Question.....

[Leah]

Do you believe that hell glorifies God?

Why or why not?









PS - No drive by shootings, please. (iow, no personal attacks allowed in this discussion).

 

[Big Drew]

Not the modern, Dante's Inferno, version.

 

[LittleLambofJesus]

Do you believe that hell glorifies God?

Why or why not?

PS - No drive by shootings, please. (iow, no personal attacks allowed in this discussion).

LLOJ races to get in on this

 

[PilgrimToChrist]

Because God is just.

God wills "all men to be saved, and to come to the knowledge of the truth." (1Ti 2:4) but not with the sort of will that would attempt to force us to love Him. Some people simply do reject them and God judges them -- "It is a fearful thing to fall into the hands of the living God." (Heb 10:31). People who refuse to judge themselves while on earth, will be judged by God upon their death.

But God is also merciful, even to those who reject Him. Hell is a respite from the presence of God. To use an analogy, imagine there is someone you know (co-worker, neighbor, family, etc.) that you simply can't stand, the last thing you want to do is to spend time with them and indeed you go out of your way to avoid them. Souls who are judged see all their sins and run from the presence of God because He is so holy.

So by escaping the sensible presence of God, Hell is not as bad as it could be.

The pain of the damned is not infinite in quantity because the dear goodness of God sheds the ray of His mercy even in Hell. For man dead in sin merits infinite pain for an infinite time, but God's mercy has allotted infinity to him only in time and has determined the quantity of his pain; in justice God could have given him more pain.

So God is both glorified by their punishment, because it expresses His justice, and by tempering their punishment, because it expresses His mercy. Nevertheless, God is more glorified by the saints in Heaven who love Him since He has had mercy on them and sanctified them -- or else He would never have sent Jesus to save us since God does all things for His own glory.

 

[solarwave]

The hell of physical eternal pain definitely not.

I believe even a more abstract idea of people in hell would greatly grieve God.

Im inclined to say it doesn't glorify God and is a very sad state of affairs.

 

[PROPHECYKID]

Do you believe that hell glorifies God?

Why or why not?









PS - No drive by shootings, please. (iow, no personal attacks allowed in this discussion).

No. God is not willing that any should perish.

 

[Noxot]

all of Gods works glorify him! because God is Good and only does Good, and if he only does Good then it must be glorifying Him.

 

[Timothew]

LLOJ races to get in on this

Oh Boy! Another Hell Thread! Count me in!



Edit to add, oops, I didn't see the PS about no driveby shootings.
OK, this might still be fun.

 

[solarwave]

all of Gods works glorify him! because God is Good and only does Good, and if he only does Good then it must be glorifying Him.

Does God send people to hell then or do people send themselves there?

 

[bibleblevr]

Does it exist?

Then yes. Being part of his perfect plan, it, like all other things, work together for good.

 

[Noxot]

Does God send people to hell then or do people send themselves there?

since people have free will they choose which path to tread. since God is Judge he has made a place for every path since he created everything visible and invisible; corporeal and incorporeal. God orders everything for Good.

 

[Timothew]

since people have free will they choose which path to tread. since God is Judge he has made a place for every path since he created everything visible and invisible; corporeal and incorporeal. God orders everything for Good.

living and nonliving?

 

[Leah]

Alright, question #2:

How come so many people always talk about how loving and merciful God is but leave out all the rest like....God is just, and holy, and righteous? In today's modern world, you don't hear hardly anything about those characteristics of God. No, nowandays people wanna pick and choose what they consider the good stuff about Him and leave out all that talk about justice and HOLINESS. Yes, its not His desire for any to perish but for all to come to repentance. Its also true that only a corrupt judge would not punish crime. And we all know (or at least we should know) that God is in no way corrupt, so its a good thing He does judge sin, which leads me to believe that He's also trustworthy.


Question #3:

Why did God create hell for the devil and his angels and why are there people there now?

