Purity Pledges

[Luther073082]

Ok I have to ask a question, does anyone go to a church that tries to get their youth to take virginty pledges? And if so at what age do they take them usually?

Ok before you answer I want to lay out my basic problem with them.

1. Problem the church uses the same forces that often cause the students to do it anyways. The biggest factor in this is of course peer pressure. If you refuse to take one then there is a clear fear that you are going to be judged or talked about behind your back.

2. Problem: Often these are done at way too young of an age. Let me ask you a question, is a 14 year old old enough in our culture to choose to have sex? Most adults both Christian and secular would answer with a clear no. But then why is it that we think that people ho are not old enough to choose to have sex are old enough to choose to NOT have sex until they are married?

To me its no wonder these committments are often broken. We use the same forces get them to choose to not have sex til marriage as are used to get them to have sex. While some may take them seriously, a lot of them might just be doing it out of peer pressure.

And then we ask them to make this committment at far too young of an age. Think about this, you are asking a 14 year old to make a committment about something that will probably last for at least for the next 10 years. When was the last time you thought a 14 year old could commit to something for 10 years? Honestly I've taught 14 y/o's before and I don't think most of them are mature enough to make a month long committment, much less a 10 year + commitment.

Honestly I think we should simpily educate from our point of view and ask them to commit to celibacy til marriage to themselves in their hearts. And of course get parents involved too.

The thing is that secular society keeps saying that these pledges don't work because the drive for sex is too powerful. That is Satan speaking telling kids they can't do it so why try?

Christians of course will say that their faith was not strong enough or that they where overcome by their lust or that the culture overtook them. . . Well that is true as it was probably the motivator for th sin.

But what we overlook is the problem that we use the same tatics as secular society and we try to do it when someone is too young to make that kind of decision.

JMO anyone agree, disagree?

 

[Schutte]

I will say upfront I am a huge fan of purity pledges. They don't work 100%, but they do greatly help. Also, they push back the time that those who do chose to have sex wait, which gives them a chance to make a more educated decision, even if it is the wrong one.

As for what age to give the pledges, freshman year of high school is where I would start. This doesn't mean that sex ed. in your youth group should start that late. From 6th grade up there should be a open culture in your youth group about sex. Everyone in your youth group should at least know the Bible says, "Sex is for Married People" and should believe that it is really God's will.

One of my most heartbreaking nights in ministry was when I worked at a camp and two girls who just got out of their freshman year of high school were in tears because they had lost their virginity a few weeks before. I had no control on that, but either did anyone else because no one told them the basic truth: Sex is for Married People.

This is too important not to do anything and everything to stop it. That is my two cents,. Love it or hate it, its how I feel. Keep fighting it however you do!

 

[Luther073082]

I will say upfront I am a huge fan of purity pledges. They don't work 100%, but they do greatly help. Also, they push back the time that those who do chose to have sex wait, which gives them a chance to make a more educated decision, even if it is the wrong one.

As for what age to give the pledges, freshman year of high school is where I would start. This doesn't mean that sex ed. in your youth group should start that late. From 6th grade up there should be a open culture in your youth group about sex. Everyone in your youth group should at least know the Bible says, "Sex is for Married People" and should believe that it is really God's will.

One of my most heartbreaking nights in ministry was when I worked at a camp and two girls who just got out of their freshman year of high school were in tears because they had lost their virginity a few weeks before. I had no control on that, but either did anyone else because no one told them the basic truth: Sex is for Married People.

This is too important not to do anything and everything to stop it. That is my two cents,. Love it or hate it, its how I feel. Keep fighting it however you do!

Well here is my issue with it. . .

We should keep telling them that sex if for married people you are correct in that.

The pledge is a different animal though. The kids are too young to choose sex, so we can't ask them to choose not to have sex. You can not take a pledge from a 14 year old and expect it to be upheld. They are too young and they are doing it partially because they are afraid of gossip and rumors if they refuse to take the pledge.

