Quick Question

[MbiaJc]

Maybe you will learn that Age isnt a requirement for presenting the Gospel or leading a church, regardless of how you try to pigeon hold Young men from fulfilling the call God has placed on their life. You get respect when you earn it, not when you think you deserve it because you are old. I dont just hand out respect, and Im not asking for yours, because I dont care if I have it. Your approval or disapproval means nothing to me. I find it ironic that you speak of understanding.

Well genius prove what you say with scripture and kindly keep your opinions to your self. All you have accomplished is show everyone how much you don't know about Scripture.

 

[JacobHall86]

Yes my dear sister I am. You are the only one that got it right.
BTW Just because Paul told Timothy that doesn't make him under thirty, does it? Timothy was not a Pastor, he was an Apostle. Which is the real reason Paul told him that, because an Apostle, at that time had the ultmate authority in the Church.

First the Church which has been around since the garden, is patterned after the Leviticus Priesthood.

The sons of Kohath were to start their priestly duties at the age of thirty Num. 4:3 David rolled the age back to twenty five at one time, however Jesus shows us that God meant for it to be at thirty. They served in their temple duties till age 50, at which time they could be appointed to serve on the Sanhedrin.

Timothy was a Pastor, and he to have been an apostle he would have had to Seen Jesus. Since its not stated that he actually saw Christ we cant assume that he did. Timothy was a Pastor, thats accepted by about 99% of Christianity. And your theory fails since Christ didnt serve till he was 50.

Where did you study Hermenutics and Theology at? Im curious to know.

 

[JacobHall86]

Well genius prove what you say with scripture and kindly keep your opinions to your self. All you have accomplished is show everyone how much you don't know about Scripture.

You haven't proven anything, only that you tie things in Scripture together that actually aren't related.

One of the largest things about being Baptist is the individual priesthood of the believer. Are you saying that you cannot become a Christian until you are 30? That what it seems like. Of course its a Baptist belief, and your profile says you are Methodist. You technically shouldn't even be posting in the Baptist section.

 

[JimfromOhio]

This is the concept of Romans 8:28-29 "And we know that God causes everything to work together for the good of those who love God and are called according to his purpose for them."

All Messiah prophecies must be fulfilled and Christ fulfilled them all in 33 years.

 

[tkoman]

Well, it tells me that Jesus certainly chose to conform to ancient Israel's standards for a rabbi otherwise he may not have gotten as far as he did (being a 12 year old female wouldn't have cut it)

 

[IisJustMe]

Why did Jesus start His ministery at 30 yr. old? ... Why not at 20 or 40,50 or some other age? ... And what does this tell us?

A quick look at the Scriptures shows us that the age of 30 was considered an age of maturity for teaching, leadership, and respect. No less than seven times in Numbers chapter four (vv. 3, 23, 30, 35, 39, 43, 47) the Law states:

" ... from thirty years and upward even to fifty years old, everyone who entered the service for work in the tent of meeting."

The wording varies only by tense in each of those verses in chapter four. It is reiterated in I Chronicles 23:3 when a census of the Levites age 30 and above was conducted. It is further noted in II Chronicles 31:16 that the portions of the offerings allotted the priests and Levites were distributed through the heads of families aged 30 and above. Obviously, a significance of maturity, accountability, and a level of trust was placed on Israeli men once they achieved the age of 30. It is of further significance, I believe, that recent studies of male psychological and emotional development place true maturity among men at age 26-28. God knew that long before man figured it out.

Additionally, Joseph, who was a type for Christ, King David, and even King Saul all "came of age" at 30. Joseph " ... was thirty years old when he stood before Pharaoh, king of Egypt. And Joseph went out from the presence of Pharaoh and went through all the land of Egypt ..." as prime minister. Saul and David both began their reigns at age 30 (I Samuel 13:1, 2 Samuel 5:4). Clearly, from abject adherence to the Law and the Writings by Jewish society, had Jesus attempted to minister before age 30, He would have been rejected as immature and unqualified.

I believe that is your answer.

