_-iconoclast-_
I live by faith in the Son of God.
Hey hey.
My dear, I do not mean to use faith (noun1) in relation to God because you do not have faith (noun 1) in God.
I chose faith noun 1 in relation to your belief system - trust . The atheists i have encountered fervently say they have no religious faith - this would cancel out noun 2.
Faith noun 2 - strong belief in the doctrines of a religion, based on spiritual conviction rather than proof.
Atheists do not base their trust on spiritual conviction. Noun 2 does not qualify with atheist belief my friend.
Faith noun 1 - complete trust or confidence in someone or something. This would qualify.
Bugs - " Well, I can say I don't really have 'complete trust in something' either, so perhaps I don't even have that kind of faith"
So my friend, do you not have complete trust in evolution? Is there doubt?
Conny - "Would you accept something if you had no trust in it?"
Bugsy - "Generally, No."
Conny - "If i have no trust in a belief, why would i accept it?"
Busgsy - "I don't know about you, but I wouldn't..."
Conny - "How would a lack of trust effect my belief system?"
Bugsy - "I don't know - are you asking me what you're supposed to think, or are you asking me what I would think?"
Conny - "i would have a feeling of uncertainty or lack of conviction - doubt. It would effect my belief system which would result in some form of uncertainty."
You, your friend, myself, andrew down the road, gerald the gardner, trust our belief systems.
If we did not trust we would.not believe!!!!!
My dear even you agree!
"If i have no trust in a belief, why would i accept it?"
Busgsy - "I don't know about you, but I wouldn't..."
"Hinduism: Miracles are a major part of the Hindu tradition. In addition to the feats of gods and goddesses described in Hindu scripture, many believe that human mystics can perform amazing feats such as healing the sick, levitating themselves, and surviving for years without eating or drinking."
Healing the sick seems like the only thing in common hear. Christians do not believe in leviating themselves or surving for years with no sustainance.
Unless you would like to argue for these 2 things, it would seem strange to argue for something you do not agree could happen my friend.
List of miracles
You can control a mad elephant - dont know if i would call this an extraordinary and welcome event that is not explicable by natural or scientific laws and is therefore attributed to a divine agency.
You can shut the mouth of bear or tiger - dont know if i would call this an extraordinary and welcome event that is not explicable by natural or scientific laws and is therefore attributed to a divine agency. Be my friend an md argue for this miracle
You can ride a lion - dont know if i would call this an extraordinary and welcome event that is not explicable by natural or scientific laws and is therefore attributed to a divine agency.
You can play with the cobra - dont know if i would call this an extraordinary and welcome event that is not explicable by natural or scientific laws and is therefore attributed to a divine agency.
You can make a living by alchemy - wanna go anywhere with this one?
You can wander through the world incognito - having one's true identity concealed.- dont know if i would call this an extraordinary and welcome event that is not explicable by natural or scientific laws and is therefore attributed to a divine agency.
You can make vassals of the gods - a holder of land by feudal tenure on conditions of homage and allegiance with gods.
You can be ever youthful - that i would call a miracle but due to ageing seems unlikely. Christians would drem this as vanity.
You can walk on water - Jesus did that!!!!
You can live in fire - brother how are things anyway?
You can achieve all Siddhis at home - complete understanding; enlightenment - enlightment - blow put the candle - no action.
But to control the mind is rare and difficult - its called discpline my hindu friend - not directed to you but figuratively to the author.
There are only 2 miracles that a similar to Christianity ie walk on water and healing the sick. These 2 may be due to a christian influence on hinduism. There is a tradition that Thomas got to India.
According to scholars, the Visuddhimagga is one of the extremely rare texts within the enormous literatures of various forms of Jainism, Buddhism, and Hinduism to give explicit details about how spiritual masters were thought to actually manifest supernormal abilities.
Abilities such as flying through the air, walking through solid obstructions, diving into the ground, walking on water and so forth are performed by changing one element, such as earth, into another element, such as air.
Visuddhimagga. The Visuddhimagga (Pali; English The Path of Purification), is the 'great treatise' on Theravada Buddhist doctrine written by Buddhaghosa approximately in the 5th Century in Sri Lanka.
My friend 400 years after Christ. These miracles seems debatable to me and with exception to 2, are not similar to christian miracles.
My dear if you are convinced then subscribe to it. Im not convinced so i wont. I have already had my experiences with God and got the proof.
Exodus 23:13 ESV / 94 helpful votes
“Pay attention to all that I have said to you, and make no mention of the names of other gods, nor let it be heard on your lips.
Isaiah 44:6 ESV / 88 helpful votes
Thus says the Lord, the King of Israel and his Redeemer, the Lord of hosts: “I am the first and I am the last; besides me there is no god.
Deuteronomy 6:14 ESV / 86 helpful votes
You shall not go after other gods, the gods of the peoples who are around you—
John 14:6 ESV / 70 helpful votes
Jesus said to him, “I am the way, and the truth, and the life. No one comes to the Father except through me.
Im 100% certain of God. I know Him and He knows me. I subscribe to what He says. Whether these gods exist or not, iam to only praise Him.
I cannot stop you friend, If you like what you read and hear about hinduism.
Im aware of the vedas but have not read them and do not have any intention to do so. Im aware of its subject matter and have google at my disposal.
What makes the vedas a better read than the Bible and a better contender for your salvation?
What testimonies are you aware of?
