Quoting scripture to nonbelievers ...

[JimB]

If, as the Bible says, the natural man does not receive the things of the Spirit of God, for they are foolishness to him; nor can he know them, because they are spiritually discerned (see 1 Cor. 2.14 in several versions), and since there is nothing quite so “spiritually discerned” as Scripture, what is the point of quoting scriptures to nonbelievers?

Wouldn’t you say that it is best to simply tell your story to a nonbeliever than to, say, try to reason with him out of the scripture?

When I was in my unsaved teens, a faithful preacher would sometimes catch me and start firing scriptures at me (probably the Roman Road, or something). Honestly, he might as well have been quoting out of the original Greek for all I understood – it was all Greek to me, anyhow.

It seems Paul, in Acts, when witnessing to before people (Agrippa, Festus, Felix) simply told the story of his conversion. He saved discussing scripture for believers, biblically knowledgeable people.

What do you think?

~Jim

 

[enoch son]

Jim how can we be spiritual without ramming the word down thier mouth? Don't you know without us God is helpless!

 

[AudioArtist]

Jim M, you are completely right, and Paul's example from scripture makes what you say have even more truthful.

When God brough an ex-Christian back to Him through me, I simply shared my experiences of God with the person. He was very sceptical at the beginning, but he either had to accept that I was telling the truth, deluded, or lying.

If I had told him random scriptures (something which I felt lead NOT to do) I am sure he would still be an ex-Christian today.

 

[Apostle390]

I agree, Scripture can only be understood under the teaching of the Holy Spirit. The best way to bring someone to Christ is to let them see Him working through your life with your actions. Most people want a "real" Jesus in their lives, not some religious figure that man has made Jesus out to be. People are more interested in seeing what Jesus can do for them on a 21st century basis, not what He did 2,000 years ago in a Book they can't even understand.

 

[non-religious]

The beautiful thing about those who do occasionally quote scriptures (especially when speaking to a large crowd of non-believers) is the fact that sometimes those words have a resonance that reaches people at their point of need. For example I remember being at a wedding, listening to the best man using quotations from the Bible that spoke of God's love. It really touched me and this was the first time I heard God's word. It had such an effect on my life that I started reading the Bible and God introduced Himself to me and here I am.

It's difficult because ultimately God's word is relevant, powerful, life changing, uncompromising, beautiful the list is endless. So I believe that if you can witness to someone and at the same time bring God's word into the mix, in a non-condescending or preachy way, then I see nothing wrong with it.

 

[New_Wineskin]

Good post Jim . I used to incorrectly consider that quoting Scriptures was the power of God for salvation . When the NIV came out , I thought that it was great . I could memorize the Scriptures and quote them without the flavor that the other versions had which were an alien tongue to everyone ( especially Jim's version ) . But , I have found that was an incorrect doctrine as Paul was talking about the gospel and not the Scriptures . And , the gospel was not something written . So , I like to listen and speak with the Spirit's guidance as faith comes from hearing the words of the Lord and not by the interpretations of the Scriptures quoted verbatum and regurgitated like so many spells and incantations .

 

[JamesCarter]

I think that Scriptures can be used effectively in witnessing, however, I think the Spirit must anoint the usage. The Scriptures with the Spirit's anointing and guidance can bring about conviction, contrition and conversion. Certainly, the Spirit can employ other means, and I think we should be sensitive to the context and the person. The truth of the matter is that everyone is different, and that's why I don't like pre-packaged evangelistic systems. They assume that if you employ their system, you'll realize the desired results. Well, one system doesn't fit all. That's why a reliance on the Spirit and building constructive relationships are so important. By investing oneself into the person, you will be able to more clearly discern what witnessing approach is optimal.

 

[New_Wineskin]

Nice post , JC !!

 

[JimB]

Someone just called my attention to Philip and the Ethiopian eunuch (Acts 8) where Philip used scripture to win the eunuch. My contention is that the eunuch admitted that he could not understand the scripture “unless someone guides me". It took a person with spiritual discernment to help him understand what he read. Anyhow, Philip did not initiate the use of scripture, the eunuch was already reading it when Philip encountered him.

What do you think?

~Jim

 

[HumbleBee]

Witnessing with the Word helps to impart faith to the nonbeliever, so is a crucial tool.

Matthew 4:4 But He answered and said, It is written, Man shall not live by bread alone, but by every word that proceedeth out of the mouth of God.