 

[PrincetonGuy]

A quick look at the Scriptures shows us that the age of 30 was considered an age of maturity for teaching, leadership, and respect. No less than seven times in Numbers chapter four (vv. 3, 23, 30, 35, 39, 43, 47) the Law states:

" ... from thirty years and upward even to fifty years old, everyone who entered the service for work in the tent of meeting."

The wording varies only by tense in each of those verses in chapter four. It is reiterated in I Chronicles 23:3 when a census of the Levites age 30 and above was conducted. It is further noted in II Chronicles 31:16 that the portions of the offerings allotted the priests and Levites were distributed through the heads of families aged 30 and above. Obviously, a significance of maturity, accountability, and a level of trust was placed on Israeli men once they achieved the age of 30. It is of further significance, I believe, that recent studies of male psychological and emotional development place true maturity among men at age 26-28. God knew that long before man figured it out.

Additionally, Joseph, who was a type for Christ, King David, and even King Saul all "came of age" at 30. Joseph " ... was thirty years old when he stood before Pharaoh, king of Egypt. And Joseph went out from the presence of Pharaoh and went through all the land of Egypt ..." as prime minister. Saul and David both began their reigns at age 30 (I Samuel 13:1, 2 Samuel 5:4). Clearly, from abject adherence to the Law and the Writings by Jewish society, had Jesus attempted to minister before age 30, He would have been rejected as immature and unqualified.

I believe that is your answer.

“A little research” can result large mistakes. Dionysius Exiguus did “a little research” into the chronology of Christ and missed the year of His birth by at least 4 years! And that was only one of his mistakes—including the wrong conclusion that Jesus was born on December 25th.

As is always the case in interpreting the New Testament, we must base our interpretation, not on translations of the New Testament, but the New Testament itself in Greek. When we look at the Greek texts of Luke’s gospel, we find a few variant readings for Luke 3:23, including the variant ἐρχόμενος ‘(he was) coming (for baptism, vv. 22-22)’ in the place of ἀρχόμενος ‘(he was) beginning,’ a variant supported in part by some Old Latin and Old Syriac manuscripts. But perhaps more important to the question before us is the fact that none of these manuscripts tells us what Jesus was beginning to do. Joseph A. Fitzmyer, in his exhaustive 1,642 page commentary on Luke’s gospel writes, “Luke’s use of the ptc. [participle] archomenos, “beginning, starting,” is somewhat cryptic, but it is understood once one recalls that Luke elsewhere uses the verb archein (or its cognates) to refer to the beginning of Jesus’ public ministry (23:5; Acts 1:1, and especially 1:22; 10:37, where it is closely linked to the baptism of Jesus).”

Hence the NASB, 1995, gives us the following translation,

Luke 3:23. When He began His ministry, Jesus Himself was about thirty years of age, being, as was supposed, the son of Joseph, the son of Eli,

The ministry of Jesus was unique, and to compare it to the service of Levites and the reign of kings is more than stretching things. Jesus was not a Levite (He, like David, was of the tribe of Judah (Rev. 5:5), and the ordinances pertaining to the Levites did not apply to Him. And during his ministry years, he did not reign as a king; he served as a servant.

Further considering the Greek text of Luke 3:23 we see that Luke does NOT state that Jesus was 30 years old; Luke wrote that Jesus was about thirty years old (ὡσεὶ ἐτῶν τριάκοντ&#945, i.e., he may have been a few years younger or a few years older.

As for your statement, “Saul and David both began their reigns at age 30 (I Samuel 13:1, 2 Samuel 5:4),” the Hebrew text of I Samuel 13:1 has a gap in the text and the age is not given. And, “since Saul already had a son, Jonathan, who commanded a division of the army in the very first years of his reign, and therefore must have been at least twenty years of age, if not older, Saul himself cannot have been less than forty years old when he began to reign.” (Keil and Delitzsch, Commentary on the Old Testament). The age of David when he began to reign is of no significance to the question before us.

Whether Jesus was actually 28 or 29 years old, or perhaps 31 or 32 years old, is not important—and certainly not nearly as important as the fact that He was not yet married—a fact that would have raised a whole lot more eyebrows among the Jewish people than His being a little younger than 30 years old—a fact that has caused some scholars to argue that Jesus had been married, and that His wife had died, or that he was still married during at least the early part of His ministry.

