question

[AmericanSamurai]

Unregenerate man is spiritually dead, he's not even alive, let alone being able to see or hear.

 

[shawnavery]

No, you didn't bother, no worries.

OK cool thanks

John 3:16

 

[BBAS 64]

Ah I see what your saying. Thanks for the info and your time.

John 3:16

Good Day, Shawn

No problem.....

 

[shawnavery]

Would it be fairly accurate to then say that typically the non elect wouldn't bother with Gods word or accept Jesus ?

John 3:16

 

[JM]

Everyone that believes is saved, yes.

The non-elect are left in their sins and punished for their sins. Those who believe are elected unto salvation and called out of their former sin.

 

[AmericanSamurai]

Everyone that believes is saved, yes.

But just not everyone that says they believe is saved.

 

[shawnavery]

Everyone that believes is saved, yes.

The non-elect are left in their sins and punished for their sins. Those who believe are elected unto salvation and called out of their former sin.

Think I'm grasping it..thanks

John 3:16

 

[AmericanSamurai]

Any Reformed Baptist churches in your area?

 

[JM]

But just not everyone that says they believe is saved.

Of course not. I was trying to give a simple, straight forward answer to a complicated question.

 

[shawnavery]

Been going to an independent church. But I've been searching and found a reformed church I'm going to visit this weekend

John 3:16

 

[AmericanSamurai]

Of course not. I was trying to give a simple, straight forward answer to a complicated question.

Of course I know you know, just thought I'd add that for Mr.Avery.

 

[AmericanSamurai]

Been going to an independent church. But I've been searching and found a reformed church I'm going to visit this weekend

John 3:16

Excellent!

 

[AmericanSamurai]

A great Primer on Reformed Theology is RC Sproul's book "What is Reformed Theology"; it isn't too long and gives an in depth enough overview on Reformed Theology. I find myself re-reading parts of it often.

 

[shawnavery]

A great Primer on Reformed Theology is RC Sproul's book "What is Reformed Theology"; it isn't too long and gives an in depth enough overview on Reformed Theology. I find myself re-reading parts of it often.

Thanks I'll definitely check that out

John 3:16

 

[St_Worm2]

Thanks I'll definitely check that out

John 3:16

Dr. Sproul will actually send you that book for free. Go HERE to get it!

 

[shawnavery]

Dr. Sproul will actually send you that book for free. Go HERE to get it!

Awesome ..thanks

John 3:16

 

[BBAS 64]

Awesome ..thanks

John 3:16

Good day, Shawn

The links I send from Spurgeon will be usefull as well, the Spoul book helped me "cut" my teeth , I think you willl enjoy it.

In Him,

Bill

 

[shawnavery]

Good day, Shawn

The links I send from Spurgeon will be usefull as well, the Spoul book helped me "cut" my teeth , I think you willl enjoy it.

In Him,

Bill

Very cool thanks ..I downloaded them as well

John 3:16

 

[Apologetic_Warrior]

My question is does anyone that hears and accept the gospel of Christ become saved if they accept Christ as there saviour? John 3:16

Shawn

A quick and easy Scriptural answer is found in Acts 13 where we read:

48 And when the Gentiles heard this, they were glad, and glorified the word of the Lord: and as many as were ordained to eternal life believed." (KJV)

Other translations use the word "appointed" in place of "ordained", in a way I prefer ordained, but the meaning of appointed makes it all the more clear.

So many people have taken "For God so loved the world" out of context and a great verse that demonstrates this is: 1 John 2:15 Do not love the world or the things in the world. If anyone loves the world, the love of the Father is not in him." Among other context is the flood account where God flooded the world, sparing only Noah and his family. Then there are verses like "do not be conformed to this world". I realize this response is a short answer, and so much more could be said, the doctrines of Grace are taught in the Gospel of John, with verses like:

John 6:44 “No one can come to Me unless the Father who sent Me draws him;

John 6:65 And He said, “Therefore I have said to you that no one can come to Me unless it has been granted to him by My Father.”

John 8:34 Jesus answered them, “Most assuredly, I say to you, whoever commits sin is a slave of sin.

John 8:44 “You are of your father the devil, and the desires of your father you want to do.

John 17:2 “as You have given Him authority over all flesh, that He should give eternal life to as many as You have given Him.

John 17:9 “I pray for them. I do not pray for the world but for those whom You have given Me, for they are Yours. 10 “And all Mine are Yours, and Yours are Mine, and I am glorified in them.

John 10:11 “I am the good shepherd. The good shepherd gives His life for the sheep.

John 10:14 “I am the good shepherd; and I know My sheep, and am known by My own. 15 “As the Father knows Me, even so I know the Father; and I lay down My life for the sheep. 16 “And other sheep I have which are not of this fold; them also I must bring, and they will hear My voice; and there will be one flock and one shepherd.