 

[PROPHECYKID]

Alright, question #2:

How come so many people always talk about how loving and merciful God is but leave out all the rest like....God is just, and holy, and righteous? In today's modern world, you don't hear hardly anything about those characteristics of God. No, nowandays people wanna pick and choose what they consider the good stuff about Him and leave out all that talk about justice and HOLINESS. Yes, its not His desire for any to perish but for all to come to repentance. Its also true that only a corrupt judge would not punish crime. And we all know (or at least we should know) that God is in no way corrupt, so its a good thing He does judge sin, which leads me to believe that He's also trustworthy.

Because in our modern society we don't want to talk about holiness and righteousness at all. But thats not everyone.

Question #3:

Why did God create hell for the devil and his angels and why are there people there now?

The hell that you are referring to, does not exist now. The devil and his angels are free to roam the earth now and cause trouble. After the 1000 years then the lake of fire will burn and destroy the devil and his angels.

 

[LittleLambofJesus]

Because in our modern society we don't want to talk about holiness and righteousness at all. But thats not everyone.

The hell that you are referring to, does not exist now. The devil and his angels are free to roam the earth now and cause trouble.
After the 1000 years then the lake of fire will burn and destroy the devil and his angels.

Well at least the wascalwy Beast and FP are chuncked into the LoF first ehehe

Reve 19:20 and is arrested the Beast and with it the False Prophet, the one doing the signs in view of it, in which has deceived the ones getting the mark of the beast and the ones worshipping to the image of it.
Living were cast the two into the Lake of the Fireof the one burning in sulphur/qeiw <2303>.

Reve 14:11 And the smoke of the tormenting of them into ages of ages is ascending,

http://www.christianforums.com/t7434988/
OC Jerusalem and Lake of Fire

 

[Timothew]

Alright, question #2:

How come so many people always talk about how loving and merciful God is but leave out all the rest like....God is just, and holy, and righteous? In today's modern world, you don't hear hardly anything about those characteristics of God. No, nowandays people wanna pick and choose what they consider the good stuff about Him and leave out all that talk about justice and HOLINESS. Yes, its not His desire for any to perish but for all to come to repentance. Its also true that only a corrupt judge would not punish crime. And we all know (or at least we should know) that God is in no way corrupt, so its a good thing He does judge sin, which leads me to believe that He's also trustworthy.


Question #3:

Why did God create hell for the devil and his angels and why are there people there now?

#2

What does God's HOLINESS have to do with whether or not there is a place called Hell where sinners burn alive forever?

If the bible says that sinners burn alive forever, then it's true, and God is Holy.

If the bible does not say that that sinners burn alive forever, then it's not true to say that they do, and God is still Holy.

It is my position that the bible does not say that sinners burn alive forever. Feel free to correct me using bible verses.

#3

How do you know that God created hell for the devil and his angels and how do you know that there are people there now.

 

[Leah]

How do I know? Ummm...because the bible says so? Matthew 25:41, 2 Thessalonians 1:3-10 (yeah, God's gonna get them), Revelation 20:11-15, 21:8 just to name a few, or are ya'll going to tell me I'm not reading those scriptures right and that they really don't mean what they say?

Now, if people are going to be in the Great White Throne Judgement, then that lets me know that they'll be in that because they've rejected and thumbed their noses at Jesus Christ and felt they didn't need Him all their lives. When someone dies without Christ, where do they go? They don't just vanish or cease to exist. They go somewhere. So....there is a hell and there will be a lake of fire.


How is it that some think because heaven is such a wonderul place (and it is) that glorifies God because only those who've been redeemed by the blood of the Christ and put their trust in Him will be occupying it and will serve and worship Him forever ....but hell doesn't glorify God just because of how awful it is and that because of who He is, it doesn't make sense that He would even make such a place?

 

[PROPHECYKID]

How do I know? Ummm...because the bible says so? Matthew 25:41, 2 Thessalonians 1:3-10 (yeah, God's gonna get them), Revelation 20:11-15, 21:8 just to name a few, or are ya'll going to tell me I'm not reading those scriptures right and that they really don't mean what they say?

