Psychoses.

[Soulwings]

I was just wondering... are there any of you out there who also have psychotic symptoms along with bipolar (whichever type)? bc I am bipolar type II, and I have very definite psychotic symptoms... right now I am questioning if my past really did happen... and I am flipping out about whether or not I am an attention seeker. So please - this is going to sound weird - only post if you have also experienced psychotic symptoms or have opinions on what I am posting about, no "I'm sorry/concerned/worried" type of thing... bc I don't want to feel like I am garnering attention for something that I don't know that I am not subconsciously making up. (I hope that makes sense!)

Currently, like I said, I am doubting that my past ever happened. Well, I am sure of things that happened up til when I was 14/15, but beyond that... recently... I am not so sure. All of the mental illness stuff - I don't know if that really happened. My tx team is there, I'm on meds, I'm in therapy and have been for 3 years, I'm seeing a nutritionist, but I am still - STILL - doubting whether or not I am really sick. It is to the point where I am wondering if I should come out of treatment or not, whether I need meds, etc., etc. Right now I am relying on others' opinions since I don't know what to do for myself.

I am posting this with the "sane" part of my brain. The other, larger portion of my brain is more saying that "your past never happened, just accept it" ... but I am still fighting with that belief. It has been beyond stressful, and it's affecting my life in more ways than one. I see my NP this weekend, and will be talking with her about meds and med changes, but I am not so sure that meds can erase a belief system. Seems like they might be able to? since the beliefs are semi-psychotic and very paranoid, but I am not sure.

Anyway. Have at it. Opinions, like experiences, etc.

 

[rushingwind62]

I had psychosis back in 2001 and was hospitalized for it. I completely lost a time span of about a week and was doing things very uncharcteristic of me. I can't say I have wonder about if my past really happened but I do wonder about certain areas of my past. I wasn't diagnoised as being Bipolar until that episode. So I can look back and see how it did affect many areas of my life before that episode. I can recall a couple times where I was probably going through emotional distress and small episodes of psychosis.

Your past happened and I am sure you remember many things that happened. So don't say that it didn't. If I was you I would look back on the past and look for those times when you were real emotional or those periods of time where you have lapses. Look for what may have triggered those episode because if you can find the triggers then it can help you to avoid certain situations that could trigger another episode. Yes, meds help us to control our episodes but lifestyle changes is also a big part of our recovery...Hope this helps...God Bless!

Also, I suggest staying on your meds. I know I need them and I know they help me. And as always, talk with your Dr and therapist before coming off any medications.Because many of the meds we take are addictive and we need to be taken off them slowly. Not to mention our Dr's and therapists can see things we can't.

 

[Alive again]

Praying for you.

 

[tallyn75]

I don't post very often, but I identified with your post. In fact I could prolly have written your post for you. I have had quite a few episodes of psychoses and have often doubted whether it's really bipolar of if I fabricated the experiences. I don't want to tell my doctor for fear of him labeling me with Histronic Personality Disorder.

BTW I have been dx with Bipolar I since 2005.

I don't think I've ever doubted in the middle of psychosis before, but often in periods of relative stability. I do think it's part of the bipolar to doubt. That's a big reason some bipolars go off meds that they really do need. That's not a good idea and I strongly advise against it, but some people seem to need to test the theory again and again that they don't need meds. I do often do things that make episodes worse so sometimes it seems like I created the episodes myself.

Bipolar can definitely change your belief systems. Self esteem is a belief system and when I'm manic my self esteem is through the roof, when I'm depressed it's in the toilet.

I don't really know what to recommend so I'll not recommend anything. Try to talk to your PDoc about it.

I've got scatter-brain right now, so I'm not sure how smooth this post has turned out. Just sort of picked a few thoughts from your post and ran with it. Hopefully something in all this chaos will help.

 

[Da_Funkey_Gibbon]

I've been psychotic, but I think what you describe is more being neurotic, where it just feels like you're going crazy. Extreme doubt about everything, over-reading every little detail, but it seems to me you are still in touch with reality, even if only slenderly.

I'm bipolar I and came out of an agitated depressive episode only a month or so ago, terrifying experience and I constantly questioned my sanity, was very paranoid, my mind was racing, racing racing and going through all my memories and every detail of my life until there was very little in my life left that I was not racked with doubt about - my ability to judge reality was severely impaired. But now I'm out the other side I can see I was never really psychotic.

