Psychedelic Plants: Bad or Good?

[finnfierro]

When God created the Earth, He pronounced it 'good'.

Then there was that unfortunate incident with Eve, an apple and that snake. Things weren't so 'good' after that. So I'm not sure the 'God created plants' argument is completely correct.

There are numerous forms of plants which have 'odd' effects. The opium poppy is one such. It can be used as a very helpful medicine to ease pain. It can also be a seriously addictive and destructive drug if used improperly.

Alcohol is another such item.

Psychedelic substances strike me as in the same "maybe" category. I personally have no desire or need for such. (Pretty odd anyway.) Yes, I know they have been used by various and sundry folk - mostly non-Christian as I gather - for purposes of 'seeing' beyond normal abilities. That concept of 'seeing' without reliance on God gives me pause.

Anything which removes one from reliance on God is suspect in my mind. For that reason, I do not think a Christian should be employing such items.

Would that include you banning all other people from ever using them, religious or not? Would you vote illegal or legal in a referendum?

 

[finnfierro]

That's interesting and something I'd certainly see as less harmful than heavy usage of the same drugs, at least in terms of what is written in scripture.

Though I have to wonder why someone wouldn't just take a nootropic and wash it down with a coffee. All the same kicks without the perception risks.

They tend to be unnatural, caffeine can cause comedown effects and withdrawal effects. Although as they are "legal" people tend to find the safer option.

 

[Archie the Preacher]

Would that include you banning all other people from ever using them, religious or not? Would you vote illegal or legal in a referendum?

I would ban all people from using any harmful material if I were going to be held responsible (taxation) for the damage they do while using, and their upkeep after they burned out their brains, so to speak.

If the person were truly independent, meaning not billing me for the disastrous result of their activities, AND could not demand I take care of them, I would be in favor of them doing as they please.

 

[GoldenBoy89]

I can't offer advice from a Christian perspective but so far, my experiences with psychedelics have all been positive but I've also seen others essentially lose their minds for several hours until the drugs wore off and I could tell they weren't having a very good time. So while I personally don't see any real problem with them, I don't encourage people to "just try it" because of the subjective nature of it all, and I would advise great caution about who you're with, where you are going to be for the next few hours and what, exactly you are taking.

 

[Desk trauma]

I would ban all people from using any harmful material if I were going to be held responsible (taxation) for the damage they do while using, and their upkeep after they burned out their brains, so to speak.

I look forward to the ban on the standard American diet.

 

[Andrewofthetribe]

I love a good smoke of weed. It really lifts my spirit and helps me talk to God.

 

[rambot]

Many of these plants are being tested for use in treatment of significant mental health issues (schizophrenia. Major depression and ptsd to name 3) with fantastic results.

 

[SnowyMacie]

You would have to fast from pretty much everything except bread, meat, vegetables, and water to have a completely sober mind at all times. Everything from sugar to caffeine to eating your favorite food effects the chemistry of your brain. The closest most of us ever are to actually being completely sober are when we wake up in the morning.

 

[BubbaJack]

So does faith in God. You'll find far more strength in that than you will in any bottle.

I'll be praying for you.

Prayer didn't work for me. That's why I'm having cheap Chardonnay at 11:00 A.M.

edit- Merlot

 

[SnowyMacie]

Prayer didn't work for me. That's why I'm having cheap Chardonnay at 11:00 A.M.

edit- Merlot

I firmly believe that if God didn't create alcohol, the human race wouldn't have lasted this long. I personally see alcohol, caffeine, and most natural drugs like that to be gifts from God.

 

[Moral Orel]

I'm actually for legalizing more illicit substances. That being said, I don't like weak arguments as they only make the cause weak, so...

When people say, "God put it here, why shouldn't we use it?".

I respond, "God put cactuses here, but we don't sit on them".

 

[BubbaJack]

I'm actually for legalizing more illicit substances. That being said, I don't like weak arguments as they only make the cause weak, so...