John 10:26 “But you do not believe, because you are not of My sheep, as I said to you. 27 “My sheep hear My voice, and I know them, and they follow Me. 28 “And I give them eternal life, and they shall never perish; neither shall anyone snatch them out of My hand.

John 1:12 But as many as received Him, to them He gave the right to become children of God, to those who believe in His name: 13 who were born, not of blood, nor of the will of the flesh, nor of the will of man, but of God.

John 3:3 Jesus answered and said to him, “Most assuredly, I say to you, unless one is born again, he cannot see the kingdom of God.” 4 Nicodemus said to Him, “How can a man be born when he is old? Can he enter a second time into his mother’s womb and be born?” 5 Jesus answered, “Most assuredly, I say to you, unless one is born of water and the Spirit, he cannot enter the kingdom of God. 6 “That which is born of the flesh is flesh, and that which is born of the Spirit is spirit. 7 “Do not marvel that I said to you, ‘You must be born again.’

John 5:21 “For as the Father raises the dead and gives life to them, even so the Son gives life to whom He will.

John 6:37 “All that the Father gives Me will come to Me, and the one who comes to Me I will by no means cast out.

John 6:64 “But there are some of you who do not believe.” For Jesus knew from the beginning who they were who did not believe, and who would betray Him. 65 And He said, “Therefore I have said to you that no one can come to Me unless it has been granted to him by My Father.”

John 6:47 “Most assuredly, I say to you, he who believes in Me has everlasting life.

If only I had time to go through each verse, I recommend reading them carefully, because they make no sense in the context of what is taught in so many Churches today. The doctrines of Total inability (Total Depravity), Particular Redemption (Limited Atonement), and Perseverance of the Saints (Preservance of the Saints or eternal security) should especially be evident from the above verses. Unconditional Election or Effectual Grace, is clearly taught here:

John 15:16 “You did not choose Me, but I chose you and appointed you that you should go and bear fruit, and that your fruit should remain, that whatever you ask the Father in My name He may give you.

Notice who chose who and the word "appointed"? Jesus disciples did not choose Him, He chose them. Notice "remain"? More than Unconditional Election is taught by Jesus in this one verse.

I'd like to briefly address another aspect of your question, because it also involved the Ordo salutis a Latin phrase for "order of salvation". Let me provide a link with helpful resources: HERE I recommend reading the introduction first, which provides the difference between Calvinists and Arminians. A key difference between the two is "monergistic regeneration" which all Calvinists hold to, which in plain simple terms means that salvation is the work of God alone, but does not mean that God is alone at every point of the process of salvation. In short, Calvinism does not leave man any room to boast whatsoever in salvation, nor is salvation dependent upon man's performance or lack of, and the work of Christ on the cross actually accomplished the salvation of whosoever God chose from all eternity, whosoever God has chosen He gives saving faith to and replaces the heart of stone with a heart of flesh, God alone does this, and all for His glory, all glory to God alone.

If I remember and get more time, I will try to remember to point you to more resources, but for now, a quick few:

13 FREE ebooks by R.C. Sproul, his "Crucial Questions" series

DOCTRINES OF GRACE – CATEGORIZED SCRIPTURE LIST

An aesthetically pleasing and well written summary of The Doctrines of Grace with Scripture proofs, Arminian objections answered and more.

Another list of proof texts by William J. Baldwin for the Doctrines of Grace

Desiring God resources on the Five Points of Calvinism

The links above do not contain small lists of verses, nor are they comprehensive. As you probably are aware, many will build doctrine around a verse or two, while the Scripture evidence for the system of theological doctrines nicknamed "Calvinism" is overwhelming, and yet strongly opposed. I am ashamed that I spent so many years as an Arminian, that I could not see through the theological blinders, and though I run against the grain of what is common, I am thankful the Potter graciously Re-formed me into the clay He has.

 

[shawnavery]

Shawn

A quick and easy Scriptural answer is found in Acts 13 where we read:

48 And when the Gentiles heard this, they were glad, and glorified the word of the Lord: and as many as were ordained to eternal life believed." (KJV)

Other translations use the word "appointed" in place of "ordained", in a way I prefer ordained, but the meaning of appointed makes it all the more clear.

So many people have taken "For God so loved the world" out of context and a great verse that demonstrates this is: 1 John 2:15 Do not love the world or the things in the world. If anyone loves the world, the love of the Father is not in him." Among other context is the flood account where God flooded the world, sparing only Noah and his family. Then there are verses like "do not be conformed to this world". I realize this response is a short answer, and so much more could be said, the doctrines of Grace are taught in the Gospel of John, with verses like:

John 6:44 "No one can come to Me unless the Father who sent Me draws him;

John 6:65 And He said, "Therefore I have said to you that no one can come to Me unless it has been granted to him by My Father."

