Qvestyun

[johnd]

What can we (who are considered here to be non-Messianics but who believe in Y'shua HaMoshiakh) do to help spread the Gospel to non-believing Jews?

 

[yod]

Be who you are.

for some that means a gift in speaking...others have a gift of mercy...whatever "talents" the Lord has given you, use it to increase

 

[simchat_torah]

Pray4Isrel has done a lot of missionary work in Israel. I'm sure that she has some sound advice.

shalom
yafet.

 

[johnd]

Then I await her response.

 

[Multi-Elis]

Provoke them to jealousy. Isn't what it says in the Bible? Or am I confusing?

 

[BenTsion]

Allowing them to remain Jews while accepting Mashiach is a good start...
Not saying the Torah has been done away with is another important thing.
And last, but not least, being humble and directing them towards a
congregation they would be more comfortable with. For instance, the
synagogue I attend is extremely Jewish in its liturgy. Only Hebrew is used
in praising and also in many of the prayers. If I were to preach Yeshua to
my gentile neighbor, I'd probably not direct them to attend my community.
Since there aren't any messianic synagogues in the "reformed style" in my
city, I'd probably direct them to a Christian church, at least until they'd
reached a certain level of spiritual maturity. So, if you, a Christian, witness
to a Jew, direct them towards a Messianic Community for a more comfortable
fellowship.

All in my humble opinion,
Ben Tsion

 

[JewishHeart]

Provoke them to jealousy ( Romans 11) by your love, understanding, and character of Yeshua within you.

I think someone said it good by saying , " Be you." Living in Israel, a Jewish secular or orthodox can smell a fake from a mile a way and will be "dugri" with you and say so.

Learn and understand Jewish culture, history, and sufferings from the gentile church in order to be sensetive.

Let them remain Jewish ( BenTsion said this good).

While it is ok to identify with the Jewish people and practice Torah, don't try to fake being a Jew or suppose their calling on you. In other words, if they see you practicing Torah let them know its for identification and not to usurp their calling.

THE SPIRIT OF GOD- the most important factor of evangelism in the Jewish or Gentile world is to be led by the Spirit of God. If God leads you to listen- listen. If God leads you to pray for the sick -watch them be healed. God will do signs and wonders through you if you let him. He is the same yesterday, today, and forever. The Jewish people have enough of the "letter of the law" they need to see the power of God in action !

Love- Show once again love - they will know you are believers by your love for one another. This was Yeshua's and Torah's greatest commandment. Be an example of Messiah's character.

Last of all, be passionate for your Messiah no holds bar. Do not be ashamed you are a believer, otherwise you look like a fake. Even in persecution, stand up for Messiah and love your enemy.

 

[simchat_torah]

One thing to keep in mind is that it is illegal to proselytize in Israel.

So, what creative ways can one use?

 

[JewishHeart]

Simchat Torah - it is NOT illegal to proselytize in Israel. There are only TWO laws concerning proselytizing in Israel which is for both Orthodox Judaism and christian/messianic proselytizing ( and any other relegion).

1.) You can't bribe somebody to change their relegion. This is why many christian zionist charity organizations forbid their volunteers to evangelize.

2.) You can't change the relegion of somebody that is under 18 years old without their parent's permission. Orthodox Jews have been warned for this and that is why they use teenagers on the streets in Israel to put tefillin on other teenagers.

THAT'S IT!!!!

There is much social persecution, but very little legal persecution. People have lost their jobs for being believers, but this isn't legal.

It is hard to make aliyah as a Jewish believer as well ( although ironically somebody with a Jewish father and Gentile mother can label themselves "christians" and make aliyah- if the persons mother was Jewish and father was Gentile they wouldn't be allowed to make aliyah if they labeled themselves christians) , but once you're in, you're in.

You still need to find creative ways of doing evangelism

 

[BenTsion]

So, what creative ways can one use?

That reminds me of a Brazilian rabbi who, upon moving to Israel, placed signs on
several streetlamps all around Jerusalem which said (in several different languages):

"If you feel that your life is meaningless, if you feel that you are lost, if you are tired of the struggles of life, there is still a light for you. Call us at xxxxxxx".

