PS3, Xbox 360, or upgrade PC?

[FlaymSior]

does the 40gig even have the emotion engine anymore or did sony take that out? Software emulation is garbage.

The 40GB version is 100% not backwards compatible. It lacks hardware and software for emulation. Also removed the PS2 memory card slots (if they existed before, unsure) and a couple USB ports. It's the equivalent of the Core for 360... kinda.

 

[Breetai]

The 40GB version is 100% not backwards compatible. It lacks hardware and software for emulation. Also removed the PS2 memory card slots (if they existed before, unsure) and a couple USB ports. It's the equivalent of the Core for 360... kinda.

They'll probably just release software emulation for it later down the line... for a price... who knows!

To be honest, I don't really understand why the 40GB version doesn't support PS2 emulation. All the have to do is load up the hard drive with a bit of software, right? Anyway, if you really need to play PS2 games in the PS3, then get the more expensive 20GB or 60GB versions (at least, that's how they're priced here).

The PS2 memory slots have NEVER existed in the PS3. There's an adapter. Anyway, if your son doesn't care about PS2 games or already has a PS2, then the 40GB is good. If he wants PS2 games to work, then again... get the 20GB or 60GB version.

FlaymSior, do you know if that monitor solution will work with the PS3 as well?

The monitor solution will work, but as FlamySior said, the PS3 has an HDMI connection; not a VGA connection. There ARE cables that can connect a PS3 to a computer screen, you'll just have to shop around. The Sony message boards might help. After a quick internet search, I found this and this.As has also been said, you'll have to hook up the audio cables to something. The obvious thing to do is to hook them up to an amplifier. If you don't want to go so big, I'm guessing that with a mini-Y cable you can plug them into a set up computer speakers.

It's the equivalent of the Core for 360... kinda.

Hardly! It is a step down, but it's not nearly as stripped down as the 360 core. The 360 core has no hard drive, no wireless controllers, no high-definition output, and no wireless internet support. Even the cheapest PS3 version has all of these things. Not to mention that it can play HD movies.

 

[FlaymSior]

They'll probably just release software emulation for it later down the line... for a price... who knows!

To be honest, I don't really understand why the 40GB version doesn't support PS2 emulation. All the have to do is load up the hard drive with a bit of software, right? Anyway, if you really need to play PS2 games in the PS3, then get the more expensive 20GB or 60GB versions (at least, that's how they're priced here).

The PS2 memory slots have NEVER existed in the PS3. There's an adapter. Anyway, if your son doesn't care about PS2 games or already has a PS2, then the 40GB is good. If he wants PS2 games to work, then again... get the 20GB or 60GB version.

The monitor solution will work, but as FlamySior said, the PS3 has an HDMI connection; not a VGA connection. There ARE cables that can connect a PS3 to a computer screen, you'll just have to shop around. The Sony message boards might help. After a quick internet search, I found this and this.As has also been said, you'll have to hook up the audio cables to something. The obvious thing to do is to hook them up to an amplifier. If you don't want to go so big, I'm guessing that with a mini-Y cable you can plug them into a set up computer speakers.


Hardly! It is a step down, but it's not nearly as stripped down as the 360 core. The 360 core has no hard drive, no wireless controllers, no high-definition output, and no wireless internet support. Even the cheapest PS3 version has all of these things. Not to mention that it can play HD movies.

Software emulation would not work as well as it would almost definitely need to be emulated from game to game, and with such an expansive library as the PS2's this would not be logical. Also, Sony's current stance is that gamers won't want to play the backwards comp titles because of "an expansive library of PlayStation 3 titles". Another clue that Sony is full of something wet and smelly.

Didn't know that bout the memory slots. Shows how much I care about it =P

So the PS3 ONLY has HDMI? Not component or composite? ... bullet, meet foot. (Well not really as most people willing to go for that system have HDTVs anyway.)

I have a Y adapter to make the two audio plugs into a single audio jack which then has a gender reverse to allow the speakers to plug into them. Works, but a lot of cables. Which is why I didn't mention the add-on 3rd (or 4th or 5th) party adapters to VGA. Lack of guaranteed results also.