John 8:34 Jesus answered them, "Most assuredly, I say to you, whoever commits sin is a slave of sin.

John 8:44 "You are of your father the devil, and the desires of your father you want to do.

John 17:2 "as You have given Him authority over all flesh, that He should give eternal life to as many as You have given Him.

John 17:9 "I pray for them. I do not pray for the world but for those whom You have given Me, for they are Yours. 10 "And all Mine are Yours, and Yours are Mine, and I am glorified in them.

John 10:11 "I am the good shepherd. The good shepherd gives His life for the sheep.

John 10:14 "I am the good shepherd; and I know My sheep, and am known by My own. 15 "As the Father knows Me, even so I know the Father; and I lay down My life for the sheep. 16 "And other sheep I have which are not of this fold; them also I must bring, and they will hear My voice; and there will be one flock and one shepherd.

John 10:26 "But you do not believe, because you are not of My sheep, as I said to you. 27 "My sheep hear My voice, and I know them, and they follow Me. 28 "And I give them eternal life, and they shall never perish; neither shall anyone snatch them out of My hand.

John 1:12 But as many as received Him, to them He gave the right to become children of God, to those who believe in His name: 13 who were born, not of blood, nor of the will of the flesh, nor of the will of man, but of God.

John 3:3 Jesus answered and said to him, "Most assuredly, I say to you, unless one is born again, he cannot see the kingdom of God." 4 Nicodemus said to Him, "How can a man be born when he is old? Can he enter a second time into his mother's womb and be born?" 5 Jesus answered, "Most assuredly, I say to you, unless one is born of water and the Spirit, he cannot enter the kingdom of God. 6 "That which is born of the flesh is flesh, and that which is born of the Spirit is spirit. 7 "Do not marvel that I said to you, 'You must be born again.'

John 5:21 "For as the Father raises the dead and gives life to them, even so the Son gives life to whom He will.

John 6:37 "All that the Father gives Me will come to Me, and the one who comes to Me I will by no means cast out.

John 6:64 "But there are some of you who do not believe." For Jesus knew from the beginning who they were who did not believe, and who would betray Him. 65 And He said, "Therefore I have said to you that no one can come to Me unless it has been granted to him by My Father."

John 6:47 "Most assuredly, I say to you, he who believes in Me has everlasting life.

If only I had time to go through each verse, I recommend reading them carefully, because they make no sense in the context of what is taught in so many Churches today. The doctrines of Total inability (Total Depravity), Particular Redemption (Limited Atonement), and Perseverance of the Saints (Preservance of the Saints or eternal security) should especially be evident from the above verses. Unconditional Election or Effectual Grace, is clearly taught here:

John 15:16 "You did not choose Me, but I chose you and appointed you that you should go and bear fruit, and that your fruit should remain, that whatever you ask the Father in My name He may give you.

Notice who chose who and the word "appointed"? Jesus disciples did not choose Him, He chose them. Notice "remain"? More than Unconditional Election is taught by Jesus in this one verse.

I'd like to briefly address another aspect of your question, because it also involved the Ordo salutis a Latin phrase for "order of salvation". Let me provide a link with helpful resources: HERE I recommend reading the introduction first, which provides the difference between Calvinists and Arminians. A key difference between the two is "monergistic regeneration" which all Calvinists hold to, which in plain simple terms means that salvation is the work of God alone, but does not mean that God is alone at every point of the process of salvation. In short, Calvinism does not leave man any room to boast whatsoever in salvation, nor is salvation dependent upon man's performance or lack of, and the work of Christ on the cross actually accomplished the salvation of whosoever God chose from all eternity, whosoever God has chosen He gives saving faith to and replaces the heart of stone with a heart of flesh, God alone does this, and all for His glory, all glory to God alone.

If I remember and get more time, I will try to remember to point you to more resources, but for now, a quick few:

13 FREE ebooks by R.C. Sproul, his "Crucial Questions" series

DOCTRINES OF GRACE - CATEGORIZED SCRIPTURE LIST

An aesthetically pleasing and well written summary of The Doctrines of Grace with Scripture proofs, Arminian objections answered and more.

Another list of proof texts by William J. Baldwin for the Doctrines of Grace

Desiring God resources on the Five Points of Calvinism

The links above do not contain small lists of verses, nor are they comprehensive. As you probably are aware, many will build doctrine around a verse or two, while the Scripture evidence for the system of theological doctrines nicknamed "Calvinism" is overwhelming, and yet strongly opposed. I am ashamed that I spent so many years as an Arminian, that I could not see through the theological blinders, and though I run against the grain of what is common, I am thankful the Potter graciously Re-formed me into the clay He has.

Wow ...thanks.

John 3:16