Question for sabbath day observers

[\o/]

These are honest questions for any sabbath day observer (whether [1] Friday sunset to Saturday sunset or [2] Saturday midnight to Sunday midnight or [3] Saturday sunrise to Saturday sunset or [4] Saturday high noon to Sunday high noon):

Q: Which people are first to observe the sabbath on the planet every week?
A: People immediately west of the International Dateline.

Q: What if history would be different in such a way that Asian explorers representing their powerful nations had "discovered" America and settled it (before the Europeans) and then explored futher from the Americas to Europe/Africa (rather than the other way around)?
A: The international dateline would have been placed in the Atlantic instead of the Pacific in the late 1800's!

What day would you be observing as the sabbath in that case? Would it not be a day earlier than your present sabbath day?

 

 

[Job_38]

Actually, a highly believed theory is that Asians were here first, in Northern America, and mated with someone and we had the North American Indians.

 

[\o/]

Hooray for the comment.   

But did you answer my questions?

 

[\o/]

Do newcomers have any thoughts on this?

 

[JohnR7]

The new day begins at dawn in Jerusalam. The Hebrew Calander is different than the Greek Calander.

It takes 364 1/4 days for the earth to go all the way around the Sun and there are 13 new moons in a year. It is pretty hard to come up with a calander when you have to deal with that.

Life would be a lot easier if there were 12 new moons and they were exactly 30 days apart, and the year was exactly 360 days.

 

[seebs]

I honestly don't think it makes the slightest difference, as long as it's a reasonable effort at "one day a week".

Depending on my schedule, I generally celebrate it somewhere between Friday evening and Sunday night. I don't think the specific day is important.

 

[\o/]

Just any "one day a week" didn't work for this man:

NUM 15:32 While the Israelites were in the desert, a man was found gathering wood on the Sabbath day. 33 Those who found him gathering wood brought him to Moses and Aaron and the whole assembly, 34 and they kept him in custody, because it was not clear what should be done to him. 35 Then the LORD said to Moses, "The man must die. The whole assembly must stone him outside the camp." 36 So the assembly took him outside the camp and stoned him to death, as the LORD commanded Moses.

 

[paulewog]

Actually, the sabbath doesnt' need to be celebrated anymore...

 

[\o/]

Not according to the Pope of Rome or Mormons (Sunday as Sabbath) or Seventh Day Baptists or other sabbatarians. The same original questions could be posed to "Churches of Christ" in the way they regard the supposed "Lord's Day" (to them, Sunday).

 

[\o/]

Isaiah 66
22 "As the new heavens and the new earth that I make will endure before me," declares the LORD , "so will your name and descendants endure. 23 From one New Moon to another and from one Sabbath to another, all mankind will come and bow down before me," says the LORD .

So, whether you believe the sabbath is not to be celebrated NOW is irrelevant to questions in the light of this passage if it refers to a future event.

 

[seebs]

Christ, clearly fairly mad, asked the Pharisees if, should a cow fall in a well on the Sabbath, they would wait until the next day to get it out. I think it's pretty clear that, now that we are not a small tribe trying to maintain cultural unity while surrounded by pagans, it's less crucial that we count days exactly than it used to be.

 

[panterapat]

RM,

For Christians, the Sababath Day (Saturday) has been replaced with celebration of Jesus' ressurrection (Sunday). The exact day is kind of irrelevant for through time and changing to different calanders, our time record is imperfect. The important thing is that it is our INTENTION to celebrate and make holy the Sabbath Day (Now Sunday). It is now accepted that Sunday is Sunday no matter where the International Date Line is located. The Sabbath was created for man, not man for the Sabbath.

In Christ, Patrick

 

[Rafael]

It is more crucial to understand that our rest is no longer in a day, but in Jesus Christ. We rest from our labors in Him. His work accomplished our rest, which is what sabbath means. Our labor is to have faith in that which God has provided with the better covenant:

Matthew 12:8 For the Son of man is Lord even of the sabbath day.

Colossians 2:16 Let no man therefore judge you in meat, or in drink, or in respect of an holyday, or of the new moon, or of the sabbath days:

Hebrews 4:3 For we which have believed do enter into rest, as he said, As I have sworn in my wrath, if they shall enter into my rest: although the works were finished from the foundation of the world.