Which is why I said "kinda". But go a step further. Core isn't forced to HDMI so more people can play it on their computer monitors or older TVs. All the shiny stuff was left out to get it into more people's hands instead of just going to the more hardcore gamers straight out of the gate. And even the Core allowed backwards comp, something the 40GB will never do due to Sony's stance (until they release a standalone drive to play PS2 games like an HDDVD drive for the 360... might happen, ya never know in this industry.)

 

[StromRider]

Interesting stuff guys, thanks. Backwards compatibility to the PS2 was never a question. We never had a PS2, just an ancient PS1.

So far he's happy with the game on the tv in the playroom so I probably won't have to try the computer monitor thing. He'll probably wait till the tv in the playroom dies and it becomes Mom's and Dad's job to replace it

(Breetai, thanks for those links, I've saved them for future use just in case)

 

[Breetai]

Software emulation would not work as well as it would almost definitely need to be emulated from game to game, and with such an expansive library as the PS2's this would not be logical. Also, Sony's current stance is that gamers won't want to play the backwards comp titles because of "an expansive library of PlayStation 3 titles". Another clue that Sony is full of something wet and smelly.

Hey, Microsoft is full of it as well! Aren't all large corporations? Take it with the nice and shiny, or at least do your best to plug your nose!

You aren't quite right in saying that games need to be individually emulated. The PS2's emotion engine needs to be successfully emulated. I'm guessing that's just what Sony has been doing recently (I'm happy to have the PS2 chip in my PS3, but I don't think I would notice if it was software instead in most cases). Have you not played any Nintendo or Mega Drive/Genesis emulators on your PC? They don't emulate each and every game individually. They emulate the system architecture, for example the 86000 chip in the Mega Drive. Some games don't work correctly because of advanced coding technique that take up a lot of processing power. In the case of the SNES/SF, games like Mega Man X3 and Star Fox have a difficult time running correctly because of these things (not to mention having extra processors and RAM in the cart itself!!!).

Didn't know that bout the memory slots. Shows how much I care about it =P

Well, you don't have a PS3 I take it!

So the PS3 ONLY has HDMI? Not component or composite? ... bullet, meet foot. (Well not really as most people willing to go for that system have HDTVs anyway.)

To be honest, I'm having to educate myself on these things a bit. I am so happy today! After making my last post, I checked the back of my TV to see what I had. I found a plug called "D-Terminal." I looked it up... and learned that this is a connection used in Japan for HD-TV. In other words, I have an HD-TV and didn't know it!!! I bought it for about $200 from my friend who was leaving the country. Lucky me, I say! Yesterday, I was running my PS3 at 480i. Now it's running at 1080i. WOW! What a difference! I mean... WOW! (yes, I am in a very good mood now).

So, here's the deal. The PS3 has composite cables, which is what I was running until about an hour ago. These come out of the AV-multi output. Composite can also come out of here. This is an HDMI output, as my D-Terminal cable comes out of here and can display up to 1080p. There is also a dedicated HDMI output, I guess for the common connection in America. So, that's two connections. It does not, as far as I know, have a VGA output. So in order to connect to a PC screen, you'd need an adapter of some sort which the links in my last post explain. Apparently it's a bit less complicated on the X-Box 360, since it has a VGA port (very PC friendly!).

I have a Y adapter to make the two audio plugs into a single audio jack which then has a gender reverse to allow the speakers to plug into them. Works, but a lot of cables. Which is why I didn't mention the add-on 3rd (or 4th or 5th) party adapters to VGA. Lack of guaranteed results also.

That's basically what I was picturing in my head.

Which is why I said "kinda". But go a step further. Core isn't forced to HDMI so more people can play it on their computer monitors or older TVs. All the shiny stuff was left out to get it into more people's hands instead of just going to the more hardcore gamers straight out of the gate. And even the Core allowed backwards comp, something the 40GB will never do due to Sony's stance (until they release a standalone drive to play PS2 games like an HDDVD drive for the 360... might happen, ya never know in this industry.)