I am aware that some Bible commentators and teachers believe that the age of Jesus was important and that He must have been at least 30 years old when He began His public ministry, but I do not find that their belief is based upon a suitably careful consideration of the facts.

 

[IisJustMe]

Why do some people insist on making every single thread about the KJV Only heresy? If I couldn't find anything better to do with my time, I'd buy a worm farm. At least then I wouldn't be a giant irritant to the rest of the forum.

 

[MbiaJc]

Timothy was a Pastor, and he to have been an apostle he would have had to Seen Jesus. Since its not stated that he actually saw Christ we cant assume that he did. Timothy was a Pastor, thats accepted by about 99% of Christianity. And your theory fails since Christ didnt serve till he was 50.

Where did you study Hermenutics and Theology at? Im curious to know.

All you are doing is quoting your man made doctrine. Please give some scripture evidence or kindly don't reply.

 

[MbiaJc]

You haven't proven anything, only that you tie things in Scripture together that actually aren't related.

One of the largest things about being Baptist is the individual priesthood of the believer. Are you saying that you cannot become a Christian until you are 30? That what it seems like. Of course its a Baptist belief, and your profile says you are Methodist. You technically shouldn't even be posting in the Baptist section.

Kindly give scripture for your man made doctrine or don't reply, and don't try changing the subject, because you have no doctrine that have scriptural proof. One always knows when the other has no proof to back them up when they start changing the subject to something of no revelance.

 

[JacobHall86]

All you are doing is quoting your man made doctrine. Please give some scripture evidence or kindly don't reply.

So no actual refutation? Didn't think so.

And when you can do more than proof text and string together proof texts you might make a viable point. Also, you never answered my question about where you learned your theological education.

 

[MbiaJc]

Timothy was a Pastor, and he to have been an apostle he would have had to Seen Jesus. Since its not stated that he actually saw Christ we cant assume that he did. Timothy was a Pastor, thats accepted by about 99% of Christianity. And your theory fails since Christ didnt serve till he was 50.

Where did you study Hermenutics and Theology at? Im curious to know.

Certanly not where you did. Show where the bible sayes one hast to have seen Jesus to be an Apostle? BTW Timothy is not the only Apostle that didn't see Jesus.

I studyed at the Mastors Siminary, with the HOLY GHOST as my Teacher.

 

[JacobHall86]

So you don't have any actual formal Theological training?

 

[MbiaJc]

A quick look at the Scriptures shows us that the age of 30 was considered an age of maturity for teaching, leadership, and respect. No less than seven times in Numbers chapter four (vv. 3, 23, 30, 35, 39, 43, 47) the Law states:

" ... from thirty years and upward even to fifty years old, everyone who entered the service for work in the tent of meeting."

The wording varies only by tense in each of those verses in chapter four. It is reiterated in I Chronicles 23:3 when a census of the Levites age 30 and above was conducted. It is further noted in II Chronicles 31:16 that the portions of the offerings allotted the priests and Levites were distributed through the heads of families aged 30 and above. Obviously, a significance of maturity, accountability, and a level of trust was placed on Israeli men once they achieved the age of 30. It is of further significance, I believe, that recent studies of male psychological and emotional development place true maturity among men at age 26-28. God knew that long before man figured it out.

Additionally, Joseph, who was a type for Christ, King David, and even King Saul all "came of age" at 30. Joseph " ... was thirty years old when he stood before Pharaoh, king of Egypt. And Joseph went out from the presence of Pharaoh and went through all the land of Egypt ..." as prime minister. Saul and David both began their reigns at age 30 (I Samuel 13:1, 2 Samuel 5:4). Clearly, from abject adherence to the Law and the Writings by Jewish society, had Jesus attempted to minister before age 30, He would have been rejected as immature and unqualified.

I believe that is your answer.

Great: you got it brother

 

[PETE_]

Certanly not where you did. Show where the bible sayes one hast to have seen Jesus to be an Apostle? BTW Timothy is not the only Apostle that didn't see Jesus.

I studyed at the Mastors Siminary, with the HOLY GHOST as my Teacher.