I had a psychotic episode three years ago but then I had no insight - I didn't recognise I was ill or that anything unusual was happening and I think that's the key difference. For me psychosis was like a waking dream, all kinda weird [wash my mouth][wash my mouth][wash my mouth][wash my mouth] was going on, but I never saw it as strange until I was well again, like all those crazy dreams you have after eating too much cheese before bed - you never realise how strange they are until you wake up from them. Psychosis is where you're freed from reality, but from your post reality seems to be imprisoning and torturing you, or at least, your mind's obsessing over every little detail of it to the extent that it becomes impossible to get a clear picture of it. A more frightening type of madness than psychosis itself, in my experiance.

Hang in there buddy - anybody looking at your post can see that you are not crazy. Just wait out the storm and think of the good days to come. Harder to do than say I know...

 

[Soulwings]

Thank you all for your responses. It's nice to know that I'm not alone.

Da_Funkey_Gibbon, what I failed/neglected to tell/avoided telling you is that I was, for a little while, thinking that others could read my thoughts. I still think that, a little bit, but... as long as I don't focus on it, I'm okay. I am not as psychotic as I was two weeks ago, due to a 60mg increase in my AP, but... I think there is still some element of it there.

And yes, definitely paranoid. My tx team is out to get me, they implanted the memories in my head, someone else made the scars - definitely not me... heck, it goes on and on for quite awhile. I do realize with some part of my brain that this doesn't make much sense at all, but I still do firmly believe with most of my brain that my past never happened. It's difficult sorting out just what did happen... I know pretty well that what happened prior to me turning 15 did indeed happen, but the rest of the mental illness stuff, the sexual assaults... don't know if those things really happened. Guess I'm just going along with the game now, the game that my team is playing with me, and pretending that I really am sick.

Ugh. I hope that is semi-coherent. My brain isn't functioning too well right now.

 

[Jeshu]

The problem with psychosis in my life is that I can have relatively short psychotic episodes - like a hour, half a day or so - quit often even - or decline into full-blown psychosis that needs urgent hospital treatment - I've had four major psychosis (one lasting more than five days as I escaped hospital time and again) - in four years - and that left me completely wondering who I was and where I was going. I found that meds do help against - confused and irrational thinking, including belief system changes as our thinking calms down and new/normal/stable thoughts are starting to (re-)appear again after our thoughts and perceptions settle down a little - this will increase our resistance to what I call intrusive thoughts and beliefs.

The state of your mind at the moment seems more - 'thought pestering - irrational - insights and beliefs - confusion driven by doubt and (irrational) fears - than being or going psychotic - yet from here you can digress quite quickly into more unstable being -so please take care.


Anyway hang in and keep a close eyes on your medications as I found that some anti-psychotics, mood stabilisers and/or anti-depressants - and I have been on basically all of them at one stage in my life - can cause irrational fears, panic attacks, confusion and even psychosis (to name but a few of their side-effects.) If we don't talk about these things with our doctor it could get much worse - especially if they up your meds while that is the cause of your increased troubles in the first place.

I hope that things will quickly settle for you.

Gerry

 

[Da_Funkey_Gibbon]

It's good that you can retain insight. I know that feeling you describe too - OK I have insight, I know I'm unwell, but it's still so hard to sort out reality from the distortions and paranoia. Maddening... as if you weren't mad enough already. Really on reflection, I was putting my experiences of psychosis in the context of mania up against your experiences of possible psychotic depression, and I've experienced the former but never, thank God, the latter. They're probably two very different beasts, so take my advice with a pinch of salt.

And without a doubt you are sick, just try and be honest with your docs and they can help. Glad there is some improvement in you - get well soon!

Oh I've just gotta say: "Going mad is confusing to say the least. " LOL! That's a tagline if ever there was one...

 

[Soulwings]

Psychosis: In the general sense, a mental illness that markedly interferes with a person's capacity to meet life's everyday demands. In a specific sense, it refers to a thought disorder in which reality testing is grossly impaired. (medterms.com)

I would agree that, well, I don't fall under the category of psychotic - by that definition - really. Except for the bit about "reality testing is grossly impaired" - not grossly, but I would say quite a bit. I don't know. Not so much a "flavor" of that at the moment, but I have been psychotic in the past (for as long as I can remember up til May 2006 [GEODON!!] I heard voices & static, that I couldn't control and that wasn't external). That past psychotic'ness popped me in the hospital 3 times for a total of ~25 days within 6 months (numbers!). So I haven't been able to escape hospitals very easily. 1 June (my birthday irony) marks me being hospital-free for 2 years. I am afraid that I will be going back there sometime this year, though. None of this bodes well.

The problem with this current issue is that this is the first time anything bizarre has happened since I went on Geodon. Paranoia - how do you treat that?! especially when the paranoia is focused on the very people that could help you. This is actually the first time I have ever felt this paranoid and irrational. I can accept that I am not making sense, bc I have been told that many times, but I still don't think that I am really sick. And that brings up - as my T brought it up - "why are you still taking your meds, then?" Simple answer - "routine."