There will be absolutely no need for a stand-alone PS2-DVD drive. All they need to do is offer a PS2 emulator for download on the Playstation Network or on a disc. It wouldn't shock me to see this released eventually, for a price.


The PS3 is not forced to use HDMI. In fact, the system comes with composite cables when you buy it. Same as it's been since the original Playstation.

 

[Breetai]

Interesting stuff guys, thanks. Backwards compatibility to the PS2 was never a question. We never had a PS2, just an ancient PS1.

So far he's happy with the game on the tv in the playroom so I probably won't have to try the computer monitor thing. He'll probably wait till the tv in the playroom dies and it becomes Mom's and Dad's job to replace it

(Breetai, thanks for those links, I've saved them for future use just in case)

Glad to try and help!

 

[FlaymSior]

Hey, Microsoft is full of it as well! Aren't all large corporations? Take it with the nice and shiny, or at least do your best to plug your nose!

But why does Sony think they have an expansive selection when it's nowhere near expansive, let alone a large selection? They promise games but most fall further back since it's unfamiliar territory making the games. This is the same problem the Wii was/is having. It's happened to some extent with every system like with the PS2 and Xbox where the full capacity of the hardware wasn't utilized until the end of that generation.

You aren't quite right in saying that games need to be individually emulated. The PS2's emotion engine needs to be successfully emulated. I'm guessing that's just what Sony has been doing recently (I'm happy to have the PS2 chip in my PS3, but I don't think I would notice if it was software instead in most cases). Have you not played any Nintendo or Mega Drive/Genesis emulators on your PC? They don't emulate each and every game individually. They emulate the system architecture, for example the 86000 chip in the Mega Drive. Some games don't work correctly because of advanced coding technique that take up a lot of processing power. In the case of the SNES/SF, games like Mega Man X3 and Star Fox have a difficult time running correctly because of these things (not to mention having extra processors and RAM in the cart itself!!!).

Partially right. The game-to-game emulation is done in the roms of the games. And then it's run by the emulator.

Well, you don't have a PS3 I take it!

Nope, and won't get one. Not so much out of not liking it, but I've tried to own multiple consoles before and it just never was worth it.

So, here's the deal. The PS3 has composite cables, which is what I was running until about an hour ago. These come out of the AV-multi output. Composite can also come out of here. This is an HDMI output, as my D-Terminal cable comes out of here and can display up to 1080p. There is also a dedicated HDMI output, I guess for the common connection in America. So, that's two connections. It does not, as far as I know, have a VGA output. So in order to connect to a PC screen, you'd need an adapter of some sort which the links in my last post explain. Apparently it's a bit less complicated on the X-Box 360, since it has a VGA port (very PC friendly!).

So there are two output ports on the PS3? Just like the (newer) 360s. A port for standard AV and a plug for HDMI. It does NOT have a VGA port but it does have a cable that plugs into the AV slot and ends as a VGA and two audios, same place you plug composite, component, or RF cable. That's what I was refering to in above posts, and that's what Sony doesn't have for the PS3 at this time. Who knows, maybe they'll pop one into production and sell it for $20-$40 like every other system's aftermarket cables.

There will be absolutely no need for a stand-alone PS2-DVD drive. All they need to do is offer a PS2 emulator for download on the Playstation Network or on a disc. It wouldn't shock me to see this released eventually, for a price.

There will still need to be a rom individually produced for the game. To reference the 360, each game must have a download from Live to make it work with the software emulator in the 360. This is downloaded as a console update so it doesn't seem like it's a bunch of partial roms to work with the emulator.

The PS3 is not forced to use HDMI. In fact, the system comes with composite cables when you buy it. Same as it's been since the original Playstation.