Honestly I havn't been to one of these but if you are sitting in youth group and 30 other kids get up and take this pledge would you want to be the only one who didn't take the pledge in front of everyone? Especially if you are a girl. The rumors that she sleeps around would run wild because of her refusal to take a celibicy pledge til she is married. When realisitically she could very easily be the person to go on til 36 and be a virgin while the rest of them start having sex when they are 16.

I'm just saying we can't tell them they are too young for sex and at the same time belive they are old enough to choose not to have sex til a undefined time. (As no one knows when they will marry.)

I'm just saying tell them sex is for married people, teach them as best you can to remain pure.

But when we use the pledge we are using peer pressure on a vurnerable and young 14 year old. Peer pressure is powerful especially on the young.

There was an experiment where a scientist put 20 people in a room and asked them a simple question. 19 people where paid actors and where told to give the wrong answer. The 20th person didn't know about any of this. So the scientist goes around and asks each person something like "What is 2 + 2" and all 19 actors say "3" the 20th person looks dumbfounded but will not stand up and say the right answer of "4" but instead says "3".

And the pledges did nothing but make those kids feel more shame. Face it pledge or no pledge they are going to do it if they want to anyways. A pledge at 14 doesn't change that.

But with no pledge we say "Hey listen that was a dumb dumb thing to do, and it was a sin. But Christ forgives sins and we know that. Don't do it again, you know all the bad things that can happen when you have pre-marital sex and you may get away with it this time, but next time you might not be so lucky." And you can council them on God's word alone about the fornication alone.

But if they took a pledge now they feel even more ashamed because they've just violated a pledge that they took at an age that they where too young to realistically commit to anything and they did mostly because everyone else was doing it.

Now to them they feel like they have just gone back on their word which makes them feel more ashamed. They are ashamed because now they feel like they broke their promise when honestly it was a promise that they where too young to give.

Pledges are ment for adults not children. An adult can better understand what they are getting themselves into when they make that pledge and can be held to account for breaking it.

I'm sorry a 14 year old kid has no clue what they are getting themselves into and definatly has no understanding of the pressure that is only going to increase for them to have sex. A pressure that I don't think people will fully understand until their mid 20's. (PM me if you want to know why I say that)

Plus I think the pledge causes the kids to focus more on the pledge then the reasons for it. I say you just lay out your reasons, keep it at that and if they do have sex remind them why they should stop and not do it anymore. Cause if they focus on the pledge, then violate it, I think they belive that since they broke their pledge it doesn't matter anymore. BUT the problem is it does matter, every day matters not just one day. So they lost their virginity, what they choose to do the next day, keep having sex because they think it doesn't matter anymore or stop having sex because we have throughly convinced them it was a bad idea and a mistake and they shouldn't do it again.

Just my opinion

 

[Schutte]

So I think you are more concerned about the way the pledges are done than that they exist. We are doing the pledges with our senor high next month and the way we are doing it is to give them the card, box, wrapping paper, and a bow and telling them that they are going to choose when they get home to make that commitment to their future spouses and that purity is the ultimate gift for marriage.

Also, 14 is not too young. I cannot over emphasize that. Kids are having sex at that age. If you haven't seen it in your own group, that is amazing, but the fact is, it is happening, we can either go all out with trying to stop it, or we can live in fear of the awkward. Personally, I would rather look the fool 1000x's in a row that to see a kid lose the purity. Maybe I am just crazy.

Last but not least is the shame of failure. A kid with basic knowledge of grace knows forgiveness. Just make sure your kids know that and they should be fine for the most part. There is a small chance for shame, but aren't you ashamed when you mess up? I know I am.

I realize we are very different about this, but bringing it up is what is so cool about being open christians!

 

[Luther073082]

So I think you are more concerned about the way the pledges are done than that they exist. We are doing the pledges with our senor high next month and the way we are doing it is to give them the card, box, wrapping paper, and a bow and telling them that they are going to choose when they get home to make that commitment to their future spouses and that purity is the ultimate gift for marriage.

Also, 14 is not too young. I cannot over emphasize that. Kids are having sex at that age. If you haven't seen it in your own group, that is amazing, but the fact is, it is happening, we can either go all out with trying to stop it, or we can live in fear of the awkward. Personally, I would rather look the fool 1000x's in a row that to see a kid lose the purity. Maybe I am just crazy.