My dear, Who are we trying to convince here?
Im curious. Are you thinking about becoming a hindu? Do you believe in miracles?
Why are you trying argue for something you dont believe in? Do you have doubt in your atheist position? Or have you a presumption that all religions are the same?
My dear The early and first christian church was made up of Jews!!
The 12 disciples, the 120, the 5000 and so on.
Messianic Jews accept Jesus and keep the Law. There are Jews who accept christ my dear.
My friend you are jumping the gun here. You must wait till we are down with the first section.
Unless you feel we are done? (I do not)
I have had experiences with God through the christian formula.
Was it luck, coincidence, or destiny. I do not know and how can i know out of which 3. I found God, got my proof and thats all that matters.
I got my proof for a Christian God, why should i consider any other god if im 100% certain of the Christian God?
Ps
If i was born non christian and never knew God? Would you like me to speculate?
Hinduism - reincarnation, karma. 3 schools of thought. Lets look at the modern one.
Brahman connotes the highest Universal Principle, theUltimate Reality in the universe.
Brahman is a key concept found in the Vedas, and it is extensively discussed in the earlyUpanishads.The Vedas conceptualize Brahman as the Cosmic Principle
Brahman is discussed in Hindu texts with the concept of Atman (Soul, Self),personal impersonal or Para Brahman, or in various combinations of these qualities depending on the philosophical school.
In Hindu cosmology, the universe is cyclically created and destroyed. Its cosmology divides time into four epochs or Yuga, of which the current period is the Kali Yuga.
I do not believe in karma. I believe in the odds!
Islam - submit to the words of allah as revealed by mohammad. Next subject. Dont forget my friend, the jews reject islam too.
Buhuddism - enlightment, release from karma to nirvana. No action, no desire, no attachmemt = nothing. Bhuddism does not convince me at all and i think it is a hindu loophole or heresy ie escape the wheel.
Christianity teaches us who the Creator is and what He wants from.us. Amen!!!!!
Jesus Christ offers real hope. He gives mankind the opportunity to become right with God and his fellowman. Thus Christianity offers a full life to those who will accept Jesus: “I am come that they might have life, and that they might have it abundantly” (John 10:10, KJV).
The grace offered us, through our profession of faith in Christ, changes everything! There are five terms that describe what Christianity offers: (1) justification, (2) redemption, (3) reconciliation, (4) forgiveness, and (5) sonship. Hallelujah!!!!
All injustices will be judged by God, God offers you a purpose in your life, God offers a reward and God offers love, hope and faith.
Jeremiah 29:11
For I know the plans I have for you," says the Lord. “They are plans for good and not for disaster, to give you a future and a hope.
Matthew 11:28-29
“Come to me, all you who are weary and burdened, and I will give you rest. Take my yoke upon you and learn from me, for I am gentle and humble in heart, and you will find rest for your souls.
Isaiah 40:29-31
He gives power to the weak
and strength to the powerless.
Even youths will become weak and tired,
and young men will fall in exhaustion.
But those who trust in the Lord will find new strength.
They will soar high on wings like eagles.
They will run and not grow weary.
They will walk and not faint.
Philippians 4:19
And this same God who takes care of me will supply all your needs from his glorious riches, which have been given to us in Christ Jesus.
Romans 8:37-39
No, despite all these things, overwhelming victory is ours through Christ, who loved us.
And I am convinced that nothing can ever separate us from God’s love. Neither death nor life, neither angels nor demons, neither our fears for today nor our worries about tomorrow—not even the powers of hell can separate us from God’s love. No power in the sky above or in the earth below—indeed, nothing in all creation will ever be able to separate us from the love of God that is revealed in Christ Jesus o
Proverbs 1:33
But all who listen to me will live in peace,
untroubled by fear of harm."
John 14:27
“I am leaving you with a gift—peace of mind and heart. And the peace I give is a gift the world cannot give. So don’t be troubled or afraid.
Romans 10:9
If you confess with your mouth that Jesus is Lord and believe in your heart that God raised him from the dead, you will be saved.
Romans 6:23
For the wages of sin is death, but the free gift of God is eternal life through Christ Jesus our Lord.
The core meaning of Christianity is different to all religions my dear. All religions assert something different to christianity.
Christian core.
Man is born under sin. Man needs to be reconciled to God. God sent His only Son to atone for our sins so we may have a relationship with God through Jesus Christ by the Holy Spirit.
In order to know if im correct or right one must follow the formula. If those other religions are more convincing than Christianity why are you an atheist my dear?
Why does your belief system revolve around a disbelief in the Christian God?
Why do you discuss the non existance of a God who does not exist?
Fair enough my friend
The scientific method will not show you God - not a thing ij the universe. The Christian formula will.
My friend you will always have uncertainity in yoir life (like you said can not be 100% certain of anything). You will have to rely on the observations and thoughts of other men as your authority, instead of experiencing it for your self.
Im curious. As an atheist do you go to bhuddist, islam and hindu forums?
If i got the evidence from one religion, why do i need to seek it from another religion?
My dear, this is a false arguement. You do not know me or what i have done in my life. I would advise we leave our opinions of each other out if this discussion.
Brother, your last remark seems to attack my character or personal traits in an attempt to undermine my argument.
Could we please keep this civil, fun and polite. There is no need to for this type of behaviour my friend.
Looking forward to your polite reply. Cheers
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