Okay, that makes sense. Bullet, please leave foot alone this time

 

[Breetai]

But why does Sony think they have an expansive selection when it's nowhere near expansive, let alone a large selection? They promise games but most fall further back since it's unfamiliar territory making the games. This is the same problem the Wii was/is having. It's happened to some extent with every system like with the PS2 and Xbox where the full capacity of the hardware wasn't utilized until the end of that generation.

I see more PS3 games on the shelves than 360 games. Then again, I'm sure that has everything to do with where I live. There are plenty of games here.

As for the Wii, it literally takes up between 1/3rd to 1/2 of the console games section in a lot of stores here. TONS of games for the Wii. Perhaps it doesn't have many games in English? It's the top system in Japan, followed by the PS3.

Partially right. The game-to-game emulation is done in the roms of the games. And then it's run by the emulator.

How is that? I can't say first-hand about cartridge based games, but I've copied Sega CD and Playstation games to my computer and run them on an emulator. From what I know, ROMs are dumped directly from the cartridge. There isn't anything extra added to them. The emulator runs them directly my having the CPU mimic the CPU the ROMs were designed to run on.

Nope, and won't get one. Not so much out of not liking it, but I've tried to own multiple consoles before and it just never was worth it.

If I had a 360, I wouldn't get a PS3. The software is waaaayyy to similar! As it is, I have no need at all for a 360 right now. A handful of popular first person shooters isn't enough to make me get another system. Fable 2 does look interesting, though. I enjoyed the original Fable. Oblivion fills that gap nicely, thankfully.

So there are two output ports on the PS3? Just like the (newer) 360s. A port for standard AV and a plug for HDMI.

That sounds right.

It does NOT have a VGA port but it does have a cable that plugs into the AV slot and ends as a VGA and two audios, same place you plug composite, component, or RF cable.

I think that's correct.

That's what I was refering to in above posts, and that's what Sony doesn't have for the PS3 at this time. Who knows, maybe they'll pop one into production and sell it for $20-$40 like every other system's aftermarket cables.

I assume there are 3rd party ones. Perhaps Sony itself has one. I really don't know. I'm very happy with my D-Terminal cable!

There will still need to be a rom individually produced for the game. To reference the 360, each game must have a download from Live to make it work with the software emulator in the 360. This is downloaded as a console update so it doesn't seem like it's a bunch of partial roms to work with the emulator.

If that's true... that has nothing to do with a separate media drive. Why'd you make that claim earlier?

Okay, that makes sense. Bullet, please leave foot alone this time

Well, neither of us know everything about each others systems obviously! I just know what I read,and then remember some of it... in addition to playing my friends' 360s.


For the record, I was really leaning towards getting a 360. I got a PS3 because it's region-free (a HUGE deal for me!) and doesn't have a reputation for crapping out like the 360 has got. I do not want to worry about warranty issues in a country where I've only got a shaky grasp of the language.

 

[FlaymSior]

I see more PS3 games on the shelves than 360 games. Then again, I'm sure that has everything to do with where I live. There are plenty of games here.

As for the Wii, it literally takes up between 1/3rd to 1/2 of the console games section in a lot of stores here. TONS of games for the Wii. Perhaps it doesn't have many games in English? It's the top system in Japan, followed by the PS3.

You have more PS3 games and we have more 360 games due to where we are. Sony's not brought over a lot of the games because I guess it doesn't tickle our fancy... but neither does a lack of games on our end.

How is that? I can't say first-hand about cartridge based games, but I've copied Sega CD and Playstation games to my computer and run them on an emulator. From what I know, ROMs are dumped directly from the cartridge. There isn't anything extra added to them. The emulator runs them directly my having the CPU mimic the CPU the ROMs were designed to run on.

There ya have it, copied, not running from the original cartridge or disc. There's the alteration.

If I had a 360, I wouldn't get a PS3. The software is waaaayyy to similar! As it is, I have no need at all for a 360 right now. A handful of popular first person shooters isn't enough to make me get another system. Fable 2 does look interesting, though. I enjoyed the original Fable. Oblivion fills that gap nicely, thankfully.