Last but not least is the shame of failure. A kid with basic knowledge of grace knows forgiveness. Just make sure your kids know that and they should be fine for the most part. There is a small chance for shame, but aren't you ashamed when you mess up? I know I am.

I realize we are very different about this, but bringing it up is what is so cool about being open christians!

Oh I know kids are having sex that young, but they are too young to make that decision. So why are they old enough to make the decision not to.

If an adult wants to make a committment like that then that is their right and choice. But I think these kids are too young to make the commitment.

Plus honestly I don't like how we make it out to be this ultra-romantic gift. Kind of like a sexual version of a Disney movie where everything is romantic and everything. Here is the problem, these kids actually belive they are in love when they are teenagers and that this is the person that they will marry. For 95% of them that isn't true but you can't tell them otherwise.

We could add that in but this whole romance thing has become too big of a part of it. To a 14 year old it makes it sound like being a non-virgin ruins the romance of marriage and once they grow out of their disney movie ideas of love they begin to realize that it isn't true.

For me, I'd rather just concentrate on the facts. STI's, pregnancy, emotional pain.

 

[Godslilgurlalways]

I will say upfront I am a huge fan of purity pledges. They don't work 100%, but they do greatly help. Also, they push back the time that those who do chose to have sex wait, which gives them a chance to make a more educated decision, even if it is the wrong one.

As for what age to give the pledges, freshman year of high school is where I would start. This doesn't mean that sex ed. in your youth group should start that late. From 6th grade up there should be a open culture in your youth group about sex. Everyone in your youth group should at least know the Bible says, "Sex is for Married People" and should believe that it is really God's will.

One of my most heartbreaking nights in ministry was when I worked at a camp and two girls who just got out of their freshman year of high school were in tears because they had lost their virginity a few weeks before. I had no control on that, but either did anyone else because no one told them the basic truth: Sex is for Married People.

This is too important not to do anything and everything to stop it. That is my two cents,. Love it or hate it, its how I feel. Keep fighting it however you do!

I agree with just about everything you said. I think it's about finding what age does a level of maurity becomes extistent. I think there is a possiblity that the ages for girls might be different then the age of boys.


I think that 15-16 years old is a good age for girls and boys. It's hard to say for the boys though. I think it's something that shouldn't be force for them to do. I think it should be a voluntary thing. Also, if they happen to be one of the few people who have done it before they reach the age of 15-16 I think it would be good to let them know that they can still do it. They can pledge to start over again or from that point forward not to do it anymore or something of the sort. I think a good idea is also after making the pledge give them a purity ring. It would be up to them whether to wear it or not though. Even if doing this helps one person to wait till their married then it's already worth it

 

[heymikey80]

A couple of comments.

I would strongly advise, if you haven't told your teens about the absolute purity God wants from them before marriage: do so. This isn't about drinking, which is arguable. This isn't about smoking or doing drugs, which have serious adverse effects, but aren't talked-about directly in Scripture. This is about sex, where a person essentially hurts themselves and damages the credibility of their faith.

Start there.

You know where I go next? I go to the martyrs: teens and 12, 13, 14 year old kids who already made up their minds without youth peer pressure ... and who were put to death over it. Agnes, Perpetua, Katherine, and Justin come to mind (though I don't know how old Justin was).

Your next issue will be grappling with kids who already have a sexual relationship with someone. Then your next issue will be with kids who are dealing with the guilt -- and those who aren't.

Does my church have some kind of a "third sacrament" of no sex before marriage? Well, no. But the persistent, clear sound of the ministry is this. We give them the information, the commands from God, and the examples that represented the purity of Christians to the whole ancient world.

It's powerful information in the hands of idealistic, honest Christians. Because they have the same Spirit living within them. In the hands of unbelievers, it's nothing.

 

[Berniquen]

I signed a formal purity pledge when I was in Jr. High. -- I know work with the High School students at my church. -- As far as I know my class was the last one to sign the pledge.