Peter mentions seeing the ressurected Christ as a criteria for appointing one to replace Judas. Paul in confirming his apostleship uses the fact that he had see the resurrected Christ. It was not just seeing Him during His life that qualified one to be an apostle.

 

[MbiaJc]

“A little research” can result large mistakes. Dionysius Exiguus did “a little research” into the chronology of Christ and missed the year of His birth by at least 4 years! And that was only one of his mistakes—including the wrong conclusion that Jesus was born on December 25th.

As is always the case in interpreting the New Testament, we must base our interpretation, not on translations of the New Testament, but the New Testament itself in Greek. When we look at the Greek texts of Luke’s gospel, we find a few variant readings for Luke 3:23, including the variant ἐρχόμενος ‘(he was) coming (for baptism, vv. 22-22)’ in the place of ἀρχόμενος ‘(he was) beginning,’ a variant supported in part by some Old Latin and Old Syriac manuscripts. But perhaps more important to the question before us is the fact that none of these manuscripts tells us what Jesus was beginning to do. Joseph A. Fitzmyer, in his exhaustive 1,642 page commentary on Luke’s gospel writes, “Luke’s use of the ptc. [participle] archomenos, “beginning, starting,” is somewhat cryptic, but it is understood once one recalls that Luke elsewhere uses the verb archein (or its cognates) to refer to the beginning of Jesus’ public ministry (23:5; Acts 1:1, and especially 1:22; 10:37, where it is closely linked to the baptism of Jesus).”

Hence the NASB, 1995, gives us the following translation,

Luke 3:23. When He began His ministry, Jesus Himself was about thirty years of age, being, as was supposed, the son of Joseph, the son of Eli,

The ministry of Jesus was unique, and to compare it to the service of Levites and the reign of kings is more than stretching things. Jesus was not a Levite (He, like David, was of the tribe of Judah (Rev. 5:5), and the ordinances pertaining to the Levites did not apply to Him. And during his ministry years, he did not reign as a king; he served as a servant.

Further considering the Greek text of Luke 3:23 we see that Luke does NOT state that Jesus was 30 years old; Luke wrote that Jesus was about thirty years old (ὡσεὶ ἐτῶν τριάκοντ&#945, i.e., he may have been a few years younger or a few years older.

As for your statement, “Saul and David both began their reigns at age 30 (I Samuel 13:1, 2 Samuel 5:4),” the Hebrew text of I Samuel 13:1 has a gap in the text and the age is not given. And, “since Saul already had a son, Jonathan, who commanded a division of the army in the very first years of his reign, and therefore must have been at least twenty years of age, if not older, Saul himself cannot have been less than forty years old when he began to reign.” (Keil and Delitzsch, Commentary on the Old Testament). The age of David when he began to reign is of no significance to the question before us.

Whether Jesus was actually 28 or 29 years old, or perhaps 31 or 32 years old, is not important—and certainly not nearly as important as the fact that He was not yet married—a fact that would have raised a whole lot more eyebrows among the Jewish people than His being a little younger than 30 years old—a fact that has caused some scholars to argue that Jesus had been married, and that His wife had died, or that he was still married during at least the early part of His ministry.

I am aware that some Bible commentators and teachers believe that the age of Jesus was important and that He must have been at least 30 years old when He began His public ministry, but I do not find that their belief is based upon a suitably careful consideration of the facts.

You have written a lot to have not proven anything. No opinions and doctrine of men please.

 

[JacobHall86]

No opinions and doctrine of men please.

Hey Pot, meet kettle.

 

[MbiaJc]

So you don't have any actual formal Theological training?

Nope, according to man made doctrine and doctrine of devils, I would qualify as ignorant and unlearned.

I do not qualify as, Moma called and Daddy sent.

 

[Flynmonkie]

The conception of Christ and Birth was the beginning of His ministry. Some believe even earlier with prophecy.

 

[JacobHall86]

Nope, according to man made doctrine and doctrine of devils, I would qualify as ignorant and unlearned.

I do not qualify as, Moma called and Daddy sent.

Noted, you are not trained to speak on matters you speak on. Got it.