Same for me. If there are two systems with the same game, I'll grab the 360 version for the Achvs since otherwise the two are exactly alike. And I'm not hard to impress when it comes to graphics =P

I assume there are 3rd party ones. Perhaps Sony itself has one. I really don't know. I'm very happy with my D-Terminal cable!

Negative, I searched back on the first page and came up with zero VGA cables for PS3, just that D-Terminal you refer to, but didn't mention it cause it seemed more complicated than it could/should(?) be.

If that's true... that has nothing to do with a separate media drive. Why'd you make that claim earlier?

A separate media drive (or at least an emotion chip) would allow the PS3 to play PS2 games directly. If they went the soft route, it would have to be game to game.

For the record, I was really leaning towards getting a 360. I got a PS3 because it's region-free (a HUGE deal for me!) and doesn't have a reputation for crapping out like the 360 has got. I do not want to worry about warranty issues in a country where I've only got a shaky grasp of the language.

I got my 360 a year after launch, right about the time of the PS3s and Wii's. Stupid me got it used, so it crapped out shortly before the Halo 3 Beta, lol. Got another one and it's treated me well since. PS3 just doesn't have that draw of exclusive games here in the US. But I can see why you'd want one for being region-free, warranty, and location.

 

[Breetai]

You have more PS3 games and we have more 360 games due to where we are. Sony's not brought over a lot of the games because I guess it doesn't tickle our fancy... but neither does a lack of games on our end.

When I go into an import shop and see a decent collection of NTSC-US games, I see that there are plenty of games available in America. There are around 100 now. Of course, not all would "tickle your fancy", but do you really plan on buying dozens of games?

There ya have it, copied, not running from the original cartridge or disc. There's the alteration.

That's not an alternation. It's a copy. Nothing has been changed.

Same for me. If there are two systems with the same game, I'll grab the 360 version for the Achvs since otherwise the two are exactly alike. And I'm not hard to impress when it comes to graphics =P

Negative, I searched back on the first page and came up with zero VGA cables for PS3, just that D-Terminal you refer to, but didn't mention it cause it seemed more complicated than it could/should(?) be.

Perhaps there aren't any there. If someone wants one, I guess they'll have to buy a converter.

How is the D-Terminal complicated? It's a Japan-specific connection found on most Japanese TVs.

A separate media drive (or at least an emotion chip) would allow the PS3 to play PS2 games directly. If they went the soft route, it would have to be game to game.

From what I understand, the 80GB PS3 does use software emulation. I'm sure it works fine in 99% or so of cases. There is absolutely no need to release a seperate drive with an emotion chip. Unless you consider an actual PS2 a seperate drive...

You still haven't shown why each PS2 game would have to be emulated separately. As another example, I have an X-Box with a mod-chip. It plays most Playstation games flawlessly (aside from minimal slowdown). I do not have to download something for every individual game. It works because the emulation software makes the X-Box's CPU act like a Playstation CPU.

I got my 360 a year after launch, right about the time of the PS3s and Wii's. Stupid me got it used, so it crapped out shortly before the Halo 3 Beta, lol.

Systems just should not crap out after only a year. Even if you bought a new system, how do you know how long it's been on the shelf?

Got another one and it's treated me well since. PS3 just doesn't have that draw of exclusive games here in the US. But I can see why you'd want one for being region-free, warranty, and location.

I hope your current 360 keeps it up!

 

[cat1]

Why is the 20 gig PS3 backwards compatable but the 40 isnt :S hmmm and the 20 gig doesnt excist over here i dont think, were all sold out here in the UK but there is a 120gig coming out soon most likely to be next year now. the 80 gig is not going to be onsale in Europe because apparenlty a guy in HMV said that " theres no point in selling the 80 gig in europe as theres is going to be 120 one out and for the similar price range" so for what u get for that 80 gig is kinda pointless for a few pennies more. Am i right? i got the 60gig one becuase i was impatient but my dad says that he might get me a 120 one and he can have the 60 one but not sure also im not really that botherd i can upgrade my 60gig one anyway. so yeah all is good