Personally, and looking at my peers... it had no impact. -- And I don't plan on using them in my future ministry.

What did have an impact was a relationship with adults who cared.

 

[Berniquen]

Oh... I should add... when I was sixteen I went on a mission trip where I was given a key. (The key is basically equivalent to a purity ring.) -- I replaced it for a more decorative one (the original key was a common-house key and now I wear an antique key) --

Anyways... having a physical reminder is a great way to start conversation with others about remaining pure -- and as you talk about it it helps to emhpasis the positive behavior I find. -- My students have asked about it and know where I stand on the issue, and a couple have taken to wearing keys themselves.

 

[ImperialPhantom]

Purity pledges are irritating. They promote legalism, and they turn virginity/"purity" into a secondary God within the church. They also underemphasize forgiveness towards the teens that do commit sexual sins.

 

[Luther073082]

Purity pledges are irritating. They promote legalism, and they turn virginity/"purity" into a secondary God within the church. They also underemphasize forgiveness towards the teens that do commit sexual sins.

Too many kids also when they do make the mistake, think "Oh well since I'm no longer a virgin everything after now is meaningless"

So its like they feel bad about it but they keep having sex.

I think purity in Christ is much better to teach. Plus the whole "purity pledge" makes it sound like those who do have sex are somehow impure. . . Are you going to tell a kid who just did that that they are now impure? If you told one of my 9th graders that (they where my students last year and I'm still attached to them) I'd wack you over the head. Sex would be one of the biggest mistakes he or she ever made, but we are made pure in Christ no matter if our sins are killing hobo's with our bare hands, pre-marital sex, lying, or slander.

 

[Schutte]

Ya'll know its ok to make a stand against sins. I realize people mess up and its frustrating and it hurts, but we all have messed up. The key is to stand up to what we know is wrong and let our kids know where we stand. Hopefully they stand with us. I think the key idea is amazing and believe that I will risk a kid feeling bad after having sex if it prevents it. The school can tell my kids about std's and pregences and how there is "safe sex". I will tell my kids the truth, "safe sex" is sex in marriage as God intended it to be. Don't water down the gospels. Your kids own Bibles and some of them will even read them. When they do, they will know you have been watering it down.

Sorry if that came off rude, but you know...

 

[Luther073082]

Ya'll know its ok to make a stand against sins. I realize people mess up and its frustrating and it hurts, but we all have messed up. The key is to stand up to what we know is wrong and let our kids know where we stand. Hopefully they stand with us. I think the key idea is amazing and believe that I will risk a kid feeling bad after having sex if it prevents it. The school can tell my kids about std's and pregences and how there is "safe sex". I will tell my kids the truth, "safe sex" is sex in marriage as God intended it to be. Don't water down the gospels. Your kids own Bibles and some of them will even read them. When they do, they will know you have been watering it down.

Sorry if that came off rude, but you know...

No one here is really suggesting that we don't tell them that sex should be reserved for marriage. What I am saying is the purity pledges are not only given to kids who are way too young to make that choice, but also they make the choice by peer pressure, and they also send the wrong message.

I mean Purity Pledge as if to say that if you have pre-marital sex you are somehow impure??

 

[Apollo Celestio]

We aren't to make oaths, let our yes mean yes and our no mean no. That being said, it should be taught that one should refrain from intercourse until marriage, for "saving" and "purity" reasons. It's not legalistic to call fornication what it is. I think children are taught the Lord's prayer before they are told about these "purity oaths". And forgive us our trespasses, as we forgive those who trespass against us.

 

[restore]

A couple of comments.

I would strongly advise, if you haven't told your teens about the absolute purity God wants from them before marriage: do so. This isn't about drinking, which is arguable. This isn't about smoking or doing drugs, which have serious adverse effects, but aren't talked-about directly in Scripture. This is about sex, where a person essentially hurts themselves and damages the credibility of their faith.

Start there.



It's powerful information in the hands of idealistic, honest Christians. Because they have the same Spirit living within them. In the hands of unbelievers, it's nothing.

Well said.