Hebrews 4:9 There remaineth therefore a rest to the people of God.
Hebrews 4:10 For he that is entered into his rest, he also hath ceased from his own works, as God did from his.
Hebrews 4:11 Let us labour therefore to enter into that rest, lest any man fall after the same example of unbelief

Hebrews 8:6 But now hath he obtained a more excellent ministry, by how much also he is the mediator of a better covenant, which was established upon better promises.
Hebrews 8:7 For if that first covenant had been faultless, then should no place have been sought for the second.
Hebrews 8:8 For finding fault with them, he saith, Behold, the days come, saith the Lord, when I will make a new covenant with the house of Israel and with the house of Judah:

 

[Arnold_Philips]

Not really an answer, but you may be interested in this: http://www.benabraham.com. It's an incredibly long read if you read each essay like I did, but it was interesting enough I suppose. Sumamrily, it says that the seal God will give his people in the end times is determined by whether or not they worship on the true Sabbath (Saturday) or not. It makes great distinctions between Saturday and Sunday, and why Sunday is so entirely Satanic. The essays' mere volume makes the evidence compelling, but . . . you know how it goes, God will tell you if it's coming correct of straight fronting.

 

[Vill]

Your question is valid, and we can only be sure about Israel in keeping the 7 day/week cycle and the Sabbath in specific.

On planet earth we have to start the day somewhere and as far as I know, the bible is silent about where on the planet a new day should begin.

Man have decided to put the "International Date Line" to mark the begining of a new day(sunset, 12.00am, sunrise, etc) but we have to be careful.

If you look at the Phillipines(before 1845), Samoa(before 1892) or more recently Kiribati(1995), they all changed the order of the day. Take Samoa for instance, they celebrate the 4th(Monday) of July 1892 twice in a row.

It is obvious from the above example(day light saving as well) that man have changed the day(Sabbath) according to his/her needs.

My suggestion is, instead of following the calender(Sunday-Saturday) by name, follow it by number(1-7) and keep the international date line straight like the SDA in the Kingdom of Tonga and also use the sun(God's watch-the Lord's Sabbath)

 

[hraedisc]

Related links:

http://www.theologyforums.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=2542

http://geography.about.com/gi/dynam....navy.mil/AA/faq/docs/international_date.html

http://www.star-k.org/kashrus/kk-trav-dateline.htm

http://www.star-k.org/kashrus/kk-trav-dateline2.htm

 

[thetruthseeker]

Originally posted by raphe
It is more crucial to understand that our rest is no longer in a day, but in Jesus Christ. We rest from our labors in Him. His work accomplished our rest, which is what sabbath means. Our labor is to have faith in that which God has provided with the better covenant:

Matthew 12:8 For the Son of man is Lord even of the sabbath day.

Colossians 2:16 Let no man therefore judge you in meat, or in drink, or in respect of an holyday, or of the new moon, or of the sabbath days:

Hebrews 4:3 For we which have believed do enter into rest, as he said, As I have sworn in my wrath, if they shall enter into my rest: although the works were finished from the foundation of the world.

Hebrews 4:9 There remaineth therefore a rest to the people of God.
Hebrews 4:10 For he that is entered into his rest, he also hath ceased from his own works, as God did from his.
Hebrews 4:11 Let us labour therefore to enter into that rest, lest any man fall after the same example of unbelief

Hebrews 8:6 But now hath he obtained a more excellent ministry, by how much also he is the mediator of a better covenant, which was established upon better promises.
Hebrews 8:7 For if that first covenant had been faultless, then should no place have been sought for the second.
Hebrews 8:8 For finding fault with them, he saith, Behold, the days come, saith the Lord, when I will make a new covenant with the house of Israel and with the house of Judah:

Please have a look at the link below. We've already discussed this (post 6).

http://www.christianforums.com/threads/23454-23.html

Your brother in Christ,
TheTruthSeeker

 

[hraedisc]

Originally posted by \o/
These are honest questions for any sabbath day observer (whether [1] Friday sunset to Saturday sunset or [2] Saturday midnight to Sunday midnight or [3] Saturday sunrise to Saturday sunset or [4] Saturday high noon to Sunday high noon):

Q: Which people are first to observe the sabbath on the planet every week?
A: People immediately west of the International Dateline.

Q: What if history would be different in such a way that Asian explorers representing their powerful nations had "discovered" America and settled it (before the Europeans) and then explored futher from the Americas to Europe/Africa (rather than the other way around)?
A: The international dateline would have been placed in the Atlantic instead of the Pacific in the late 1800's!

What day would you be observing as the sabbath in that case? Would it not be a day earlier than your present sabbath day?

 

 

[thetruthseeker]

Originally posted by <><

Hi <><,

First of all, before I answer this question, I want to ask you what you believe the Bible teaches regarding the validity of Sabbath (Saturday) day, today. Do you believe that we should keep the Sabbath (Saturday)? Please give me a Biblical answer.

Your brother in Christ,
TheTruthSeeker

 

[seangoh]

why was the poster banned? ...hmm....just wondering.