It was a very creative and effective form of evangelism. And it had an extra plus because it didn't force Messiah down people's throats. They only share the Word with
those wanting to hear it.

In Messiah,
Ben Tsion

 

[Multi-Elis]

I guess in France simply being friends with a jew, in these hard times, and letting them know that you support them would mean a lot. But I would have a hard time directing them to a congregation. That is not yet my problem.

Friends of mine are part of an orginisation here in France, that tries to show friendship and solidarity with the jews. I really support their pure desires, but sometimes I have the feeling that they are being manipulated by the big jewish bosses here. I also feel that there is a sort of lack of trust in this organisation on the part of the jewish organisations... which worries me.

When I was in Israel, i'd say that for most of my life I was a fake, and it didn't get me anywhere. Certain cultural understanding of why jews think the way they think and how Israelis think the way they do is useful. (However I had gone to the extreme with my cultural sensativity when growing up... so sad) So basically everything JewishHeart said is true.

About keeping the Torah, let me give an example, an athiest jewish friend of mine found it absolutely amazing that I ate only matza on Passover. I did this not because I felt obliged to, or because I was faking it, (I had repented of faking it by that time) but simply because I found it so symbolically wonderful. But there have been numerous times where - I was doing something for wrong reasons that struck people as inscinsere. And half my problems as a teenager were due to that.

 

[johnd]

Allowing them to remain Jews while accepting Mashiach is a good start...
Not saying the Torah has been done away with is another important thing.
And last, but not least, being humble and directing them towards a
congregation they would be more comfortable with. For instance, the
synagogue I attend is extremely Jewish in its liturgy. Only Hebrew is used
in praising and also in many of the prayers. If I were to preach Yeshua to
my gentile neighbor, I'd probably not direct them to attend my community.
Since there aren't any messianic synagogues in the "reformed style" in my
city, I'd probably direct them to a Christian church, at least until they'd
reached a certain level of spiritual maturity. So, if you, a Christian, witness
to a Jew, direct them towards a Messianic Community for a more comfortable
fellowship.

All in my humble opinion,
Ben Tsion

All very good and helpful. May I ask you to share your testimony / acceptance of Y'shua as the Messiah? Or could you direct me to it if you've already posted it?

 

[johnd]

Provoke them to jealousy ( Romans 11) by your love, understanding, and character of Yeshua within you.

I think someone said it good by saying , " Be you." Living in Israel, a Jewish secular or orthodox can smell a fake from a mile a way and will be "dugri" with you and say so.

Learn and understand Jewish culture, history, and sufferings from the gentile church in order to be sensetive.

Let them remain Jewish ( BenTsion said this good).

While it is ok to identify with the Jewish people and practice Torah, don't try to fake being a Jew or suppose their calling on you. In other words, if they see you practicing Torah let them know its for identification and not to usurp their calling.

THE SPIRIT OF GOD- the most important factor of evangelism in the Jewish or Gentile world is to be led by the Spirit of God. If God leads you to listen- listen. If God leads you to pray for the sick -watch them be healed. God will do signs and wonders through you if you let him. He is the same yesterday, today, and forever. The Jewish people have enough of the "letter of the law" they need to see the power of God in action !

Love- Show once again love - they will know you are believers by your love for one another. This was Yeshua's and Torah's greatest commandment. Be an example of Messiah's character.

Last of all, be passionate for your Messiah no holds bar. Do not be ashamed you are a believer, otherwise you look like a fake. Even in persecution, stand up for Messiah and love your enemy.

Thanks, J/H

 

[johnd]

It is hard to make aliyah as a Jewish believer as well ( although ironically somebody with a Jewish father and Gentile mother can label themselves "christians" and make aliyah- if the persons mother was Jewish and father was Gentile they wouldn't be allowed to make aliyah if they labeled themselves christians) , but once you're in, you're in.

Just for the sake of discussion:

could this not apply to the children of Israel? since Israel is their mother (Jeremiah 22:26, Ezekiel 19:1-2) and HaShem their Father (Deuteronomy 32:6)?