Now, if people are going to be in the Great White Throne Judgement, then that lets me know that they'll be in that because they've rejected and thumbed their noses at Jesus Christ and felt they didn't need Him all their lives. When someone dies without Christ, where do they go? They don't just vanish or cease to exist. They go somewhere. So....there is a hell and there will be a lake of fire.


How is it that some think because heaven is such a wonderul place (and it is) that glorifies God because only those who've been redeemed by the blood of the Christ and put their trust in Him will be occupying it and will serve and worship Him forever ....but hell doesn't glorify God just because of how awful it is and that because of who He is, it doesn't make sense that He would even make such a place?

God made Lucifer. Satan doesn't glorify God. God knew he would rebel and still made him. God made a hell for people like Satan. Why does everything have to glorify God? To glorify is to give glory to correct? God is not willing that anyone should perish so the destruction of humans can never glorify God. That is my opinion on it.

 

[Timothew]

How do I know? Ummm...because the bible says so? Matthew 25:41, 2 Thessalonians 1:3-10 (yeah, God's gonna get them), Revelation 20:11-15, 21:8 just to name a few, or are ya'll going to tell me I'm not reading those scriptures right and that they really don't mean what they say?

Now, if people are going to be in the Great White Throne Judgement, then that lets me know that they'll be in that because they've rejected and thumbed their noses at Jesus Christ and felt they didn't need Him all their lives. When someone dies without Christ, where do they go? They don't just vanish or cease to exist. They go somewhere. So....there is a hell and there will be a lake of fire.


How is it that some think because heaven is such a wonderul place (and it is) that glorifies God because only those who've been redeemed by the blood of the Christ and put their trust in Him will be occupying it and will serve and worship Him forever ....but hell doesn't glorify God just because of how awful it is and that because of who He is, it doesn't make sense that He would even make such a place?

I'm sorry, I wasn't asking "how do you know" to be offensive. It's a question I tend to ask a lot. I also ask "What do you mean by such and such?" a lot.

Matthew 25:41 doesn't say hell, it says "the eternal fire."

Matthew 25 also doesn't say that there are people in the fire right now, it says that they will go into the fire on the day that the Son of Man returns.

2 Thessalonians 1:6-10 NASB

For after all it is only just for God to repay with affliction those who afflict you, and to give relief to you who are afflicted and to us as well when the Lord Jesus will be revealed from heaven with His mighty angels in flaming fire, dealing out retribution to those who do not know God and to those who do not obey the gospel of our Lord Jesus. These will pay the penalty of eternal destruction, away from the presence of the Lord and from the glory of His power, when He comes to be glorified in His saints on that day, and to be marveled at among all who have believed&#8212;for our testimony to you was believed.

This says they will be destroyed (the greek word is word that we get "lethal" from, olethron) when the Lord returns. This destruction, death, is eternal because it is permanent. It doesn't say that they will be tortured now or on that day.

Here is Revelation 20:11-15, NASB

Then I saw a great white throne and Him who sat upon it, from whose presence earth and heaven fled away, and no place was found for them. And I saw the dead, the great and the small, standing before the throne, and books were opened; and another book was opened, which is thebook of life; and the dead were judged from the things which were written in the books, according to their deeds. And the sea gave up the dead which were in it, and death and Hades gave up the dead which were in them; and they were judged, every one of them according to their deeds. Then death and Hades were thrown into the lake of fire. This is the second death, the lake of fire. And if anyone&#8217;s name was not found written in the book of life, he was thrown into the lake of fire.

This explains the fire, here and in Matthew. The fire is the second death. The lake of fire is not torture, it is death.

So, How do you know that someone goes somewhere when they die?
I've seen dead people, I guess they were going somewhere, they were in a hearst going to the cemetary. But Jesus said "Truly, truly, I say to you, he who hears My word, and believes Him who sent Me, has eternal life, and does not come into judgment, but has passed out of death into life. Truly, truly, I say to you, an hour is coming and now is, when the dead will hear the voice of the Son of God, and those who hear will live. (John 5:24-25)

 

[Noxot]

living and nonliving?

what do you mean by nonliving? and what do you mean by living?