But... well, I don't know. If I'm not sick, and if nothing I have ever done is abnormal (SI, ED, SUI), then I am normal... and that makes everything I do normal. Whether it's "bipolar mood swings" or "cutting" or "self-dehydration" or anything that sounds mentally ill ... it's normal. And normal for me. So I am normal! (Elation!!)

Mania is completely different for me. Psychotic mania - now THAT would be rather interesting. But I am normal so 1) it wouldn't be called that if I exhibited those symptoms bc whatever I do is normal and 2) whatever is called that couldn't happen to me bc I am normal.

Okay. This has gotten way too haphazard for my liking. Hopefully you can glean something from it. (If you want to glean anything, that is.)

 

[wonderwoman]

During certain manic episodes, one of my tendencies were to change my mind about being mentally ill. I would start out doubting if this disease called bipolar is actually real, then i'd end up being convinced that i was fine. I believed this because i felt euphoric, elated.....grandiose. Everyone was wrong and i was right. I would then get off my meds to test or prove my theory and of course every time i got off my meds all the nasty symptoms would return. When the mania passed, i became "sober" minded again and could look back in retrospect that my judgment about reality or rather the reality about my mental state was impaired during this manic episode. Of course while manic, i didn't see it as manic, but as being "normal". When i later became more balanced as far as moods go, it was only then that i could realize just how manic i really was. I don't know what it is about mania that makes bipolar patients disbelieve what is happening or what has happened to them.

I often think how helpful it would be to video tape myself when in this state just so i can watch it if i end up going through one these spells again. That would "prove" to me that this is real and not imagined.

If you're confused about what is real, try to see the rationale in trusting the people that love you and know you even if the crossed wires in your brain are telling you otherwise.

I know you've started this thread some time ago, so i don't know if you are still experiencing these feelings. How are you feeling now?

 

[Soulwings]

Thanks for the reply, wonderwoman. Mania does weird things to us, doesn't it...

I am still kind of uncomfortable with my past and my tx team, but I'm doing a bit better. The increase in Geodon is helping a bit, I think, which is a relief!! but I'm doing worse in other areas - depression/suicidality - so it sucks. Can't really ever get a good, healthy balance! but then again, this is bipolar... what's healthy again? Heh...

 

[wonderwoman]

Thanks for the reply, wonderwoman. Mania does weird things to us, doesn't it...

I am still kind of uncomfortable with my past and my tx team, but I'm doing a bit better. The increase in Geodon is helping a bit, I think, which is a relief!! but I'm doing worse in other areas - depression/suicidality - so it sucks. Can't really ever get a good, healthy balance! but then again, this is bipolar... what's healthy again? Heh...

What is it exactly that makes you question your past? is it that you don't remember certain things happening? I mean, is it that you don't have any memory of these things and therefore that is why you question them?

 

[Jeshu]

Thanks for the reply, wonderwoman. Mania does weird things to us, doesn't it...

I am still kind of uncomfortable with my past and my tx team, but I'm doing a bit better. The increase in Geodon is helping a bit, I think, which is a relief!! but I'm doing worse in other areas - depression/suicidality - so it sucks. Can't really ever get a good, healthy balance! but then again, this is bipolar... what's healthy again? Heh...

I don't know if this is helpful or not - or if you want to know this - but your type of anti-psychotic caused major panic attacks, suicidal tendencies, rage and paranoia which ended in a psychosis for me. I was on it to help me sleep - as my other anti-psychotic simply stopped working effectively and caused major side effects to (re)appear - yet when my doctor put me on this it seemed at first that my sleep/condition was improving and I was calming down - but then those horrible panic attacks and the rest of those horrible symptoms - increasingly overwhelmed me - especially at night - waking me in terrifying sweats at times or making me rage in suicidal stupor. My doctor thinking I was getting sick again put me at first on more - indeed increasing it to the max - it was there that I completely zoomed out - not nice - and it took some time to settle - (Solian, even a tiny whinny bit, worked to bring the paranoia under control again haven't got it at all any more.)

I know we are all different and most likely you are not suffering from paranoia from your meds as I did - but I thought - you never know - to know might be better than to be sorry. (Your symptoms are the same as mine were at that time that is why I thought I speak up about it.)

Hope you take care of yourself during this difficult time and keep a close eye on your own belief system - keep ignoring those attacks on the medical world - though understandable at times - it certainly won't benefit you to make them your enemy - but I have done it myself in the past while manic it is an easy thing to do.
The ONLY way to deal with paranoia, in my experience, is to ignore it when it nibbles at you and to bring to Jesus in prayer when it attacks full scale.

