Question What is the difference between Baptist ,and Assemblies of God?

[OurSimpleLife]

Anyone? Question What is the difference between Baptist ,and Assemblies of God?

 

[Bob Carabbio]

Baptists tend toward "Cessationism" - i.e. the "Giifts of the Spirit" seen throughout the Bible were withdrawn whenever the Canon of Scripture was completed ( Cor 13:8 supposedly). ANd while most Baptists ARE NOT 5-point Calvinists, they TEND TOWARD Calvinist beliefs, And Generally preach Once Saved ALWAYS saved thology.

The Assemblies of God is a "FULL Gospel" denomination, and believes in the CONTINUATION of the Gifts of the SPirit, and in a Second experience AFTER salvation called "the Baptism in the Holy Spirit" which is normally accompanied by the person so affected being able to speak in a "tongue". The AoG are NOT strict Wesleyan Arminians, but are definitly Wesleyan/Arminian in nature. They don't ascribe to "Unconditional perseverance" (OSAS), and believe that one's salvation CAN BE lost.

 

[bushinoki]

To tack on to what Bob said, there are many similarities. AoG holds a similar polity to Baptists, holding to a more congregational model, with fellowship in the AoG being fairly loose and by consent of the local church.

 

[mikedsjr]

How do you define Weslyan/Arminianism?

 

[Alithis]

Anyone? Question What is the difference between Baptist ,and Assemblies of God?

Depends a bit on demography a bit.. in some cases the only difference is the spelling

 

[bushinoki]

mike, if you're familiar with 5 point Calvinism, Arminianism basically believes the opposite. Free will vs. total depravity, Conditional election vs. unconditional election, unlimited vs. limited atonement, resistible vs. irresistible grace, and perseverance of some vs. all saints.

John Wesley was the first preacher of what would later become the Holiness and Higher Life movements, which Pentecostalism was born out of.

That is why Pentecostal denominations tend to lean toward Arminianism, whereas the Baptists come out of the Anabaptist movement, which is influenced by Calvinism, and the American flavor of Baptist theology was heavily influenced by the Pilgrims and Puritans of New England, which were very much influenced by Calvinism and Reformed theology.

 

[Alithis]

mike, if you're familiar with 5 point Calvinism, Arminianism basically believes the opposite. Free will vs. total depravity, Conditional election vs. unconditional election, unlimited vs. limited atonement, resistible vs. irresistible grace, and perseverance of some vs. all saints.

John Wesley was the first preacher of what would later become the Holiness and Higher Life movements, which Pentecostalism was born out of.

That is why Pentecostal denominations tend to lean toward Arminianism, whereas the Baptists come out of the Anabaptist movement, which is influenced by Calvinism, and the American flavor of Baptist theology was heavily influenced by the Pilgrims and Puritans of New England, which were very much influenced by Calvinism and Reformed theology.

sounds all very theological.
but in everyday contemporary life.. take the sign off the door of some..and you would be struggling to know which your in

 

[mikedsjr]

I asked because there is classical Arminisnism and i guess what you would call Weslyam Arminianism. Would you classify Weslyan Arminianism pelegian?

 

[bushinoki]

I haven't actually studied Pelegianism yet, so I can't tell you. I run the middle here, as I was raised Baptist, but am now a Pentecostal.

Michael, that is very true. There are Pentecostals that like to sing the old songs from a hymnal, as well as Baptists who prefer modern worship bands and projectors. Only the "mainline" denominations have any real differences you can see in a service, and those are just a matter of form, not substance.

 

[JGGray6]

Assemblies of God also are a louder people, more excitement in worship and a lot of them also have more "hell fire" type preachers.

 

[Alithis]

yes ,things have changed.i presently attend a pentecostal-baptist church

 

[bushinoki]

Mike, no I would not classify Wesleyan Arminianism as Pelagian. There are branches of Pentecostalism that come fairly close to Pelagianism, and a few extreme groups that have crossed that line, but the majority of Pentecostals are Orthodox in core theology.