John 3:16 For God so loved the world, that He gave His only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in Him should not perish, but have everlasting life.

Romans 10:17 So then faith cometh by hearing, and hearing by the word of God.

Acts 4:4 Howbeit many of them which heard the word believed; and the number of the men was about five thousand.

Acts 10:44 While Peter yet spake these words, the Holy Ghost fell on all them which heard the word.

Hebrews 4:12 For the word of God is quick, and powerful, and sharper than any twoedged sword, piercing even to the dividing asunder of soul and spirit, and of the joints and marrow, and is a discerner of the thoughts and intents of the heart.

 

[Svt4Him]

Think about this for a sec, but would that mean that every time Jesus spoke to non-believers, they wouldn't have understood Him, as He would have spoken the word of God to them always?

 

[JimB]

Witnessing with the Word helps to impart faith to the nonbeliever, so is a crucial tool.

Matthew 4:4 But He answered and said, It is written, Man shall not live by bread alone, but by every word that proceedeth out of the mouth of God.

John 3:16 For God so loved the world, that He gave His only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in Him should not perish, but have everlasting life.

Romans 10:17 So then faith cometh by hearing, and hearing by the word of God.

Acts 4:4 Howbeit many of them which heard the word believed; and the number of the men was about five thousand.

Acts 10:44 While Peter yet spake these words, the Holy Ghost fell on all them which heard the word.

Hebrews 4:12 For the word of God is quick, and powerful, and sharper than any twoedged sword, piercing even to the dividing asunder of soul and spirit, and of the joints and marrow, and is a discerner of the thoughts and intents of the heart.

IMO, in none of these instances does the term translated “word” mean scripture. Never. It means “message, utterance, saying”. Here are some alternate translations of the verses you listed:

Matthew 4.4

The word translated “word” is rhema (message, utterance) not logos. It could, and probably does, mean a prophetic utterance and could mean a sermon or lesson by an appointed/anointed minister.

​

Romans 10.17

So faith comes by hearing [what is told], and what is heard comes by the preaching [of the message that came from the lips] of Christ (the Messiah Himself). (Amplified)

Yet faith comes from listening to this message of good news--the Good News about Christ. (NLT)

No one can have faith without hearing the message about Christ. (CEV)

​

Acts 4.4

But many of those who heard the message believed (adhered to and trusted in and relied on Jesus as the Christ). And their number grew and came to about 5,000. (Amplified)

But many who heard the message believed, and the number of men grew to about five thousand. (NIV)

​

Acts 10.44

While Peter was still speaking these words, the Holy Spirit fell on all who were listening to the message. (Amplified)

While Peter was still speaking these words, the Holy Spirit came on all who heard the message. (NIV)

Even as Peter was saying these things, the Holy Spirit fell upon all who had heard the message. (NLT)

​

Hebrews 4.12

...applies to believers, since that is the audience targeted by the epistle.
​

In the KJV, these verses, because of the way the translators rendered them, sound like they are dealing with the Scriptures and they are too often misused in that way. It helps to know what was really being said and none of these verses support using the Bible on unbelievers.

~Jim

 

[JimB]

Think about this for a sec, but would that mean that every time Jesus spoke to non-believers, they wouldn't have understood Him, as He would have spoken the word of God to them always?

Interesting, but …

He said that He spoke in PARABLES (i.e. stories) so that they WOULD understand. He did not quote long passages from Deuteronomy at them, even though He was more than capable of doing so. In fact, it is amazing how seldom he quoted scripture when teaching the “crowds”.

~Jim

 

[Svt4Him]

Kind of an interesting thought though, as when Jesus spoke, He would always be speaking the word of God. But Jesus, when talking to people, preached the message of the Kingdom, which was repent and believe. Where these non-Christians He was preaching to? I beleive so, as it doesn't say one way or the other. What were the people to repent of, and what were they to believe?

 

[HumbleBee]

In fact, it is amazing how seldom he quoted scripture when teaching the “crowds”.

Check your facts, Jesus quoted Scripture much! ('as it is written')

Matthew 21:13 "It is written," He said to them, " 'My house will be called a house of prayer,' [ Isaiah 56:7] but you are making it a 'den of robbers.' [ Jer. 7:11] "

Matthew 21:42 Jesus said to them, "Have you never read in the Scriptures: " 'The stone the builders rejected has become the capstone; the Lord has done this, and it is marvelous in our eyes'?

