of black people in prison. If you were suggesting this disproportionate number is based off of injustice I our justice system, my point stands, if you meant something else, please explain.You could go back through the posts - I don’t want to type it all again.
I'm not talkin' about all the points you've made throughout the entire thread, I'm talking about the specific point that I commented on when you spoke of the disproportionate number of black people in prison. If you were suggesting this disproportionate number is based off of injustice I our justice system, my point stands, if you meant something else, please explain.
Well, for a couple the idea that one act of violence by one person is somehow comparable to centuries of enslavement and violence towards a huge number of people based on their origin/ethnicity, and everything that came out of that. And the conflation of ‘racism’, i.e something about race, with things people feel about things that actually happened, and have relevance today.
If I never went through any of that stuff, but my grandparents and ancestors did, I might have a response to it but whatever response I might have would NOT be hostility towards people who simply looked like my ancestors oppressors, but had nothing to do with oppressing themOne of the things that makes us human is the ability to picture scenarios outside of our experience and empathise with the experiences of others. If, for example, whatever ethnic group you originate from had been forcibly taken en masse to another country, enslaved there for years under brutal conditions, finally granted freedom and told to be grateful about it, to then have to spend decades being treated as second class citizens by many - really, you would have no response to that? You'd just shrug it off? Nothing? You would simply accept that 'oh well, these things happen?'
You don't think an individual has a right to hold a racist view over something that happened to their ancestor, but you do believe a group of people have a right to be racist over what a group of people did to their ancestors? Even though the current group had nothing to do with it?
I see so numbers matter, not time or people.
How about the Jews do they have a right still to dislike Germans and perhaps want to discriminate against them? What about the Japanese?
At what point do you get to say, it's time to let that go and move on from something that had nothing to do with you?
If I never went through any of that stuff, but my grandparents and ancestors did, I might have a response to it but whatever response I might have would NOT be hostility towards people who simply looked like my ancestors oppressors, but had nothing to do with oppressing them
We aren't calling everything racist, only that which we see as racist.It’s you guys who keep calling everything racist, not me.
No, it's like some obsession, trying to weed out racism where we see it.As in the OP, it seems like some sort of obsession, trying to weed out any person who isn’t white doing something ‘racist’.
There is an old saying;What’s driving it?
Relevant to what? All history is just one amorphous mass with no difference or distinction?
A good example - firstly, things don't just 'end' just like that, an agreement is signed and, abracadabra, it all goes away. More importantly, if you were to focus only on that time period, the few decades of the 'troubles' leading up to the 1998 agreement, you would have a completely skewed impression of the whole situation, ignoring the historical events which the more recent conflict stemmed from, going back to the 1600s. More than 80% of the casualties in the period you refer to were British civilians and military personel. As shoud be obvious, you can't expect to have any kind of realistic appreciation of any situation of this sort by simply dividing history up into neat chunks based on some arbitrary notion.
I can't make any sense of this - do you think that each generation starts with some sort of memory wipe, or something like that?
That whatever their parents or grandparents experience, good or bad, whatever it might be, has no relevance at all?
No, not at all. If you actually read what I am saying rather than re-working it in your own terms, you would see that is not what I am saying.
One of the things that makes us human is the ability to picture scenarios outside of our experience and empathise with the experiences of others. If, for example, whatever ethnic group you originate from had been forcibly taken en masse to another country, enslaved there for years under brutal conditions, finally granted freedom and told to be grateful about it, to then have to spend decades being treated as second class citizens by many - really, you would have no response to that? You'd just shrug it off? Nothing? You would simply accept that 'oh well, these things happen?'
Your own argument about it all being to do with behaviour kind of defeats your accusation that the kind of thing the OP addresses is racism.
People get or have got all kinds of ideas based on ethnicity - this or that ethnic group is ____ (fill in the blank). This is what racism is about - judgements based on ethnicity, not things that actually happen. Do you honestly not think that young black people, in this example, might not have some strong feelings about the history of slavery and race relations in the US?
Do you think they should somehow be immune to this?
Not able or not allowed to have some sort of reaction to things that happened to people like them expressly because of their race, without being instantly accused of racism?
Do you truly, honestly think this whole issue, wherever it happens, can be reduced to such a basic notion?
It’s you guys who keep calling everything racist, not me. As in the OP, it seems like some sort of obsession, trying to weed out any person who isn’t white doing something ‘racist’. What’s driving it?