You will find different levels of Arminianism in Pentecostal churches as well. It's not confined to or defined by one denomination or another. Foursquare leans Higher Life, Church of God leans Holiness, and AoG has a fair amount of influence from the Methodists and Baptists. But, individual churches will have their own characteristics. There are Foursquare churches that lean a little more Holiness than Higher Life, and there are AoG that lean toward Higher Life, and away from the Methodist/Baptist roots of the denomination. Those roots go back to the Azusa St. Revival, and the subsequent founding of AoG, when suddenly a lot of Methodists and a few Baptists found themselves somewhat unwelcome in their home denominations.

Over the decades, however, there has been some trading back and forth, depending on the needs of an individual congregation. A qualified AoG minister could well end up serving at a Foursquare Church, and vice versa. In reality, the lines are so blurred between the three main Pentecostal Denominations that I have attended all three, and can barely even tell the difference.

 

[mikedsjr]

Do you consider the churches getting close to pelegianism heretical?

Also, what do you mean holiness and higher life?

Does Pentecostalism believe the canon is not closed? Meaning God is revealing new information today via visions, instead of Scripture being all the revealed Truth God has given us?

 

[bushinoki]

I consider blatant Pelagianism to be heretical. We are all born in sin, and through sin death entered the world. Death was not a physical necessity.

Holiness and Higher Life refer to theologies of Sanctification. The main difference between the two is methodical, really. I forget which is which, but in Pentecostal terms, one has to do with Sanctification and increase in the Gifts of the Spirit, and the other has to do with the Gifts of the Spirit and Sanctification. Both believe that Sanctification is an ongoing process, and that as a person matures in the Christian Faith, they should be living holier and holier lives, and that as a person continues growing in the Holy Spirit, it should become harder for them to sin. As I stated in my last post, there is much blurring of the lines, so it is hard to distinguish the difference anymore.

I think of comparative theology among Orthodox Christianity to be like comparing different kinds of apples. There are different colors and different shades of those colors, but if you cut the apple in half and look at the fruit and core, there is no real difference. I enjoy discussing comparative theology, and wish some modern preachers would see that it is taught in their churches. It helps a lot to know how we relate to the other members of the Body of Christ, and would help promote better mission work.

 

[Alithis]

i think both views are an intellectual pile of carnality based reasoning

-except you become as little children .....

and some will throw in with when i was a child...

but both views are biblical....
predestination is preached under the inspiration of the holy spirit... (and imo comprehended fully by none save God.

and free will to choose good over evil is clearly declared the same way by the same Holy Spirit when God declares through the prophets that,if a man lives unrighteously ,then turns from his ways and does what is right,he shall live and not die...

seeing that both are present leads me to the conclusion that we must walk humbly before God and let God be Judge.

 

[mikedsjr]

Michael, to what official doctrine in the Pentecostal church teaches anyone can "turn from his ways and do what is right, he shall live"? I didn't find that in the Official Assembly of God Statement of Faith. What I mean is it doesn't sound remotely like orthodox Pentecostal doctrine. One could never come away from Pentecostalism and claim they have a reformed viewpoint. They can't mix at all. But claiming one can turn and be good isn't even Arminian theology either.

 

[Alithis]

for me the official doctrine is the word of God and understanding of it is given by The Holy spirit. so if the bible appears to say both,then- it says both and the only thing lacking is my comprehension.
if i then intellectually form a doctrine using only the parts of scripture which i have predetermined to accept then i walk in the flesh and provide means by which the body is divided.
denominations are after all -division. too much carnal intellectual guff that a few folk debated oh so long ago are ,in effect now become the foundation of present divisions.and possibly more then half of what either said was misconstrued as to the nature in which it was said.

so i maintain.. as one born again of the holy Spirit,we should walk humbly before God and let God be judge.