Luke 4:14-17 Jesus returned to Galilee in the power of the Spirit, and news about Him spread through the whole countryside. He taught in their synagogues, and everyone praised Him. He went to Nazareth, where He had been brought up, and on the Sabbath day He went into the synagogue, as was His custom. And He stood up to read. The scroll of the prophet Isaiah was handed to Him. Unrolling it, He found the place where it is written...

Luke 2:37 It is written: 'And He was numbered with the transgressors' [ Isaiah 53:12] ; and I tell you that this must be fulfilled in Me. Yes, what is written about Me is reaching its fulfillment."

John 6:45 It is written in the Prophets: 'They will all be taught by God.' Everyone who listens to the Father and learns from Him comes to Me.


As for your reply to my post, are not Christ's Words, the Scriptures, (John 3:16, for ex) His message?

 

[JimB]

Check your facts, Jesus quoted Scripture much! ('as it is written')

Matthew 21:13 "It is written," He said to them, " 'My house will be called a house of prayer,' [ Isaiah 56:7] but you are making it a 'den of robbers.' [ Jer. 7:11] "

Matthew 21:42 Jesus said to them, "Have you never read in the Scriptures: " 'The stone the builders rejected has become the capstone; the Lord has done this, and it is marvelous in our eyes'?

Luke 4:14-17 Jesus returned to Galilee in the power of the Spirit, and news about Him spread through the whole countryside. He taught in their synagogues, and everyone praised Him. He went to Nazareth, where He had been brought up, and on the Sabbath day He went into the synagogue, as was His custom. And He stood up to read. The scroll of the prophet Isaiah was handed to Him. Unrolling it, He found the place where it is written...

Luke 2:37 It is written: 'And He was numbered with the transgressors' [ Isaiah 53:12] ; and I tell you that this must be fulfilled in Me. Yes, what is written about Me is reaching its fulfillment."

John 6:45 It is written in the Prophets: 'They will all be taught by God.' Everyone who listens to the Father and learns from Him comes to Me.


As for your reply to my post, are not Christ's Words, the Scriptures, (John 3:16, for ex) His message?

Matthew 13.34

Jesus spoke all these things to THE CROWD in parables; he did not say anything to them without using a parable.
​

Jesus did not use scripture when addressing “the crowd”, He only used parables or else what does this verse mean? It don’t get no plainer than that.

~Jim

 

[NewSong]

Heb 4:12 For the word of God is living and operative, and sharper than any two-edged sword, and penetrating to the division of soul and spirit, both of joints and marrow, and a discerner of the thoughts and intents of the heart.

 

[AudioArtist]

All the times when the New Testament mentions scripture being used to convert non-believers, is when the people who are being spoken to are either already Christians, or seeking the meaning behind scripture, or pharasies/others who have a good knowledge of scripture, and thus Jesus teaches to them through it (there are other cases, but this is the majority.)

When Jesus (or indeed Paul) was dealing with ordinary non-believers, they used parables/their own testimony to bring people to Christ. When we are faced with someone with no knowledge of (or interest in) the Bible who is an unbeliever, I believe we should do the same in the majority of occasions.

 

[New_Wineskin]

Heb 4:12 For the word of God is living and operative, and sharper than any two-edged sword, and penetrating to the division of soul and spirit, both of joints and marrow, and a discerner of the thoughts and intents of the heart.

The author gives no indication that they were referring to the Scriptures when using the phrase "word of God" .

 

[MERCY@GRACE]

If, as the Bible says, the natural man does not receive the things of the Spirit of God, for they are foolishness to him; nor can he know them, because they are spiritually discerned (see 1 Cor. 2.14 in several versions), and since there is nothing quite so “spiritually discerned” as Scripture, what is the point of quoting scriptures to nonbelievers?

Wouldn’t you say that it is best to simply tell your story to a nonbeliever than to, say, try to reason with him out of the scripture?

When I was in my unsaved teens, a faithful preacher would sometimes catch me and start firing scriptures at me (probably the Roman Road, or something). Honestly, he might as well have been quoting out of the original Greek for all I understood – it was all Greek to me, anyhow.

It seems Paul, in Acts, when witnessing to before people (Agrippa, Festus, Felix) simply told the story of his conversion. He saved discussing scripture for believers, biblically knowledgeable people.

What do you think?

~Jim

Haven't read the replies, haven't been here in a long time, but just wanted to say I totally agree here.