Um, this is with the understanding that "goy" means non-Jew not what some have inferred it to mean ('dog' / zmock / etc.) Not trying to raise controversy in any way here.

Reagrds,

 

[johnd]

I have gone to Israel a couple times, as Yafet mentioned.
All I simply do is try to show that I am there to serve the people.
I show them that I love them and do not want to change them.
Usually they are so shocked that a Gentile is there to support them and love them without any strings attached that they end up having long discussions with me which usually turn to the topic of Yeshua
I recommend showing support for Israel in general. I take a Zionist approach, and that alone has caused many precious Jewish people see that I not only support them but their land.
Just show love. Do NOT try to change them! They are G-d's Chosen and He has a plan for them.
Ways I have served in Israel have been through helping clear land for construction, visiting hospitals and singing/talking to the terminally ill, visiting the special sites and showing honor, volunteering at schools, etc. My husband and I are planning a trip this fall for a couple weeks to serve in the Israeli Army at a base at Ashdot (West of Jerusalem) through a program called Sar-El.
Just showing your support, love and acceptance is a huge testimony.
If I could count how many discussions I have had...
My husband even got to talk with an Ultra-Orthodox Jew in Jerusalem for two hours that was impressed with my husband's love for the Jewish people and Israel!
You never know what can happen when you show love!

Thank you.

 

[johnd]

I guess in France simply being friends with a jew, in these hard times, and letting them know that you support them would mean a lot. But I would have a hard time directing them to a congregation. That is not yet my problem.

Friends of mine are part of an orginisation here in France, that tries to show friendship and solidarity with the jews. I really support their pure desires, but sometimes I have the feeling that they are being manipulated by the big jewish bosses here. I also feel that there is a sort of lack of trust in this organisation on the part of the jewish organisations... which worries me.

When I was in Israel, i'd say that for most of my life I was a fake, and it didn't get me anywhere. Certain cultural understanding of why jews think the way they think and how Israelis think the way they do is useful. (However I had gone to the extreme with my cultural sensativity when growing up... so sad) So basically everything JewishHeart said is true.

About keeping the Torah, let me give an example, an athiest jewish friend of mine found it absolutely amazing that I ate only matza on Passover. I did this not because I felt obliged to, or because I was faking it, (I had repented of faking it by that time) but simply because I found it so symbolically wonderful. But there have been numerous times where - I was doing something for wrong reasons that struck people as inscinsere. And half my problems as a teenager were due to that.

Thank you.

 

[johnd]

I have encountered many Jewish people in my life. Most of whom I gave little to no testimony of Y'shua other than to claim to be a follower of his. I felt it wrong of me as though I were too fearful to speak up. And dare I say it? I was afraid I was even ashamed of the Gospel... or intimidated until I began studying the Gospel in the Tanakh.

I still remained seldomly bold in person but almost repugnant on the internet in debating Rabbis and atheistic Jews and you name it. At best I only planted a seed or two though I often won debates (which I really thought at the time would help win the soul to Messiah).

For example, granting the premise that Isaiah 53 refers to "Isra-el" (and then reminding them what Yish Sarar Elohiym means and who that ultimately is).

But though I have recently lost heart, I have not lost my heart felt love for the Jewish people and the nation Israel (which I have defended tooth and nail all along).

I realize this is not a question, but maybe it will be overlooked this once.

Pray for me.

 

[Henaynei]

Just for the sake of discussion:

could this not apply to the children of Israel? since Israel is their mother (Jeremiah 22:26, Ezekiel 19:1-2) and HaShem their Father (Deuteronomy 32:6)?

Um, this is with the understanding that "goy" means non-Jew not what some have inferred it to mean ('dog' / zmock / etc.) Not trying to raise controversy in any way here.

Reagrds,

Dear johnd,

I thought you should know. In your statement above you used an Hebrew/Yiddish idiom that is patently not for mixed company. It is a crude reference to a portion of anatomy and I don't "think" you would have included it if you knew.

Gently,
Henaynei

 

[simchat_torah]

oh great, Henaynei is writing dear john letters...

 

[Talmidah]

oh great, Henaynei is writing dear john letters...

LOL!!!!!