When people say, "God put it here, why shouldn't we use it?".

I respond, "God put cactuses here, but we don't sit on them".

That's a weak argument itself. There are other uses of cacti besides sitting on them.

*I didn't say cactuses.

 

[Moral Orel]

That's a weak argument itself. There are other uses of cacti besides sitting on them.

*I didn't say cactuses.

You got me on the cacti part... it's early...

But to the rest, that's the point of the argument.

 

[finnfierro]

You got me on the cacti part... it's early...

But to the rest, that's the point of the argument.

Peyote is a form of cacti that is psychedelic

 

[Archie the Preacher]

I look forward to the ban on the standard American diet.

With the provisos I want applied, I'd sign on to it. I'd probably eat the 'SAD' anyway, but I don't expect anyone else to pay for what I do to myself.

Using tobacco products fall under the same concept as well.

 

[TagliatelliMonster]

Why would God go against the use of natural herbs such as Salvia Divinorum, Marijuana, Peyote and Fungus's such as Psilocybin? surely they are created by him so who are we as humans to ban them from each other? Is this not illogical?

These plants can be dangerous to irresponsible users, causing side effects such as HPPD and bringing out psychosis. Although to the majority of others, cause deep and spiritual changes that effect their life positively, DMT is proven to be within the pineal gland (in brain) and is produced in the drink ayahuasca while proven to be detrimental to the abolishment of addiction in Meth, Cocain and Heroin addicts. LSD was used as one of the stages in Bill Wilson (Creator of Alcoholics Anonymous) steps to stopping alcohol addiction.

It is clear that these plants over many years were used by Shamans and religious leaders. Why must we stop research into there chemicals when there is clear therapeutic and medicinal benefits within them.

I would love to hear your two cents on this as i am very confused on Christianity's position on this. (being no mention of psychedelics being bad or good in the bible)

(jamaican Bob Marley voice)

"It is just a plant, man!!!"

 

[BubbaJack]

Psychedelics are nothing to play around with. Sam Harris wrote a pretty good article about bad trips; he mentioned a six-hour stay at the "mountain of shame."

 

[durangodawood]

I don't see anything good about the destruction that alcohol has caused. I can't count how many people I personally know whose lives have been ruined by drinking. In the upper midwest being an alcoholic is socially acceptable, even a badge of honor to some, which is a real shame.

Well Jesus himself still managed to find something valuable in alcohol consumption. So much so that he provided the wine!

I agree about the damage, tho.

 

[Waterwerx]

Why would God go against the use of natural herbs such as Salvia Divinorum, Marijuana, Peyote and Fungus's such as Psilocybin? surely they are created by him so who are we as humans to ban them from each other? Is this not illogical?

These plants can be dangerous to irresponsible users, causing side effects such as HPPD and bringing out psychosis. Although to the majority of others, cause deep and spiritual changes that effect their life positively, DMT is proven to be within the pineal gland (in brain) and is produced in the drink ayahuasca while proven to be detrimental to the abolishment of addiction in Meth, Cocain and Heroin addicts. LSD was used as one of the stages in Bill Wilson (Creator of Alcoholics Anonymous) steps to stopping alcohol addiction.

It is clear that these plants over many years were used by Shamans and religious leaders. Why must we stop research into there chemicals when there is clear therapeutic and medicinal benefits within them.

I would love to hear your two cents on this as i am very confused on Christianity's position on this. (being no mention of psychedelics being bad or good in the bible)

Christians are warned away from partaking in the sin of sorcery(pharmakeia), which is specifically talking about the use of drugs for "kicks". This includes using drugs to get high, go into altered states, etc., because its "fun", "feels good", and so on. We're not talking about someone going in for a root canal and being sedated as being a sin of sorcery. However, an addict trading a more harmful drug for a less harmful one and continuing to take it is considered a sin of sorcery because you're trading one monkey off of your back for another monkey on your back.

 

[durangodawood]

I think psychedelics can be very good when used rarely and with purpose and care.