 

[Soulwings]

Wonderwoman- As far as what makes me question my past, well... I don't know. I just do. It doesn't seem right that it all happened to me. I do remember everything yet it doesn't feel like it all happened. So if it doesn't feel like it happened, then maybe it didn't... but if it didn't then how do I have memories of it? Simple - they were implanted. By whom? Well, who better than my treatment team? bc they already are "messing around with my head." So there is the paranoia. And of course, if my past didn't happen, then I am normal, and if I am normal, then I don't do abnormal things, so all of the SI and ED tendencies I have right now must be normal. Does that make any sense?

Gerry- I've wondered some about meds making me like this, but my current AP seems to be working pretty well. It's gotten rid of some of the paranoia, I think... at least, the paranoia is waning after increasing the Geodon amount... so I don't know. A lot of meds do tend to make me suicidal (and being off meds makes me suicidal as well, so I am kind of stuck), but Geodon seems to be working pretty well. However, since the increase I have been more suicidal, so... don't know about that. I'll be talking with my NP about that at my next appt (this Saturday).

 

[wonderwoman]

Wonderwoman- As far as what makes me question my past, well... I don't know. I just do. It doesn't seem right that it all happened to me. I do remember everything yet it doesn't feel like it all happened. So if it doesn't feel like it happened, then maybe it didn't... but if it didn't then how do I have memories of it? Simple - they were implanted. By whom? Well, who better than my treatment team? bc they already are "messing around with my head." So there is the paranoia. And of course, if my past didn't happen, then I am normal, and if I am normal, then I don't do abnormal things, so all of the SI and ED tendencies I have right now must be normal. Does that make any sense?

Gerry- I've wondered some about meds making me like this, but my current AP seems to be working pretty well. It's gotten rid of some of the paranoia, I think... at least, the paranoia is waning after increasing the Geodon amount... so I don't know. A lot of meds do tend to make me suicidal (and being off meds makes me suicidal as well, so I am kind of stuck), but Geodon seems to be working pretty well. However, since the increase I have been more suicidal, so... don't know about that. I'll be talking with my NP about that at my next appt (this Saturday).

Yea i get what you mean. I've never experienced paranoia myself,but i can relate to what you're saying about how feelings speak of a reality even though your cognitive memory tells you otherwise. It just makes me realize just how dependent we humans are on our feelings to determine reality. Right now i'm in a depressed state and i feel certain things about myself that just aren't true. Feelings of hopelessness, worthlessness, impending doom, meaninglessness, being unloved etc...I recognize that they aren't true, but i still feel them....that's the disease talking. The fact that i now know of my illness and already have had the experience of going thru and coming out of these episodes does help somewhat in that it helps me to hold on to the truth of: "this has happened before....i have these thoughts because of my illness....i will come out of it again." At present, i remember what i used to be like before this recent onset....i remember it as though it were someone else's life, but i know it was mine. It's so odd how that can happen in such short a time. The brain is a complex organ.....more complex than a computer circuit board. One area gets a bug and the whole thing goes haywire. Suxerama for us...

It's good that you are able to recognize that the thoughts you are experiencing about the implant stuff etc is paranoia. I know it's hard to listen to an objective thought/memory above a subjective feeling, but we need to at least try or, during these times of fickle feelings, we need to be in the practice of trusting fact over feelings. Don't know if that makes sense.

hope you feel better soon girly......btw, did you read the stuff i wrote in reply to your freewriting? That's some good stuff you got brewing in that brain of yours.

 

[Alaskamomma]

Hey Soul,

I am thinking and praying for you. I can tell you are listening closely to your body. If you think the geodon is making you have more suicidal ideation, then, yes, please check with your np. Stay safe. Okay?

 

[Jeshu]

Yeah I can see what you mean Soulwing - if you are often suicidal without medications it may well be true that this isn't from your current meds - it is just that my suicidal tendencies had been laid at rest for a few years when in just four weeks flat - after I started new medications - it went through the roof and become something of a full-scale preoccupation - it stopped within days after stopping these medications in a terrible hurry.

Please take care as chemical suicidal ideations can be far more aggressive than that caused by depression - you could loose the plot just overnight if it is from the pills.

Take care!

 

[SearchingSister]

I'm confused. What I thought of as psychotic symptoms is different than what you guys are talking about. I sometimes hear voices, see things that arent there, and frequently believe that I am pregnant when I'm not. I also sometimes believe that my therapist is drugging me in order to see the effects on my unborn child.
These symptoms don't particularly bother me as I have learnt to ignore them, but now I am concerned because its so different than what anyone else is describing. Isn't this normal for bp?